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#3068594 - 12/07/12 08:33 PM Should TN Go to All Weapons Season?
UTGrad
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Registered: 12/01/07
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Loc: Franklin, TN

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Should TN go to an all weapon season?

I say no

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#3068596 - 12/07/12 08:34 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: UTGrad]
Stalkhunter
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Registered: 07/17/11
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well i thought we were, bow a weapon, gun a weapon, or do you mean an all fire arm season?
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#3068615 - 12/07/12 08:42 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Stalkhunter]
Vermin93
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Registered: 12/11/10
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Loc: Dallas, TX & Signal Mtn, TN

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No way
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#3068621 - 12/07/12 08:44 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Vermin93]
lpo1981
6 Point


Registered: 01/20/12
Posts: 609
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Thought we had 1... Gun Season you can hunt with whatever you please. (Archery,Muzzleloader,Shotgun and Rifle)
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#3068624 - 12/07/12 08:45 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: lpo1981]
TX300mag
Pea Picker
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I want a spear season like Alabama! \:D
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#3068629 - 12/07/12 08:50 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: TX300mag]
cecil30-30
16 Point


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Yes have just a deer season. open on oct 1-JAN 1 And any weapon is legal but yoyou have a set number of deer allowwed to take.
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#3068631 - 12/07/12 08:51 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: cecil30-30]
muddyboots
12 Point


Registered: 11/06/02
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Heck naw
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#3068645 - 12/07/12 08:58 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: muddyboots]
mike243
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id vote it in,would vote for a 2 buck limit too if that was done
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#3068656 - 12/07/12 09:03 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: mike243]
huntintn
8 Point


Registered: 10/05/06
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negative, no,
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#3068673 - 12/07/12 09:09 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: huntintn]
Pinwheeled
4 Point


Registered: 09/19/11
Posts: 126
Loc: Nashville, TN

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NO
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#3068686 - 12/07/12 09:16 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Pinwheeled]
Vermin93
10 Point


Registered: 12/11/10
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Loc: Dallas, TX & Signal Mtn, TN

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2 straight months of blaze orange is enough already! No mas!
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#3068693 - 12/07/12 09:26 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Vermin93]
in the dog house!
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i think were fine like we are
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#3068721 - 12/07/12 09:45 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: in the dog house!]
TN Whitetail Freak
8 Point


Registered: 11/29/09
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Should be banned for mentioning it \:D

Edited by TN Whitetail Freak (12/07/12 09:46 PM)
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#3068726 - 12/07/12 09:49 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Vermin93]
cecil30-30
16 Point


Registered: 12/05/06
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 Originally Posted By: Vermin93
2 straight months of blaze orange is enough already! No mas!
Theres that elitiest bow hunting attitude rearing its ugly head again..
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#3068746 - 12/07/12 10:07 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: cecil30-30]
backstraps
12 Point


Registered: 09/19/03
Posts: 6781
Loc: NE Tennessee

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NO!
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#3068760 - 12/07/12 10:27 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: backstraps]
corymhoward
6 Point


Registered: 05/04/08
Posts: 872
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No way......I think we should mirror Kentucky
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#3068769 - 12/07/12 10:37 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: corymhoward]
Swamphunter
12 Point


Registered: 12/27/07
Posts: 6452
Loc: Munford, TN

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Absolutely NOT! And crossbows should be for the disabled and youth only.
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#3068800 - 12/07/12 11:16 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
corymhoward
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Registered: 05/04/08
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Agreed
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#3068811 - 12/07/12 11:27 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
Robtattoo
4 Point


Registered: 08/14/12
Posts: 205
Loc: Tullahoma, TN.

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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Absolutely NOT! And crossbows should be for the disabled and youth only.


X2
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#3068815 - 12/07/12 11:38 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Robtattoo]
southernhunter
8 Point


Registered: 09/08/10
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No , and I disagree with banning crossbows , cause if u go by that people who shoot recurves and long bows could say compounds are a unfair advantage ! Which they are if compared to a recurve same as comparing a compound to a crossbow . IMO .
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#3068821 - 12/08/12 12:01 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Pinwheeled]
cbcs1987
4 Point


Registered: 02/27/08
Posts: 361
Loc: east

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No.I love sitting in the quite woods during bow season before the November infantry comes out.

Obviously that's not a good reason to prevent it from happening.just stating why I wouldn't want it

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#3068896 - 12/08/12 06:31 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
pcrc
8 Point


Registered: 10/12/09
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Loc: Knoxville

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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Absolutely NOT! And crossbows should be for the disabled and youth only.

Never happen, it would be my guess having crossbows allowed sells a lot of archery permits.

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#3068919 - 12/08/12 07:03 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: pcrc]
Bowdacious
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No.
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#3068951 - 12/08/12 07:22 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Bowdacious]
Knothead
12 Point


Registered: 08/11/03
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NOOOOOOOOOO !!!!
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#3068966 - 12/08/12 07:32 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: southernhunter]
Swamphunter
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Registered: 12/27/07
Posts: 6452
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 Originally Posted By: southernhunter
No , and I disagree with banning crossbows , cause if u go by that people who shoot recurves and long bows could say compounds are a unfair advantage ! Which they are if compared to a recurve same as comparing a compound to a crossbow . IMO .


