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#3106517 - 01/02/13 07:24 PM Dog Problem!
Drop 4/5
6 Point


Registered: 06/23/09
Posts: 667
Loc: Morgan Co.

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For this past season I have seen a decrease in cam pics and actual deer sightings. I have a neighbor who continues to let 2-3 of his 20 plus dogs run wild every morning and of course they end up running deer on my property. I consider him a friend and addressed this many times and it seems he keeps them in when he knows Im hunting but the way I see it the damage is done! I originally requested that the dogs stay put up from October to January but for some reason he has mistaken my kindness for weakness. I recently told him that I had some coyote sightings on the cams and would need to put out some traps which seem to raise some concerns on his part.. He said they would need to be checked every 24 hrs and I told him that was not an option. I have numerous cam pics with his dogs urinating on my feeders and trophy rocks. Need some advise on how to handle this with out losing our friendship since im not on the property full time. And just an FYI He is a retired Attorney!

Thanks for any input
Ron
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"Common Sense" it's not so common anymore

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#3106536 - 01/02/13 07:32 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Drop 4/5]
Diehard Hunter
CRAMP
12 Point


Registered: 08/01/08
Posts: 6812
Loc: East Tennessee

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Refer your attorney neighbor to Tennessee Code 44-8-408. then call animal control. That is a State law, not a local ordinance.

(b) The owner of a dog commits an offense if that dog goes uncontrolled by the owner upon the premises of another without the consent of the owner of the premises or other person authorized to give consent, or goes uncontrolled by the owner upon a highway, public road, street or any other place open to the public generally.
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The recreational value of a game animal is inverse to the artificiality of its origin and the intensiveness of the management system that produced it. Aldo Leopold


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#3106542 - 01/02/13 07:33 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Drop 4/5]
Dr2kill
TnDeer Old Timer
10 Point


Registered: 01/20/00
Posts: 3822
Loc: Andersonville, TN

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Remind him that Tennessee does have a leash law.
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Never give in
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#3106551 - 01/02/13 07:36 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Diehard Hunter]
BARhunter
8 Point


Registered: 11/14/05
Posts: 1249
Loc: Franklin County

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 Originally Posted By: Diehard Hunter
Refer your attorney neighbor to Tennessee Code 44-8-408. then call animal control. That is a State law, not a local ordinance.

(b) The owner of a dog commits an offense if that dog goes uncontrolled by the owner upon the premises of another without the consent of the owner of the premises or other person authorized to give consent, or goes uncontrolled by the owner upon a highway, public road, street or any other place open to the public generally.


Ditto!
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Take care of God's creatures and you will be rewarded!

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#3106565 - 01/02/13 07:38 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Diehard Hunter]
Drop 4/5
6 Point


Registered: 06/23/09
Posts: 667
Loc: Morgan Co.

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Thanks DH that should be a good start. I have animals of my own that stay locked up always when im on the property. I know most of my neighbors and hunting buddys say shot em but im trying my best to stay away from that but after getting up at 5 sitting from 6-9 watching deer in the plot and at 910 here come the dogs and the am hunt is done! gets pretty frustrating.

Ron
_________________________
"Common Sense" it's not so common anymore

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#3106581 - 01/02/13 07:43 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Drop 4/5]
cecil30-30
16 Point


Registered: 12/05/06
Posts: 14155
Loc: Morgan Co

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I feel your pain Ron,I had the same issue a few years back,just one season it stopped,not sure what happend.But I know who your talking about.My only solution would be SSS,but its your property and your neighbor,so if SSS isn't an option for you,you might just have to get very blunt with him. George my uncle had some issues with his dogs.A whole pack of his dogs jumped Georges and almost killed it.And you know who,didn't have much to say about it.Best of luck to you Ron.
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The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." -Thomas Jefferson


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#3106586 - 01/02/13 07:45 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: cecil30-30]
cecil30-30
16 Point


Registered: 12/05/06
Posts: 14155
Loc: Morgan Co

Offline
I stand corrected Ron,asked my parents and they said his dogs killed Georges dog,ended up bleeding out.
_________________________
The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." -Thomas Jefferson


Ban Liberals!!! Save America!!!!

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#3106606 - 01/02/13 07:49 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: cecil30-30]
DaveB
10 Point


Registered: 09/03/08
Posts: 4029
Loc: Shelby County

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The legal way is the only way you can be successful. If he is a lawyer, he should know that he is ultimately liable if one of the dogs attacks someone.

