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#3118567 - 01/10/13 09:49 PM Re: Biden Hints Outlawing ´Private´ Gun sales [Re: Hunter 257W]
de novo
10 Point


Registered: 07/21/08
Posts: 4032
Loc: Middle TN

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 Originally Posted By: Hunter 257W
I wonder how Mr. joe forbiden is going to accomplish these mandatory background checks for private gun sales. The FBI NICs database can't be accessed by anybody who does not have a Federal Firearms License. I suppose he wants every sale to go through an FFL holder? If that's mr. forbiden's plan then I suppose that, along with the call to the NIC's people, there would also be a new form 4473 filled out and kept with the records the FFL holder has for their new gun sales? How is he going to possibly enforce this?


This is the part where they are trying to appeal to Walmart and other gun vendors. They are trying to pressure the stores to support this registration in exchange for increased customers that would then be forced to purchase guns through the stores. Very similar to how they used the AMA and AARP in photo ops supporting Obamacare.

I believe the push this time will be for registration in an to attempt to find out where as many of the weapons of the law abiding, patriotic Americans are located. then they can use the next mass shooting as an excuse to start confiscation in the near future.
_________________________
“Reality is what continues to exist whether you believe in it or not.” 

“The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it.”

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#3118630 - 01/10/13 11:01 PM Re: Biden Hints Outlawing ´Private´ Gun sales [Re: de novo]
Dale3
8 Point


Registered: 09/14/03
Posts: 1501
Loc: Live in Mt.Juliet ,Hunt Jackso...

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I want to hear Obiden Answer the questions HOW and WHY this will do ANYTHING to prevent these shootings?
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#3118680 - 01/11/13 02:54 AM Re: Biden Hints Outlawing ´Private´ Gun sales [Re: Dale3]
Locksley
16 Point


Registered: 10/23/01
Posts: 19744
Loc: Antioch TN

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We must stand and be heard. The 2nd Amendment was not written to protect hunting. It was not written so that people could possess antique firearms. It was written so that ALL men could be armed. This was both for preservation of Liberty and our Country.

Some quotes from a few of our founding fathers on the matter:

Do not separate text from historical background. If you do you will have perverted and subverted the Constitution. - James Madison

Americans have the right and advantage of being armed--unlike the citizens of other countries whose governments are afraid to trust the people with arms. - James Madison

A well regulated militia, composed of the whole body of the people, trained in arms, is the best most natural defense of a free country. - James Madison

To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them. - George Madison

The greatest tyrannies are always perpetuated in the name of the noblest causes. - Thomas Paine

Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples’ liberty’s teeth. - George Washington

To be prepared for war is one of the most effectual means of preserving peace. - George Washington

When firearms go, all go. We need them every hour. - George Washington

The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference--they deserve a place of honor with all that is good. - George Washington

No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. - Thomas Jefferson

The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government. - Thomas Jefferson

The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the Constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first. - Thomas Jefferson

What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the Spirit of Resistance. - Thomas Jefferson

Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty. - Thomas Jefferson

Laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants. - Thomas Jefferson

Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both. - Benjamin Franklin

The Constitution is not an instrument for the gov’t to restrain the people. It is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-lest it come to dominate our lives and interests. - Patrick Henry

The great object is that every man be armed. - Patrick Henry

Those that hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not. - Patrick Henry

Every citizen should be a soldier. This was the case with the Greeks and Romans, and must be that of every free state. - Thomas Jefferson

It is always dangerous to the liberties of the people to have an army stationed among them, over which they have no control ... The Militia is composed of free Citizens. There is therefore no danger of their making use of their Power to the destruction of their own Rights, or suffering others to invade them. - Samuel Adams

The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions, that I wish it always to be kept alive. - Thomas Jefferson

When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. - Thomas Jefferson

Among the natural rights of the colonists are these: first, a right to life; secondly, to liberty; thirdly to property; together with the right to support and defend them in the best manner they can. - Samuel Adams

I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than those attending too small a degree of it. - Thomas Jefferson

The said constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms. - Samuel Adams

Hmmmm... gee I wonder what the MEN WHO WROTE THE 2ND AMENDMENT really intended when they penned it? Certainly they meant that the government should possess unlimited power over all weapons and should have the ability to regulate and limit any type of weapons they see fit in order to prevent normal citizens from possessing such evil things. Yeah, that's it...

Oh wait...

James Madison was the primary author of the Bill of Rights, is known as the "Father of the Constitution" for his central role in its formation, and was one of three authors of the Federalist Papers, a group of essays published in newspapers and books to explain and lobby for ratification of the Constitution.

In Federalist Paper 46, James Madison addressed the concern that a standing federal army might conduct a coup to take over the nation. He argued that this was implausible because, based on the country's population at the time, a federal standing army couldn't field more than 25,000-30,000 men. He then wrote:

To these would be opposed a militia amounting to near half a million of citizens with arms in their hands, officered by men chosen from among themselves, fighting for their common liberties, and united and conducted by governments possessing their affections and confidence.

Besides the advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation, the existence of subordinate governments, to which the people are attached, and by which the militia officers are appointed, forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition, more insurmountable than any which a simple government of any form can admit of. Notwithstanding the military establishments in the several kingdoms of Europe, which are carried as far as the public resources will bear, the governments are afraid to trust the people with arms.

The Father of our Constitution wanted every man to be armed and ready for defense of our Liberty against any enemy. Period.

Do your own research on what our Founding Fathers actually wrote OTHER than the Constitution if you want to REALLY know what they thought about government powers and arms.