That tired old argument is not even valid. A compound bow is just a souped up recurve. Same range of motion. Same difficulty in getting drawn on a deer and holding for a shot. A crossbow is more like shooting a gun than a bow.

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#3068976 - 12/08/12 07:37 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
backstraps
12 Point


Registered: 09/19/03
Posts: 6781
Loc: NE Tennessee

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Id like TN mirror the northern neighbor's seasons. Have a week of shotgun and it would generally fall just post rut.

Bonus weekend and then a late season ML.
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#3068990 - 12/08/12 07:48 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
Beekeeper
Good ol' Boys "Team Buckcreek"
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Registered: 08/26/09
Posts: 11736
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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
 Originally Posted By: southernhunter
No , and I disagree with banning crossbows , cause if u go by that people who shoot recurves and long bows could say compounds are a unfair advantage ! Which they are if compared to a recurve same as comparing a compound to a crossbow . IMO .


That tired old argument is not even valid. A compound bow is just a souped up re-curve. Same range of motion. Same difficulty in getting drawn on a deer and holding for a shot. A crossbow is more like shooting a gun than a bow.
Are you trying to convince folks that Compound Bows do not give a hunter a distinct advantage over a Recurve or long Bow??

That is ridiculous!!

A compound with a 50%+ let-off allows an archer to hold at full draw longer and steadier.

If we want to get back to an archery season that would be a "pure archery season" then we would have to ban: crossbows, compounds, re-curves, sights, silencers, releases, mechanical broad-heads, carbon shafts, aluminum shafts, plastic fletching and any other advancement that would be an improvement on a long bow with cedar shafts fetched with feathers and tipped with a fixed blade broad-head that would be preferably knapped out of a piece of flint.
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#3069003 - 12/08/12 07:56 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Beekeeper]
Robtattoo
4 Point


Registered: 08/14/12
Posts: 205
Loc: Tullahoma, TN.

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 Originally Posted By: Beekeeper
 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
 Originally Posted By: southernhunter
No , and I disagree with banning crossbows , cause if u go by that people who shoot recurves and long bows could say compounds are a unfair advantage ! Which they are if compared to a recurve same as comparing a compound to a crossbow . IMO .


That tired old argument is not even valid. A compound bow is just a souped up re-curve. Same range of motion. Same difficulty in getting drawn on a deer and holding for a shot. A crossbow is more like shooting a gun than a bow.
Are you trying to convince folks that Compound Bows do not give a hunter a distinct advantage over a Recurve or long Bow??

That is ridiculous!!

A compound with a 50%+ let-off allows an archer to hold at full draw longer and steadier.

If we want to get back to an archery season that would be a "pure archery season" then we would have to ban: crossbows, compounds, re-curves, sights, silencers, releases, mechanical broad-heads, carbon shafts, aluminum shafts, plastic fletching and any other advancement that would be an improvement on a long bow with cedar shafts fetched with feathers and tipped with a fixed blade broad-head that would be preferably knapped out of a piece of flint.


Fine by me! ;\)
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#3069005 - 12/08/12 07:57 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Beekeeper]
Swamphunter
12 Point


Registered: 12/27/07
Posts: 6452
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Nobody said anything about "pure" archery. But a bow is a bow and a crossbow is like shooting a 50 yard gun. Completely different.
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#3069006 - 12/08/12 07:57 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: cecil30-30]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
Yes have just a deer season. open on oct 1-JAN 1 And any weapon is legal but yoyou have a set number of deer allowwed to take.


I've been advocating that for years, simply because I'm tired of hearing hunters argue over who should have the most hunting days, bow hunters versus gun hunters versus pistol hunters, etc.

Just make it deer season. Let hunters choose which weapon they want to hunt with.
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#3069010 - 12/08/12 08:00 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: backstraps]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 18645
Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN

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The only way this idea would be worthy of consideration would be if our buck limit (and possibly our doe limit in various units) were reduced to no more than 2 antlered deer annually.

Personally, I think the weapons season segments (archery-muzzleloader-centerfire)) are the best they've ever been, since there is no longer the confusing "switching" back and forth.

Any changes, imo, should be made in small increments, rather than a huge change such as allowing any weapon from September thru January. IMO, the next increment worthy of considering might be to allow shotguns (using slugs) during the muzzleloader season segment. And if that were implemented, I'd think a statewide 2-buck limit should come with it.

We need to also consider that currently the number of hunters is dwindling (along with the number of hours per hunter spent hunting annually), while the deer herd appears to be still expanding (in TN). This should allow for a little more firearm hunting opportunity, while a 2-buck limit may be needed to help facilitate an adequate doe harvest as well as meet the desires of those remaining hunters who would like to see continued improvement in herd quality.

At the same time, due to an expanding human population, many areas may be becoming "archery only" even during what would otherwise be a "rifle" deer season segment. So there will be growing opportunity for the elitist bowhunters, i.e. more WMA's like President's Island, and possibly some entire counties (Knox, Davidson, Shelby, Hamilton) becoming archery only for deer hunting per local ordinance.