Maybe there is a limit on how many dogs a person can have in your county?

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#3106614 - 01/02/13 07:51 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: DaveB]
Deer Assassin
Non-Typical


Registered: 08/01/03
Posts: 87003
Loc: Kingston Springs

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shoot them
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Spending money I dont have

on things I dont need

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#3106630 - 01/02/13 07:56 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: DaveB]
scn
14 Point


Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 9934
Loc: Brentwood, TN US

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If you were serious about the trapping part, you may want to read TCA 70-4-120. It requires your traps to be run at least every 36 hours, prohibits on top of the ground sets unless using cushion jaw, and makes the trapper liable for any damages to any person's dog caught in the trap.
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Life is too short to fish with a dead cricket.

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#3106635 - 01/02/13 07:57 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Deer Assassin]
Drop 4/5
6 Point


Registered: 06/23/09
Posts: 667
Loc: Morgan Co.

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Yea your right Cecil, The bad thing is my wife and I were over there at WC house and one of his dogs bit her and we had to go to the ER in Jamestown. The Fentress county sheriffs showed up and I said I didnt know whos dog it was! I had other options but thats not how I operate. You would have thought that incident alone would have bought me some credibility. Then one of his dogs bit my friends dog on our property when we were walking in the woods. Like I said he has mistaken my kindness for weakness
_________________________
"Common Sense" it's not so common anymore

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#3106650 - 01/02/13 08:03 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: cecil30-30]
Happy Birthday WestTn Huntin'man
16 Point


Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 11982
Loc: Benton Co.

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It will be hard to stop the dogs with out making him get mad.From Cecil 30-30 's post it sounds like other neighbors are having problems with them also.If they killed someone's dog He should be held responsible. If all the neighbors complain to the sheriffs office they should be able to come out and talk to him about multiple complaints.
Set some live traps and turn them in to the pound with the owners name.Hitting him in the pocket book will hurt the worst.
Obviously The correct thing would be for him to put up a good fence. Good fences make good neighbors.

After your last post I don't see that you have but one option after multiple attacks of dogs and people. Let a dog run wild and they will turn wild.


Edited by WestTn Huntin'man (01/02/13 08:06 PM)
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Proverbs 3:27 Whenever you possibly can, do good to those who need it

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#3106660 - 01/02/13 08:07 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: scn]
AndyW
10 Point


Registered: 10/21/10
Posts: 4382
Loc: Allardt, TN

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Neighbor if I can somehow be helpful to you, let me know.
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This fall, FIRE THEM ALL. Re-elect NO ONE!!!!!

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#3106662 - 01/02/13 08:09 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: WestTn Huntin'man]
Happy Birthday WestTn Huntin'man
16 Point


Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 11982
Loc: Benton Co.

Offline
The ER visit should be turned in on the owners home owners insurance policy . I've had to pay up when a dog bit a neighbor.
_________________________
Proverbs 3:27 Whenever you possibly can, do good to those who need it

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#3106670 - 01/02/13 08:13 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: AndyW]
Drop 4/5
6 Point


Registered: 06/23/09
Posts: 667
Loc: Morgan Co.

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Thanks Andy, Im just trying to do the right thing! I know I had some options with the bite to my wife but there are not many neighbors up our way so I didnt want to go in that direction from the get go!

Ron
_________________________
"Common Sense" it's not so common anymore

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#3106673 - 01/02/13 08:14 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: WestTn Huntin'man]
dralarms
6 Point


Registered: 12/23/12
Posts: 875
Loc: athens, tn

content Online
I've killed one dog around here, she was chasing my cat and when the cat ran under the van I though she was gonna tear the bumper off. I shot her and then went to the owner and told him I was sorry but I thought she was gonna tear into one of my grand kids next.

He wasn't happy but that was the last I heard from him, or any more of his dogs. If I see one all I got to do is yell and tell them to go home now. This one was not listening.

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#3106764 - 01/02/13 08:48 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: scn]
Woodson223
8 Point


Registered: 12/11/12
Posts: 2221
Loc: tn

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I am having the same problem not sure how to handle it.
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#3106827 - 01/02/13 09:21 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Woodson223]
utfan1
10 Point


Registered: 12/31/06
Posts: 4087
Loc: cleveland,tn

Offline
in the 90's i had dum neighbors that let a vicious dog run loose all the time . the dog tried to bite me numerous times and i argued with the neighbors about the problem., they accused me of doing something to the mutt and my last resort was the police.
sheriffs deputy said nothing could be done and i told her i was going to shoot the animal the next time it attaacked me or a family member . the deputy said if i didnt have bite wounds off to jail i would go......we sold the house and moved ....about 6 months after i moved the dog mauled a child and had to be put down............i still dislike that woman......