Limiting access to firearms will never restrain evil that is intent on staying it's course. The problem lies within our society and how we limit morality and do not teach tolerance and respect for people. We have become a society of sheep, distracted by politics and entertained en masse while our government strips our liberties in front of our very eyes and with our permission.
_________________________
To know wisdom and instruction; to perceive the words of understanding;"The greatest pain a man can suffer is to have knowledge of much, and power over nothing" - Herodotus

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#3118698 - 01/11/13 04:59 AM Re: Biden Hints Outlawing ´Private´ Gun sales [Re: Dale3]
MUP
Non-Typical


Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 46480
Loc: Just North of Chatt-town

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 Originally Posted By: Dale3
I want to hear Obiden Answer the questions HOW and WHY this will do ANYTHING to prevent these shootings?


This one thing you WILL NOT hear from them. They do not have to justify ANY legislation apparently, just WIN the election with ignorant voters, and do as they please.
_________________________
MUP

Amateurs: Built the Ark

Professionals: Built the Titanic

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#3118702 - 01/11/13 05:06 AM Re: Biden Hints Outlawing ´Private´ Gun sales [Re: MUP]
Crappie Luck Moderator
Non-Typical


Registered: 01/29/03
Posts: 62020
Loc: Smith Co.

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This is as coherent as Biden will ever get on the issue:

Vice President Joe Biden on Thursday compared restrictions on guns to auto safety regulations such as air bags, by saying neither the gun nor the auto industries wanted regulations to save lives. “Well they didn’t want to have air bags. Well, guess what? We have air bags. We’re saving lives,”
_________________________
"To find out who your real rulers are, simply look to those whom you CANNOT criticize..."
--Voltaire

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#3118771 - 01/11/13 06:42 AM Re: Biden Hints Outlawing ´Private´ Gun sales [Re: Crappie Luck]
MUP
Non-Typical


Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 46480
Loc: Just North of Chatt-town

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Crappie Luck
This is as coherent as Biden will ever get on the issue:

Vice President Joe Biden on Thursday compared restrictions on guns to auto safety regulations such as air bags, by saying neither the gun nor the auto industries wanted regulations to save lives. “Well they didn’t want to have air bags. Well, guess what? We have air bags. We’re saving lives,”


Maybe that quote should be turned around to insist that the people actually HAVE guns to save lives then. ;\)
_________________________
MUP

Amateurs: Built the Ark

Professionals: Built the Titanic

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#3118777 - 01/11/13 06:48 AM Re: Biden Hints Outlawing ´Private´ Gun sales [Re: MUP]
Rebel
TnDeer Old Timer
12 Point


Registered: 03/16/99
Posts: 5400
Loc: East Tennessee USA

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Civil disobedience! 'Deo Duce Vincemus
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Good night Chesty, wherever you are!

Tolerance is a virtue of those who believe in nothing.

Deo Vindice

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#3118813 - 01/11/13 07:15 AM Re: Biden Hints Outlawing ´Private´ Gun sales [Re: MUP]
Dale3
8 Point


Registered: 09/14/03
Posts: 1501
Loc: Live in Mt.Juliet ,Hunt Jackso...

Offline
 Originally Posted By: MUP
 Originally Posted By: Dale3
I want to hear Obiden Answer the questions HOW and WHY this will do ANYTHING to prevent these shootings?


This one thing you WILL NOT hear from them. They do not have to justify ANY legislation apparently, just WIN the election with ignorant voters, and do as they please.


Whats worse, no one will even ASK these questions.
These questions should never stopped being asked to show this like the worthless useless pointless trash it is.


Edited by Dale3 (01/11/13 07:44 AM)

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#3118942 - 01/11/13 09:02 AM Re: Biden Hints Outlawing ´Private´ Gun sales [Re: Dale3]
Pic IN the Casa
TurdFarmer2.0
16 Point


Registered: 03/18/11
Posts: 10072
Loc: TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Dale3
I want to hear Obiden Answer the questions HOW and WHY this will do ANYTHING to prevent these shootings?


Exactly.
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Tolerance now means OBEY!!!!


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#3118992 - 01/11/13 09:24 AM Re: Biden Hints Outlawing ´Private´ Gun sales [Re: de novo]
Hunter 257W
10 Point


Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 3522
Loc: Franklin County

Offline
 Originally Posted By: de novo
 Originally Posted By: Hunter 257W
I wonder how Mr. joe forbiden is going to accomplish these mandatory background checks for private gun sales. The FBI NICs database can't be accessed by anybody who does not have a Federal Firearms License. I suppose he wants every sale to go through an FFL holder? If that's mr. forbiden's plan then I suppose that, along with the call to the NIC's people, there would also be a new form 4473 filled out and kept with the records the FFL holder has for their new gun sales? How is he going to possibly enforce this?


This is the part where they are trying to appeal to Walmart and other gun vendors. They are trying to pressure the stores to support this registration in exchange for increased customers that would then be forced to purchase guns through the stores. Very similar to how they used the AMA and AARP in photo ops supporting Obamacare.

I believe the push this time will be for registration in an to attempt to find out where as many of the weapons of the law abiding, patriotic Americans are located. then they can use the next mass shooting as an excuse to start confiscation in the near future.


Yeah, it sounds like they are wanting every purchase to require the services of a FFL holder much like it already does if you buy a gun on-line and have it shipped to you through the FFL holder. The only way this would work though is for the government to keep records of(register) every firearm in the country so they know who is suppsed to have what and then do periodic spot checks? But they don't that kind of man power. And it all goes back to your last comment, it sets the stage for a total confiscation.

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