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#3069018 - 12/08/12 08:06 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
Beekeeper
Good ol' Boys "Team Buckcreek"
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Registered: 08/26/09
Posts: 11736
Loc: McMinn Co. Tennessee

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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Nobody said anything about "pure" archery. But a bow is a bow and a crossbow is like shooting a 50 yard gun. Completely different.
I take it that you have never tried to hunt with a x-bow.
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#3069031 - 12/08/12 08:14 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Beekeeper]
stik
TnDeer Old Timer
18 Point


Registered: 03/12/99
Posts: 20311
Loc: lenoir city,tn

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 Originally Posted By: Beekeeper
 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Nobody said anything about "pure" archery. But a bow is a bow and a crossbow is like shooting a 50 yard gun. Completely different.
I take it that you have never tried to hunt with a x-bow.


a compound will outperform a crossbow much past 30 yds.
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#3069061 - 12/08/12 08:31 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: stik]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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Registered: 03/11/99
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 Originally Posted By: stik
 Originally Posted By: Beekeeper
 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Nobody said anything about "pure" archery. But a bow is a bow and a crossbow is like shooting a 50 yard gun. Completely different.
I take it that you have never tried to hunt with a x-bow.


a compound will outperform a crossbow much past 30 yds.


Exactly. Whenever I hear the "cross-gun" comment, I know that's a person who has never fired a high-quality crossbow. Their performance beyond 25 yards is well below that of a good compound.
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#3069087 - 12/08/12 08:47 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Swamphunter
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Registered: 12/27/07
Posts: 6452
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Never fired one. Don't intend to unless I become disabled. Just going by what I see at the archery range. Guys with scoped crossbows shooting very tight groups at 50 yards routinely.
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#3069091 - 12/08/12 08:50 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
Swamphunter
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Registered: 12/27/07
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Besides, the arguement is similarity to a gun. A bow hunter sees a deer he has to stand up, find a window to draw, hold, find a window to shoot. A crossbow shooter aims and pulls the trigger. Much like a gun.
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#3069093 - 12/08/12 08:52 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
Beekeeper
Good ol' Boys "Team Buckcreek"
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Registered: 08/26/09
Posts: 11736
Loc: McMinn Co. Tennessee

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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Never fired one. Don't intend to unless I become disabled. Just going by what I see at the archery range. Guys with scoped crossbows shooting very tight groups at 50 yards routinely.
I watch drivers drive cars around a track at 100+ mph "routinely" but that doesn't mean anyone can do it nor does it mean it is easy.
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#3069096 - 12/08/12 08:58 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Beekeeper]
UTGrad
14 Point


Registered: 12/01/07
Posts: 8275
Loc: Franklin, TN

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I like season the way it is currently. It's easy and straightforward. I'm very happy to be a hunter in TN.
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#3069100 - 12/08/12 09:01 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Beekeeper]
Swamphunter
12 Point


Registered: 12/27/07
Posts: 6452
Loc: Munford, TN

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 Originally Posted By: Beekeeper
 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Never fired one. Don't intend to unless I become disabled. Just going by what I see at the archery range. Guys with scoped crossbows shooting very tight groups at 50 yards routinely.
I watch drivers drive cars around a track at 100+ mph "routinely" but that doesn't mean anyone can do it nor does it mean it is easy.


Ridiculous comparison. If somebody can shoot a scoped rifle why couldn't they accurately shoot a scoped crossbow? Unless they were just exhausted from carrying that gaudy thing around.

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#3069103 - 12/08/12 09:06 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: cecil30-30]
Vermin93
10 Point


Registered: 12/11/10
Posts: 4622
Loc: Dallas, TX & Signal Mtn, TN

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 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
 Originally Posted By: Vermin93
2 straight months of blaze orange is enough already! No mas!
Theres that elitiest bow hunting attitude rearing its ugly head again..


Except I also hunt with a muzzleloader....and a rifle....and wear blaze orange....for 2 months....which is plenty of time for me, you, the deer and anybody else.


Edited by Vermin93 (12/08/12 09:24 AM)
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“The more I read and the more I listen, the more apparent it is that our society suffers from an alarming degree of public ignorance” - Retired Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O’Connor

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#3069109 - 12/08/12 09:12 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Pinwheeled]
parkerxbowhunter
4 Point


Registered: 09/24/11
Posts: 377
Loc: humphreys county

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no
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#3069111 - 12/08/12 09:15 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: parkerxbowhunter]
Wobblyshot1
8 Point


Registered: 10/13/10
Posts: 1139
Loc: Rutherford County

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I like the different seasons.
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#3069115 - 12/08/12 09:19 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
Vermin93
10 Point


Registered: 12/11/10
Posts: 4622
Loc: Dallas, TX & Signal Mtn, TN

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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Besides, the arguement is similarity to a gun. A bow hunter sees a deer he has to stand up, find a window to draw, hold, find a window to shoot. A crossbow shooter aims and pulls the trigger. Much like a gun.


