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#3097538 - 12/27/12 12:05 PM Re: Ron Paul RIPS NRA for plain of officers in school [Re: Wildcat]
de novo
10 Point


Registered: 07/21/08
Posts: 4028
Loc: Middle TN

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 Originally Posted By: Wildcat

 Originally Posted By: de novo
It is no surprise that those of you who feel the need for federal armed agents to protect you at the expense of your liberty would oppose anything Ron Paul proposes. School security is a state and even local issue.

Are you advocating for more TSA strip searches/ groping of elderly and children? Exactly, how many planes have been flown into buildings since the invention of planes?


Right here YOU were the first to post about anybody advocating to put TSA in the schools. YOU did that not me.


Please post where i advocated putting TSA in schools. you must have copied the wrong response because it's not in that one. To date you are one of the few to praise the TSA and their tactics. Capitalizing the word YOU still does not change what was posted.




 Originally Posted By: Wildcat

Attack me all you want and re-write history all you want but for God's sake please leave Ryan Paul alone. You all WILL kill any chance he has for higher office just like you killed his fathers chances.


For Pete's sake his name is RAND. But i will leave Ryan Paul or Paul Ryan or Rand Paul alone as long as they stand by the Constitution.
_________________________
“Reality is what continues to exist whether you believe in it or not.” 

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#3097598 - 12/27/12 12:58 PM Re: Ron Paul RIPS NRA for plain of officers in school [Re: TX300mag]
BMan
16 Point


Registered: 02/06/06
Posts: 10379
Loc: Middle TN

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 Originally Posted By: TX300mag
You see the federal government as the solution, I see it as the problem (specifically in the case of school security).

^^^ THIS ^^^
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#3097620 - 12/27/12 01:20 PM Re: Ron Paul RIPS NRA for plain of officers in school [Re: de novo]
Wildcat
Non-Typical


Registered: 06/10/00
Posts: 41913
Loc: Western Ky.

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 Originally Posted By: de novo
 Originally Posted By: Wildcat

 Originally Posted By: de novo
It is no surprise that those of you who feel the need for federal armed agents to protect you at the expense of your liberty would oppose anything Ron Paul proposes. School security is a state and even local issue.

Are you advocating for more TSA strip searches/ groping of elderly and children? Exactly, how many planes have been flown into buildings since the invention of planes?


]Right here YOU were the first to post about anybody advocating to put TSA in the schools. YOU did that not me.


Please post where i advocated putting TSA in schools. you must have copied the wrong response because it's not in that one. To date you are one of the few to praise the TSA and their tactics. Capitalizing the word YOU still does not change what was posted.




 Originally Posted By: Wildcat

Attack me all you want and re-write history all you want but for God's sake please leave Ryan Paul alone. You all WILL kill any chance he has for higher office just like you killed his fathers chances.


For Pete's sake his name is RAND. But i will leave Ryan Paul or Paul Ryan or Rand Paul alone as long as they stand by the Constitution.


I put them in bold letters where I said what YOU posted. I QUOTED it and you still cannot read it because you cannot see what you wrote.

Now YOU accuse me of "chopping", well that's a bald faced lie. I posted the WHOLE post YOU wrote. unlike your later posts where you CHOPPED the posts and only pulled out certain things from them.

Now YOU show the rest of us where I advoctaed putting TSA in the schools. YOU are the FIRST one to bring that up in YOUR first post. Simply go back to the first page and read.
_________________________
Obama, “the very danger the Constitution was designed to avoid." Liberal law professor Jonathan Turley.




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#3097626 - 12/27/12 01:23 PM Re: Ron Paul RIPS NRA for plain of officers in school [Re: de novo]
Wildcat
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Registered: 06/10/00
Posts: 41913
Loc: Western Ky.

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 Originally Posted By: de novo
It's makes for somewhat confusing but very comical reading for the forum's two most inept debaters to attempt to debate a topic that they are completely wrong on. To make it priceless is the fact that it was all started just to bash Ron Paul. Didn't work out so well for two reasons.

1. The proposed NRA solution has numerous flaws. It would be expensive, would be another federal program with the same problems as all federal programs, and the small fact that our country does not have a history of elementary school shootings. We have one terrible, isolated incident that, IMO, does not justify a change in national policy. I'm more than comfortable with my kids' elementary principal deciding to carry a Glock or have a group of a few teachers, coaches, parents, etc. trained and armed.

It has been estimated that the annual cost for placing an armed guard at every US elementary public school would be $25 billion. Based on our inefficient government, the actual cost would probably be 2-3 times that amount.

Let's say every elementary school is guarded tomorrow (right now, fast like Dale wants it), the next mass killer will simply pick a middle school, a private elementary school, a skating rink, or any number of soft targets. Using the NRA's logic, we would then need an armed guard at every ....