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#3106844 - 01/02/13 09:27 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: utfan1]
dralarms
6 Point


Registered: 12/23/12
Posts: 875
Loc: athens, tn

content Online
Utfan,

The cop was wrong. I was told that if the dog is viscous and it had been documented ( his visit was the documentation I needed). I was allowed to do what I had to do to protect my family.

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#3106864 - 01/02/13 09:38 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: dralarms]
utfan1
10 Point


Registered: 12/31/06
Posts: 4087
Loc: cleveland,tn

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yeah , it was a bad deal. morons that let their dogs run loose tick me off.
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#3106873 - 01/02/13 09:44 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: utfan1]
dralarms
6 Point


Registered: 12/23/12
Posts: 875
Loc: athens, tn

content Online
 Originally Posted By: utfan1
yeah , it was a bad deal. morons that let their dogs run loose tick me off.


Yep, the man behind me used to raise pit bulls, that was until I found the whole litter on my front porch tormenting my cats.

Walked it the house and got my 9 shot 22, rat shot mind you, and nailed all of them. 2 hours later I could still hear them whimpering, told the old codger that next time would be with a 38.

Haven't seen any of his dogs since.

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#3107413 - 01/03/13 10:24 AM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: scn]
Lost Lake
6 Point


Registered: 11/17/12
Posts: 732
Loc: Middle Tn

Offline
I wasn't aware of a law that states trapping on your own property makes the landowner/trapper responsible for damages to a trespassing dog whose owners are in violation of the leash laws. Not argueing, not a trapper and just didn't know that. Seems to me that there are some major conflicts concerning leash laws and what dogs are allowed to do. Absolutely amazes me.

The OP says that his neighbor is an attorney, and as such, ought to know better. If it was me, I would use the law to the utmost extent that I could to make him control his animals. As an attorney, he should understand that.

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#3107543 - 01/03/13 11:57 AM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: utfan1]
7mm08
12 Point


Registered: 09/12/07
Posts: 5005
Loc: In a river hopefully!

Offline
I took this and 8 pictures from the multiple cameras we have on the property and told the policeman from the county that either they can pay the $1600 ($200 per dog per day fine) or keep the dogs up. Dogs are gone.


There is a statewide leash law in TN. Start with the sheriff's department. I found this on the web. It seems to me that if the sheriff will not or can't do anything about it the DA might.

http://www.michie.com/tennessee/lpext.dll?f=templates&fn=main-h.htm&cp=tncode

44-8-408. Dogs not allowed at large — Exception — Penalties. —

(a) As used in this section, unless the context otherwise requires, “owner” means a person who, at the time of the offense, regularly harbors, keeps or exercises control over the dog, but does not include a person who, at the time of the offense, is temporarily harboring, keeping or exercising control over the dog.

(b) The owner of a dog commits an offense if that dog goes uncontrolled by the owner upon the premises of another without the consent of the owner of the premises or other person authorized to give consent, or goes uncontrolled by the owner upon a highway, public road, street or any other place open to the public generally.

(c) It is an exception to the application of this section that:

(1) The dog was on a hunt or chase;

(2) The dog was on the way to or from a hunt or chase;

(3) The dog was guarding or driving stock or on the way to guard or drive stock;

(4) The dog was being moved from one place to another by the owner of the dog;

(5) The dog is a police or military dog, the injury occurred during the course of the dog's official duties and the person injured was a party to, a participant in or suspected of being a party to or participant in the act or conduct that prompted the police or military to utilize the services of the dog;

(6) The violation of subsection (b) occurred while the injured person was on the private property of the dog's owner with the intent to engage in unlawful activity while on the property;

(7) The violation of subsection (b) occurred while the dog was protecting the dog's owner or other innocent party from attack by the injured person or an animal owned by the injured person;

(8) The violation of subsection (b) occurred while the dog was securely confined in a kennel, crate or other enclosure; or

(9) The violation of subsection (b) occurred as a result of the injured person disturbing, harassing, assaulting or otherwise provoking the dog.

(d) The exception to the application of this section provided in subdivisions (c)(1)-(4) shall not apply unless the owner in violation of subsection (b) pays or tenders payment for all damages caused by the dog to the injured party within thirty (30) days of the damage being caused.