I have to agree with that. As a first year bow hunter, I have found that drawing the bow undetected, sometimes from a difficult position or angle, is at least half the battle.


Edited by Vermin93 (12/08/12 09:22 AM)
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“The more I read and the more I listen, the more apparent it is that our society suffers from an alarming degree of public ignorance” - Retired Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O’Connor

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#3069119 - 12/08/12 09:22 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: southernhunter]
catman529
spiderboy
16 Point


Registered: 11/10/10
Posts: 15094
Loc: Franklin TN

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I'm no elitist bow hunter and am sitting here now with my orange on and a rifle in my lap. But I definitely want an archery only season especially considering how much time we have to hunt with a gun already and the pressure it puts on deer which can screw up bow hunting especially on public lands. And crossbows, I really don't care if you shoot one and am not in favor of their being restricted for disabled and youth only. What is the logical reasoning behind that? I hear people say it but have yet to hear an explanation. It's a bow with a trigger and scope that shoots just a little farther than a compound, kills a deer ethically, and doesn't mess up other bow hunters does it? Why restrict it to disabled and youth?
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#3069128 - 12/08/12 09:33 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: catman529]
catman529
spiderboy
16 Point


Registered: 11/10/10
Posts: 15094
Loc: Franklin TN

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 Originally Posted By: Vermin93
 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Besides, the arguement is similarity to a gun. A bow hunter sees a deer he has to stand up, find a window to draw, hold, find a window to shoot. A crossbow shooter aims and pulls the trigger. Much like a gun.


I have to agree with that. As a first year bow hunter, I have found that drawing the bow undetected, sometimes from a difficult position or angle, is at least half the battle.
I see the point, I too enjoy the challenge of getting the bow drawn and sticking an arrow into a deer. I have not used a crossbow and don't intend to anytime soon. BUT I still see no logical reason to restrict or ban the use of a crossbow. Crossbows may be easy to shoot like a gun but I believe their range is much closer to that of a compound than to a rifle. And they don't go BOOM or create an orange army which put a lot of pressure on the deer. Ive never heard of crossbow hunting ruining the hunting for other bow hunters. So why the heck are you comparing them to guns and suggesting that they be restricted? Really it just sounds plain elitist to me.
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#3069132 - 12/08/12 09:36 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
Beekeeper
Good ol' Boys "Team Buckcreek"
16 Point


Registered: 08/26/09
Posts: 11736
Loc: McMinn Co. Tennessee

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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
 Originally Posted By: Beekeeper
 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Never fired one. Don't intend to unless I become disabled. Just going by what I see at the archery range. Guys with scoped crossbows shooting very tight groups at 50 yards routinely.
I watch drivers drive cars around a track at 100+ mph "routinely" but that doesn't mean anyone can do it nor does it mean it is easy.


Ridiculous comparison. If somebody can shoot a scoped rifle why couldn't they accurately shoot a scoped crossbow? Unless they were just exhausted from carrying that gaudy thing around.
If someone can drive a 1960 VW beetle I believe they could drive a 2012 Dodge Charger. Same principle. It is not which weapon you use but your skill in hunting. Of the many deer I have killed, I could have killed over 90% of them with a Bow. Until you actually try to hunt with a particular weapon your knowledge of their attributes and limitations is just speculation.
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#3069142 - 12/08/12 09:47 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: catman529]
Vermin93
10 Point


Registered: 12/11/10
Posts: 4622
Loc: Dallas, TX & Signal Mtn, TN

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 Originally Posted By: catman529
Crossbows may be easy to shoot like a gun but I believe their range is much closer to that of a compound than to a rifle. And they don't go BOOM or create an orange army which put a lot of pressure on the deer. Ive never heard of crossbow hunting ruining the hunting for other bow hunters.


I think those are some good points, as well. I don't really care either way with crossbows. What I take issue with is extending firearm season even further into archery season.
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#3069151 - 12/08/12 10:01 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
timberjack86
12 Point


Registered: 06/20/11
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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Absolutely NOT! And crossbows should be for the disabled and youth only.
Bow hunters should hunt from the ground because the treestand is more of an advantage than the crossbow. I hunt from the ground with a crossbow lets see the mighty bowhunters hunt from the ground!
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#3069173 - 12/08/12 10:17 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Pinwheeled]
Coach
16 Point


Registered: 12/02/07
Posts: 11187
Loc: Pall Mall, TN and Dexter, MI

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Sometimes it amazes me that as hunters and shooters we rail against the "dirty liberals trying to take our guns"! And yet, some hunters would want to take our bows without hesitation to make it better for them. Isn't this sorta the same things the libs are saying?
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#3069183 - 12/08/12 10:25 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
chiggerbit
Spike


Registered: 09/16/11
Posts: 72
Loc: Lebanon, TN

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NO.

It's just my two cents, but the gate got opened and the crossbow fight is OVER. I don't consider them a bow, but a lot of folks evidently do. However, I hope the TWRA never gives any serious consideration to statewide shotgun seasons. It's just not merited, and since there's very valid arguments why the seasons are set up as they currently are, hopefully they'll just leave them ALONE.