Thirty-three violent deaths occurred at elementary and secondary school schools between July 1, 2009 and June 30, 2010, either on campus, on the way to or from campus, or during a school event, according to a recent report produced jointly by the National Center for Education Statistics (NCES), Institute of Education Sciences, and the Bureau of Justice Statistics. These 33 deaths not only account for students, but also for staff members and others on school grounds, such as parents and intervening law enforcement officials, who were victims of homicide or suicide, the report clarifies.

While 33 school-related deaths in one year is 33 too many, this number is actually the lowest it's been since the report began tracking school violence in 1992. In 2006, the number of school-related deaths per year peaked at 63, the report shows. In fact, in-school homicides have consistently accounted for less than 2 percent of the total number of youth homicides nationwide for the years the report covers.



2. Second reason it didn't work out so well is because our two most inept posters are trying to defend a position.



 Originally Posted By: Wildcat
How many airplanes have been flown into buildings since TSA was put in in the airports??


The first mention of TSA in this thread. It appears as though this comment is insinuating that the presence of TSA has made our country safer.

 Originally Posted By: Wildcat

Who said anything about TSA doing it at the schools??? YOU did.


I don't see where anyone mentioned putting the TSA in schools. Even though the word "you" is capitalized, i still didn't do it.

 Originally Posted By: Dale3


The NRA's point was, lets do the right things NOW to protect our childern, then we can have the gun debates, laws,bans, who repnsibilty it is later,knowing it will drag on.
The NRA plan is about right NOW. Whats fastest and best for the children,sort the BS out later.
Right, let's just hurry up and pass a bill to protect the children. Just pass it and we can find out what's in it later. That sounds familiar...

 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
Ron's an idiot,always has been and always will be..
Please back up this profound statement or is this your only contribution to the thread. Feel free to back up your statement with Paul quotes, clips, etc. Or since you apparently agree with the NRA's plan you could lay that out for us.


 Originally Posted By: waynesworld
I think the federal leg can budget some for the implementation of more armed security in schools but I think like most things the states need to look at different ways to implement them. This would let states try to see what works and we can take data to see what works and what doesn't.
Thank you. That was the design of the Founders and our constitutional republic. Separate states to decide what was best for their citizens, not sweeping federal mandates from politicians to be monitored by bureacrats.

 Originally Posted By: BMan


Do you read what others post before you respond?

You got that straight yet??? or do I need to go slower?? My quote was specific and dealt with the TSA ONLY; well within the reading skills of any 7-year old 2nd grader.

If you can't grasp that, then quit responding to others' comments. Otherwise your comments sound inane - at best.
Welcome to a debate, wildcat style!


Here are some of the different posts YOU CHOPPED to suit your views.
_________________________
Obama, “the very danger the Constitution was designed to avoid." Liberal law professor Jonathan Turley.




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#3097662 - 12/27/12 01:52 PM Re: Ron Paul RIPS NRA for plain of officers in school [Re: TX300mag]
Dale3
8 Point


Registered: 09/14/03
Posts: 1238
Loc: Live in Mt.Juliet ,Hunt Jackso...

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 Originally Posted By: TX300mag
 Originally Posted By: Dale3
AS for WILDCAT, i have no controll over him, nore should i have. I never once brought up the TSA, and it has NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS POST! JUST AS YOU HAVe no contol over TX300MAG, i have NO CONTROLL OVER WILDCAT, NOR DO I CLAIM TO! I do not know him at all, and have never claimed to. his has his ideas! JUST AS TX300 MAG has his! I do not defend him as you do TX300mag! Not my fault TX300mag apposed the NRA before he ever even knew what their plan was! That was just stupid! Now your making yourself look stupid trying to defend stupid! The text in this thread PROVE TX300MAG WAS STUPID! they prove he had no idea what the nra plan IS!!!!!! OH THATS RIGHT ACT AS IF OU DONT KNOW THE TRUTH. go along with it! EVERYTHING TX300MAG claimed was wrong with the NRAS plan, is in thier PLAN!
TX30mag did NOT read, did not KNOW the NRA's plan. Proven not by me, but himself!!! he had ZERO idea of what it was!! ZERO IDEA!


Dale3, thank you for providing YOUR link. I had not read YOUR link in its entirety until you provided it for me.

Fortunately, there are other avenues of receiving news other than in your posts. Your post was NOT the first time NRA's plan has been revealed.




MUST have been the first time the NRA's plan was revealed to you, cause you were clueless what the plan was.Maybe you should use my post instead of these other avenues you speak of, sounds like they leave out alot or only tell you what you want to hear LOL
SO now there is DIFFERENT NRA PLANS OUT THERE? SO WHAT THE NRA RELEASED MORE THAN ONE STATEMENT OF THIER PLAN WITH DIFFERENT THINGS AND ENDINGS? PLEASE GIVE ME A BREAK!
Then you should have READ thier plan and knew what was in it before you went bashing it. YOU HAD NOT, AND DID NOT!