(e) It is not a defense to prosecution for a violation of subsection (b) and punished pursuant to subdivision (g)(1), (g)(2) or (g)(3) that the dog owner exercised reasonable care in attempting to confine or control the dog.

(f) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution for a violation of subsection (b) and punished pursuant to subdivision (g)(4) or (g)(5) that the dog owner exercised reasonable care in attempting to confine or control the dog.

(g) (1) A violation of this section is a Class C misdemeanor punishable by fine only.

(2) A violation of this section is a Class B misdemeanor punishable by fine only if the dog running at large causes damage to the property of another.

(3) A violation of this section is a Class A misdemeanor punishable by fine only if the dog running at large causes bodily injury, as defined by § 39-11-106, to another.

(4) A violation of this section is a Class E felony if the dog running at large causes serious bodily injury, as defined by § 39-11-106, to another.

(5) A violation of this section is a Class D felony if the dog running at large causes the death of another.

(h) Notwithstanding subsection (g), a violation of this section shall be punished as provided in subsection (i) if the violation involves:

(1) A dog that was trained to fight, attack or kill or had been used to fight; or

(2) The owner of the dog violating this section knew of the dangerous nature of the dog and, prior to the violation of this section, the dog had bitten one (1) or more people that resulted in serious bodily injury or death.

(i) A violation of this section, where one (1) or more of the factors set out in subsection (h) are present, shall be punished as follows:

(1) A Class C misdemeanor if the dog running at large does not cause property damage, injury or death;

(2) A Class A misdemeanor if the dog running at large causes damage to the property of another;

(3) A Class E felony if the dog running at large causes bodily injury to another;

(4) A Class D felony if the dog running at large causes serious bodily injury to another; and

(5) A Class C felony if the dog running at large causes the death of another.


[Acts 1901, ch. 50, § 1; 1903, ch. 419, § 1; Shan., § 2853a4; Code 1932, § 5086; T.C.A. (orig. ed.), §§ 44-1408, 44-8-108; Acts 2007, ch. 533, § 1; 2007, ch. 556, § 1.]


Edited by 7mm08 (01/03/13 12:02 PM)
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#3107554 - 01/03/13 12:04 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: scn]
Grizzly Johnson
Team Grizzly
16 Point


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 15248
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: scn
If you were serious about the trapping part, you may want to read TCA 70-4-120. It requires your traps to be run at least every 36 hours, prohibits on top of the ground sets unless using cushion jaw, and makes the trapper liable for any damages to any person's dog caught in the trap.


May be the law, but it's BS.... the dog shouldn't have been allowed on property that was owned by someone else other than the dog owner in the first place, without permission.
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But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

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#3108111 - 01/03/13 06:46 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
Drop 4/5
6 Point


Registered: 06/23/09
Posts: 667
Loc: Morgan Co.

Offline
Thanks for all the input. Gonna try the legal route first and then I may need to open a new season in Morgan County!

Ron
_________________________
"Common Sense" it's not so common anymore

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#3108140 - 01/03/13 07:06 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Drop 4/5]
William
TnDeer Old Timer
8 Point


Registered: 10/25/99
Posts: 1855
Loc: Kingston, TN

Offline
Just remember, there is nothing in that "leash law" that gives you authority to kill a dog. In the case of dogs attacking, you have the right to defend but impacting your deer hunting is not just cause. If you shoot the wrong dog you could be subject to thousands of dollars in a civil suit.
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#3109808 - 01/04/13 08:53 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: William]
Drop 4/5
6 Point


Registered: 06/23/09
Posts: 667
Loc: Morgan Co.

Offline
They have been aggressive before and I expect it to happen again!

Ron
_________________________
"Common Sense" it's not so common anymore

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#3109815 - 01/04/13 08:57 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Drop 4/5]
dralarms
6 Point


Registered: 12/23/12
Posts: 875
Loc: athens, tn

content Online
 Originally Posted By: Drop 4/5
They have been aggressive before and I expect it to happen again!

Ron


Once is all it takes to ruin your day, or life.

What kind of dogs?

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#3109819 - 01/04/13 09:00 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: dralarms]
William
TnDeer Old Timer
8 Point


Registered: 10/25/99
Posts: 1855
Loc: Kingston, TN

Offline
Then I suggest you contact your local law enforcement officer.
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#3109832 - 01/04/13 09:07 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: William]
Drop 4/5
6 Point


Registered: 06/23/09
Posts: 667
Loc: Morgan Co.