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#3069184 - 12/08/12 10:25 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Vermin93]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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Registered: 03/11/99
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 Originally Posted By: Vermin93
Except I also hunt with a muzzleloader....and a rifle....and wear blaze orange....for 2 months....which is plenty of time for me, you, the deer and anybody else.


Gee, thanks for deciding for me what should be enough hunting. Classic elitism...
_________________________
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"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3069190 - 12/08/12 10:32 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Beekeeper
Good ol' Boys "Team Buckcreek"
16 Point


Registered: 08/26/09
Posts: 11736
Loc: McMinn Co. Tennessee

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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: Vermin93
Except I also hunt with a muzzleloader....and a rifle....and wear blaze orange....for 2 months....which is plenty of time for me, you, the deer and anybody else.


Gee, thanks for deciding for me what should be enough hunting. Classic elitism...
\:D \:D
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.
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#3069192 - 12/08/12 10:35 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Beekeeper]
bigquacks
4 Point


Registered: 10/25/00
Posts: 420
Loc: bristol tn

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Are we talking about Cougar season?
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#3069196 - 12/08/12 10:40 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Beekeeper]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 1469
Loc: TN

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I think the seasons are best how they are set up now. It lets archers have the advantage of hunting deer that have not been pressured, and we need that advantage to get close. I much prefer these seasons over the split up seasons where it was archery then ML then gun then ML then archery or whatever it was.

As far as the x-bows go, I have hunted with both and can assure ANYONE that it is much easier be successful with the x-bow. I think the argument to ban them from archery season is to keep the number of hunters that hunt that season down to a min. I believe ANYONE that can kill with a rifle can kill with a x-bow, but MANY of those cannot do the same with a compound. I wish they would ban them as well, but it is only because I like less people in the woods with me and I realize that this is not necessarily fair or justified, just a preference. \:\)
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#3069204 - 12/08/12 10:48 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Master Chief
8 Point


Registered: 10/11/11
Posts: 2420
Loc: Henderson County

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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
Yes have just a deer season. open on oct 1-JAN 1 And any weapon is legal but yoyou have a set number of deer allowwed to take.


I've been advocating that for years, simply because I'm tired of hearing hunters argue over who should have the most hunting days, bow hunters versus gun hunters versus pistol hunters, etc.

Just make it deer season. Let hunters choose which weapon they want to hunt with.


Ohh no.. I never thought I would see you post something I disagreed with \:D \:D I do understand were you are coming from though so I guess it isn't the end of the world.

I see it as every DEER HUNTER has the same amount of days to hunt. Everyone in TN has the ability to buy both archery and gun licenses.

I do, however, think this Oct 1-January 1 all weapons season may be a good idea. I would prefer it to add Sep 1-Sep 30 archery only. Why? I want to kill a deer in velvet. Most importantly.. a one buck limit.

-btw I would rather see a longer archery season but I can see the longer gun season working to benefit hunters and the deer so long as it is kept in balance.


Edited by Master Chief (12/08/12 10:57 AM)
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#3069229 - 12/08/12 11:02 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Coach
16 Point


Registered: 12/02/07
Posts: 11187
Loc: Pall Mall, TN and Dexter, MI

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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
Yes have just a deer season. open on oct 1-JAN 1 And any weapon is legal but yoyou have a set number of deer allowwed to take.


I've been advocating that for years, simply because I'm tired of hearing hunters argue over who should have the most hunting days, bow hunters versus gun hunters versus pistol hunters, etc.

Just make it deer season. Let hunters choose which weapon they want to hunt with.


Come on BSK, Cecil...gimme a break! Why do you have to be so, um, logical?? If we did this TNDeer may have to close down. So, are you advocating closing down TnDeer? :-)
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#3069245 - 12/08/12 11:16 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Coach]
darn2ten
6 Point


Registered: 12/08/11
Posts: 847
Loc: lincoln co. tn.

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All you got to do is check out another "archery talking forum", to see the in fighting this has caused in states that have this. Personally I think it would cause much more resentment from hunter to hunter, I think it's good like it is. Of course this is just my opinion, and that probably ain't worth much!
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#3069252 - 12/08/12 11:26 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Coach]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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Posts: 64196
Loc: Nashville, TN

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 Originally Posted By: Coach
If we did this TNDeer may have to close down. So, are you advocating closing down TnDeer? :-)


Absolutely not! THAT would be a disaster! ;\)
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#3069259 - 12/08/12 11:31 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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Registered: 03/11/99
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Honestly, I have no problem with a bow season before firearms seasons. I used to be primarily a bow-hunter and I get where bow-hunting advocates are coming from. This bow-season-first system increase hunting opportunity and does no harm to the resource. Plus archery hunting is the best training ground I know of for teaching woodsmanship skills. Show me a successful bow hunter and I'm probably seeing a skilled and knowledgeable hunter.