Even what YOU quoted from Wayne LaPierre you took out of context and cut it off.
SORRY unlike you i looked at the WHOLE statement and plan.
Your going to hit China pretty soon.

You know Wildcat was right, there are a couple of people in this forum who just cant get over Ron Paul and Ron paul mean more to them than this isssue.
I could care less it was Ron Paul, he HISTORY, as is Herman Cain, as is Mitt Romney.
I'm am outraged at ANYONE who would attack the NRA for being the ONLY ones TRYING to do the RIGHT THING and DOING IT NOW.
Whats worse so many of the reason those give attacking them here, are baseless reason like yourself and your rant it should be this or that and it was, it was in the plan, you were wanting to disagree BEFORE you EVEN knew what it was. Which proves no matter what it was you would disagree with it.
Theres no scary "massive federal power grab" to it! which is all you have left to cling to, now that you have bothered to actually READ the PLAN.
Its a very good plan. Its the best out there. If there was a better one, i'd be all for it, but theres not, and it does a very good job of keeping the federal government out of it as much as possible. Maybe its just me, but im pretty sure the NRA has always been for less federal government also!
The NRA did what is right, and the right way. Sit on your hands waiting for something better, dont rush into it. While doing so, the other side is going to dump a load of dodo in your lap, that you will never get out from under as they rush to seize the moment!
The REAL'MASSIVE FEDERAL POWER GRAB" you SHOULD be WORRIED ABOUT is the OTHER SIDE, the ANTI-gunners, because as i said while you sit on your hands, and think theres no need to rush, THEY ARE GOING TO CLEAN YOUR CLOCK as they DO and WILL and ARE RUSHING to SEIZE THIS MOMENT!


Edited by Dale3 (12/27/12 03:08 PM)

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#3097869 - 12/27/12 04:48 PM Re: Ron Paul RIPS NRA for plain of officers in school [Re: Dale3]
guthooked
4 Point


Registered: 08/10/08
Posts: 134
Loc: Gibbs

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I might be missing the point, but I thought this was about Ron Paul's failure to support the NRA/GOP agenda. Can you get back on track?
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#3097893 - 12/27/12 05:09 PM Re: Ron Paul RIPS NRA for plain of officers in school [Re: guthooked]
TX300mag
Pea Picker
14 Point


Registered: 11/10/02
Posts: 8884
Loc: Crosby, TX

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How is giving the federal government more power going to keep them from taking away our guns, Dale3?

I'm all for perching ninjas on top of every set of monkey bars and over every door way if that's what a particular school district wants to do.

Right now there is NOTHING stopping a school district from posting armed guards-many already do. I'm OK with that.

Why do we need the federal government telling our school districts what to do any more than they already do? I'm beginning to think you're missing the point altogether of why this is a bad idea.
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#3099185 - 12/28/12 03:33 PM Re: Ron Paul RIPS NRA for plain of officers in school [Re: TX300mag]
Dale3
8 Point


Registered: 09/14/03
Posts: 1238
Loc: Live in Mt.Juliet ,Hunt Jackso...

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 Originally Posted By: TX300mag
How is giving the federal government more power going to keep them from taking away our guns, Dale3?

I'm all for perching ninjas on top of every set of monkey bars and over every door way if that's what a particular school district wants to do.

Right now there is NOTHING stopping a school district from posting armed guards-many already do. I'm OK with that.

Why do we need the federal government telling our school districts what to do any more than they already do? I'm beginning to think you're missing the point altogether of why this is a bad idea.






No TX i get it. ALSO ,sorry for the "Stupid" comment,things got dirty, i got dirtier,crossed the line.
What i see though is that will be like spilled milk compared to what the left will do and are not wasting anytime to seize this moment. They have MUCH in thier favor right now. We cant wait, we cant bash our own.
I think the NRA's plan covers schools having the choice to do as much or as little as they want or what they want. It also includes volontiers. Oh love the "perching ninjas on top of every set of monkey bars" good one. I got that picture in my mind.

What the left will do to the 2nd Amendment and our rights, we will be wishing for the NRA's plan. Its not set in stone, the NRA doesnt like the fed anymore than you or i.
We need to win the popularity war right now. Bashing our own and who most evryone including the left look at as our voice(NRA), will only hurt us and we already have an up hill battle this time more than ever.
We have a major fight with them, we dont need to be fighting ourselves, this is going to be a very tuff fight this time, and with how things have gone latley for us, last thing we need to do is hurt ourselves on this one right now



Edited by Dale3 (12/28/12 04:03 PM)

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#3099300 - 12/28/12 05:18 PM Re: Ron Paul RIPS NRA for plain of officers in school [Re: Dale3]
TX300mag
Pea Picker
14 Point


Registered: 11/10/02
Posts: 8884
Loc: Crosby, TX

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Dale3, you're cool with me! I appreciate you and your zeal. Enjoy our discussions.
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