Offline
All kinds that he has rescued along the way which I respect him for that but he just needs to keep them on his property. Twenty something dogs last I checked. My wifes been bit once Strike One, Friends Dog been bit Strike two and they have been aggressive towards me during bow season strike three!

Ron
_________________________
"Common Sense" it's not so common anymore

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#3109872 - 01/04/13 09:24 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Drop 4/5]
William
TnDeer Old Timer
8 Point


Registered: 10/25/99
Posts: 1855
Loc: Kingston, TN

Offline
Have you recorded these attacks? Docomunted them for a lawyer? Medical records?

This isn't a TNDeer issue. It is a legal issue that you need to work with you local LEO and lawyer.

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#3109924 - 01/04/13 10:04 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: William]
BlackBelt
10 Point


Registered: 08/09/08
Posts: 3186
Loc: SouthWest TN

Offline
When i was a kid growing up in rural MS many dogs that ran loose just went missing.
Who knows where they ran off too...

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#3109937 - 01/04/13 10:14 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: BlackBelt]
William
TnDeer Old Timer
8 Point


Registered: 10/25/99
Posts: 1855
Loc: Kingston, TN

Offline
Legal nigthmare. If one of my dogs get's shot you will need a better lawyer than mine.
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#3109962 - 01/04/13 10:40 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: William]
BowGirl
6 Point


Registered: 07/20/09
Posts: 729
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
Its a shame some dont keep them where they are supposed to be like they are supposed to do. I wouldn't do that to my neighbor or my dog...or make excuses or blame others for MY actions.
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#3109999 - 01/04/13 11:32 PM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: BowGirl]
Happy Birthday WestTn Huntin'man
16 Point


Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 11982
Loc: Benton Co.

Offline
When dogs run wild in a pack they will go wild..
William do your dogs run loose terrorizing the neighborhood ??
My worst experence with dogs was in Smith county.Same type deal the dude rescued dogs kept them in a barn and let them run wild.I would come in before daylight and they would chase me to my parking spot .Then attempt to keep me in the car.Pepper spray and a good BB pistol taught them some respect.

I have met very few truely bad dogs. I have met a lot of bad owners.
I kept pepper spray with me all the time
_________________________
Proverbs 3:27 Whenever you possibly can, do good to those who need it

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#3110011 - 01/05/13 12:30 AM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Drop 4/5]
Chaneylake
Brownsville Mafia
16 Point


Registered: 12/18/07
Posts: 16577
Loc: on the wings of a snow white d...

Offline
SSS
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"Don't piss down my back and tell me its rain", Fletcher, Outlaw Josey Wales

Living somewhere between this world and the other, Legends of the Fall

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#3110013 - 01/05/13 12:48 AM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Chaneylake]
Lost Lake
6 Point


Registered: 11/17/12
Posts: 732
Loc: Middle Tn

Offline
This kind of thing just kills me. I deal with it on a weekly basis myself. If people would obey the LAW, and keep their dogs on their property. The kind of logic that states, "How dare you even think ill of my trespassing, harrsassing dogs " reminds me of the same line of reasoning that a burgaler can sue you if he gets hurt robbing your home. I would be so embarrassed if my dog was doing the things I've witnessed on my property that I'd look like an ostrich....hiding my head in shame.
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#3110014 - 01/05/13 12:56 AM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: Chaneylake]
Hoss
TnDeer Old Timer
8 Point


Registered: 02/14/00
Posts: 1465
Loc: Hendersonville , TN

Offline
My best dog story is the time I arrived at my hunting spot in the dark. I parked my truck on the road and opened the door so I could use the light to gather some stuff up to carry in. I had my leg hanging out the door and my foot just touching the ground. I was preoccupied with the gear on my front seat. I never heard a thing.... Then a very large black dog walked up to my truck and laid his head in my lap for a good ear scratching.... I screamed like a little girl and did the leg and arm flailing of a man in a spider web.

The dog just stood stood there looking at me all sad eyed and wondering why I screamed and started convulsions. All he wanted was his ears scratched.
_________________________
"The future of bowhunting depends on effective education"..... Bill Wadsworth

A mere shadow of the man I once was... Me!

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#3110186 - 01/05/13 09:04 AM Re: Dog Problem! [Re: William]
Backstrapcrazy
6 Point


Registered: 09/27/09
Posts: 874
Loc: powell , Tennessee

Offline
If dog is not on your Property,and is causing a problem. Bring the lawyer on, no worries here!
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