The problem I have is with those bow-hunters that somehow believe (and advocate) that they actually deserve this time without competition from other hunters; i.e. the eletist bow-hunter attitude too often prevalent among the most ardent members of the archery community. They have earned nor "deserve" any such thing.
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#3069264 - 12/08/12 11:35 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Vermin93
10 Point


Registered: 12/11/10
Posts: 4622
Loc: Dallas, TX & Signal Mtn, TN

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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: Vermin93
Except I also hunt with a muzzleloader....and a rifle....and wear blaze orange....for 2 months....which is plenty of time for me, you, the deer and anybody else.


Gee, thanks for deciding for me what should be enough hunting. Classic elitism...


Whatever, BSK. Tennesseans are just starving for more rifle time compared to the rest of the American whitetail hunting world...

Go ahead and kick the elitist archery hunters out of muzzleloader and rifle season if that will make you feel better. I'm fine with that.
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“The more I read and the more I listen, the more apparent it is that our society suffers from an alarming degree of public ignorance” - Retired Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O’Connor

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#3069267 - 12/08/12 11:37 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Vermin93]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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No, I wouldn't stop there. I would outlaw archery equipment! ;\)
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"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3069279 - 12/08/12 11:46 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Vermin93]
Master Chief
8 Point


Registered: 10/11/11
Posts: 2420
Loc: Henderson County

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 Originally Posted By: Vermin93
 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: Vermin93
Except I also hunt with a muzzleloader....and a rifle....and wear blaze orange....for 2 months....which is plenty of time for me, you, the deer and anybody else.


Gee, thanks for deciding for me what should be enough hunting. Classic elitism...


Whatever, BSK. Tennesseans are just starving for more rifle time compared to the rest of the American whitetail hunting world...

Go ahead and kick the elitist archery hunters out of muzzleloader and rifle season if that will make you feel better. I'm fine with that.




With that kind of attitude I wouldn't blame him..
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#3069283 - 12/08/12 11:52 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Vermin93
10 Point


Registered: 12/11/10
Posts: 4622
Loc: Dallas, TX & Signal Mtn, TN

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 Originally Posted By: BSK
No, I wouldn't stop there. I would outlaw archery equipment! ;\)


I knew it! You're a spy for PETA, aren't you!
_________________________
“The more I read and the more I listen, the more apparent it is that our society suffers from an alarming degree of public ignorance” - Retired Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O’Connor

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#3069319 - 12/08/12 12:16 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Vermin93]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 64196
Loc: Nashville, TN

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 Originally Posted By: Vermin93
 Originally Posted By: BSK
No, I wouldn't stop there. I would outlaw archery equipment! ;\)


I knew it! You're a spy for PETA, aren't you!


HA!

No, but for me, there is nothing more fun than stirring a pot full of elitist bow-hunters. The reaction is so predictable!

Kind of like publishing a Muhammad cartoon in an Arab newspaper...

_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3069366 - 12/08/12 12:44 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
chiggerbit
Spike


Registered: 09/16/11
Posts: 72
Loc: Lebanon, TN

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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
Yes have just a deer season. open on oct 1-JAN 1 And any weapon is legal but yoyou have a set number of deer allowwed to take.


I've been advocating that for years, simply because I'm tired of hearing hunters argue over who should have the most hunting days, bow hunters versus gun hunters versus pistol hunters, etc.

Just make it deer season. Let hunters choose which weapon they want to hunt with.


Maybe you're not serious, but just because there's arguments and elitism among the ranks...? Clearly, the commission hasn't just arbitrarily set up the seasons as they are.

Regarding elitism and attitudes within the bowhunting ranks though, I'm sure there will be strong feelings for years because of the commission taking away the archery only days in November and for allowing crossbows for all. That's just politics. They'll get over it eventually, but elitism will never cease, no matter how a governing body rules.

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#3069413 - 12/08/12 01:08 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: southernhunter]
EastTNHunter
10 Point


Registered: 03/08/10
Posts: 2629
Loc: Rhea Co., TN

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I like the changes in seasons. I say leave it the way that it is.

Edited by EastTNHunter (12/08/12 01:09 PM)

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#3069454 - 12/08/12 01:35 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Vermin93]
in the dog house!
14 Point


Registered: 11/29/12
Posts: 7934
Loc: west tn

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One thing i dont hear much about cross bows is that with a cross bow you are pretty much limited to JUST 1 SHOT unlike a regular bows that you can quickly grab another arrow from your quiver and shoot agin. Of course im referring to hunting from a climber.
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#3069472 - 12/08/12 01:49 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: in the dog house!]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 1469
Loc: TN

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 Originally Posted By: in the dog house!
One thing i dont hear much about cross bows is that with a cross bow you are pretty much limited to JUST 1 SHOT unlike a regular bows that you can quickly grab another arrow from your quiver and shoot agin. Of course im referring to hunting from a climber.


I had a rewind "crank" style cocking device on my x-bow, I could get a second shot off almost as fast, definitely with less movement, and quieter than with a compound. X-bow hunting doesn't really compare to compound hunting when it comes to difficulty.
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#3069516 - 12/08/12 02:33 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
stik
TnDeer Old Timer
18 Point


Registered: 03/12/99
Posts: 20311
Loc: lenoir city,tn

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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
Never fired one. Don't intend to unless I become disabled. Just going by what I see at the archery range. Guys with scoped crossbows shooting very tight groups at 50 yards routinely.


i see them as more of a disadvantage because i have actually shot one and know what they can and cannot do. i have seen many archers with compounds busting nocks at 50+ yds with compounds.
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#3069663 - 12/08/12 04:48 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: stik]
Swamphunter
12 Point


Registered: 12/27/07
Posts: 6452
Loc: Munford, TN

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 Originally Posted By: stik
i have seen many archers with compounds busting nocks at 50+ yds with compounds.
As have I, although I am not one of them. My point is: It's much easier to sit, rest your crossbow on a shooting rail, already cocked, aim with a scope and pull the trigger. Anybody with any sense that's ever hunted with a recurve or compound knows this. I can't believe there are actually people that argue a crossbow is MORE challenging.

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#3069670 - 12/08/12 04:52 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
stik
TnDeer Old Timer
18 Point


Registered: 03/12/99
Posts: 20311
Loc: lenoir city,tn

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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
 Originally Posted By: stik
i have seen many archers with compounds busting nocks at 50+ yds with compounds.
As have I, although I am not one of them. My point is: It's much easier to sit, rest your crossbow on a shooting rail, already cocked, aim with a scope and pull the trigger. Anybody with any sense that's ever hunted with a recurve or compound knows this. I can't believe there are actually people that argue a crossbow is MORE challenging.


not arguing that it is more challenging, just that it does not have the advantages over a compound that those that have no experience with them think they do. you still need to know the yardage and they run out of gas fast past 35 yds.
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experienced hunters know its not just a bushy white tail, its a big middle finger.

nothing makes a fish bigger than almost being caught


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#3069677 - 12/08/12 04:55 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Pinwheeled]
ROUGH COUNTRY HUNTER
16 Point


Registered: 11/12/10
Posts: 12396
Loc: FRANKLIN COUNTY

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no
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#3069679 - 12/08/12 04:56 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: stik]
Swamphunter
12 Point


Registered: 12/27/07
Posts: 6452
Loc: Munford, TN

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 Originally Posted By: stik
they run out of gas fast past 35 yds.


I did not realize that but I limit shots with a bow to 35 yards anyway.

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#3069692 - 12/08/12 05:01 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
stik
TnDeer Old Timer
18 Point


Registered: 03/12/99
Posts: 20311
Loc: lenoir city,tn

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 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
 Originally Posted By: stik
they run out of gas fast past 35 yds.


I did not realize that but I limit shots with a bow to 35 yards anyway.


me too and only at very relaxed animals at that distance.
_________________________
experienced hunters know its not just a bushy white tail, its a big middle finger.

nothing makes a fish bigger than almost being caught


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#3069699 - 12/08/12 05:11 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: stik]
Beekeeper
Good ol' Boys "Team Buckcreek"
16 Point


Registered: 08/26/09
Posts: 11736
Loc: McMinn Co. Tennessee

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 Originally Posted By: stik
 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
 Originally Posted By: stik
they run out of gas fast past 35 yds.


I did not realize that but I limit shots with a bow to 35 yards anyway.


me too and only at very relaxed animals at that distance.
I will actually take longer shots with my compound than I will with my X-Bow.
_________________________
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.
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#3069741 - 12/08/12 05:54 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Beekeeper]
timberjack86
12 Point


Registered: 06/20/11
Posts: 7452
Loc: Grundy county

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Why are you compound guys even talking about challenge? You knock us crossbow hunters because you think its less challengeing. If you really wanted a challenge you would pick up and long bow or recurve and quite harping on those of us that just like to deer hunt. If you want more challenge hunt from the ground with a traditional bow.
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#3069786 - 12/08/12 06:29 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: timberjack86]
Carlos Viagra
16 Point


Registered: 11/20/04
Posts: 13489
Loc: Cumberland Plateau

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Blah blah blah. Lol- is this seriously being discussed? Its still deer season for cripes sake! Geez guys.
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#3069794 - 12/08/12 06:34 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: timberjack86]
southernhunter
8 Point


Registered: 09/08/10
Posts: 1728
Loc: alabama

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If crossbows should be limited in archery season maybe all you guys shooting (inlines) during muzzleload season need to stop , unfair advantage over my side lock with a patched round ball and no scope !!!! . Any day a crossbow can be compared to a rifle .I WANT ONE !
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#3069806 - 12/08/12 06:44 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: southernhunter]
Vermin93
10 Point


Registered: 12/11/10
Posts: 4622
Loc: Dallas, TX & Signal Mtn, TN

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 Originally Posted By: southernhunter
If crossbows should be limited in archery season maybe all you guys shooting (inlines) during muzzleload season need to stop , unfair advantage over my side lock with a patched round ball and no scope !!!! . Any day a crossbow can be compared to a rifle .I WANT ONE !


Totally agreed! We need a traditional muzzleloader season!
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#3070018 - 12/08/12 09:04 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
BMan
16 Point


Registered: 02/06/06
Posts: 10081
Loc: Middle TN

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 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
I believe ANYONE that can kill with a rifle can kill with a x-bow, but MANY of those cannot do the same with a compound.

Except a lot more goes into hunting than pulling a trigger. Like scouting locations. Hanging stands in the right place. Noise and movement discipline. Scent control and hunting the wind.
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#3070027 - 12/08/12 09:09 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: chiggerbit]
BMan
16 Point


Registered: 02/06/06
Posts: 10081
Loc: Middle TN

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 Originally Posted By: chiggerbit
It's just my two cents, but the gate got opened and the crossbow fight is OVER. I don't consider them a bow, but a lot of folks evidently do.

What do you consider a bow? Crossbows were around for centuries before compound bows, so...
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#3070062 - 12/08/12 09:40 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Pinwheeled]
LETMWALK
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Registered: 11/22/12
Posts: 10
Loc: TN,GILES

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I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A 1 BUCK LIMIT AND YOU MUST KILL A DOE FIRST TO RECEIVE YOURE BUCK TAG!!!
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#3070063 - 12/08/12 09:42 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: LETMWALK]
timberjack86
12 Point


Registered: 06/20/11
Posts: 7452
Loc: Grundy county

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 Originally Posted By: LETMWALK
I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A 1 BUCK LIMIT AND YOU MUST KILL A DOE FIRST TO RECEIVE YOURE BUCK TAG!!!
You should move to kentucky.You will be happy and so will I ;\)
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#3070068 - 12/08/12 09:46 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: timberjack86]
Beekeeper
Good ol' Boys "Team Buckcreek"
16 Point


Registered: 08/26/09
Posts: 11736
Loc: McMinn Co. Tennessee

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 Originally Posted By: timberjack86
 Originally Posted By: LETMWALK
I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A 1 BUCK LIMIT AND YOU MUST KILL A DOE FIRST TO RECEIVE YOURE BUCK TAG!!!
You should move to kentucky.You will be happy and so will I ;\)
\:D
_________________________
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.
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#3070076 - 12/08/12 09:52 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
redblood
16 Point


Registered: 01/22/06
Posts: 13851
Loc: Lewisburg

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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
Yes have just a deer season. open on oct 1-JAN 1 And any weapon is legal but yoyou have a set number of deer allowwed to take.


I've been advocating that for years, simply because I'm tired of hearing hunters argue over who should have the most hunting days, bow hunters versus gun hunters versus pistol hunters, etc.

Just make it deer season. Let hunters choose which weapon they want to hunt with.



fine with me to. hate bows and stink poles. but the season would need to be drastically cut to prevent overharvest, especially of young bucks
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#3070078 - 12/08/12 09:53 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: redblood]
redblood
16 Point


Registered: 01/22/06
Posts: 13851
Loc: Lewisburg

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nov 1 to jan 1. 2 bucks. simply and easy. give october back to squirrel hunters. give january back to rabbit and quail hunters
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#3070084 - 12/08/12 09:55 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: LETMWALK]
redblood
16 Point


Registered: 01/22/06
Posts: 13851
Loc: Lewisburg

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 Originally Posted By: LETMWALK
I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A 1 BUCK LIMIT AND YOU MUST KILL A DOE FIRST TO RECEIVE YOURE BUCK TAG!!!



some people have no interest in shooting a doe. myself included. shot my last jan. 1, 1999
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#3070086 - 12/08/12 09:55 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Beekeeper]
LETMWALK
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Registered: 11/22/12
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JUST SAYING NOT ENOUGH DEER KILLED TO KEEP HERD UNDER CONTROL.EVERYONE JUST WANTS THOSE HORNS INSTEAD OF HAMS!!!
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#3070114 - 12/08/12 10:13 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: LETMWALK]
redblood
16 Point


Registered: 01/22/06
Posts: 13851
Loc: Lewisburg

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 Originally Posted By: LETMWALK
JUST SAYING NOT ENOUGH DEER KILLED TO KEEP HERD UNDER CONTROL.EVERYONE JUST WANTS THOSE HORNS INSTEAD OF HAMS!!!



true. however, there would be alot of recycled does checked in at check stations and a ton of phantom does checked in the first day of the season via telecheck.
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#3070201 - 12/08/12 11:15 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: redblood]
deerhunter10
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A cross bow is a bow for one two i would not like to see an all weapon season. I would much prefer to see a two Buck limit instead although i sometimes bow hunting i sure would like to be able to have a rifle but that's why i love bow hunting because you must earn it. I think an all weapon season will piss off more people then it would make happy.
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#3070222 - 12/08/12 11:43 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
redblood
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prolly never happen. would kill bow shops.
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#3070249 - 12/09/12 01:44 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: redblood]
tn droptine
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I enjoy the way it currently is, have no desire to make any changes.

However, I disagree with those wanting to restrict the crossbows. I myself hunt with a compound, but my wife is very petite and unable to draw a compound with very much weight. So my father is giving her his crossbow for Christmas so she will be able to bowhunt.

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#3070345 - 12/09/12 07:35 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: chiggerbit]
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 Originally Posted By: chiggerbit
 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
Yes have just a deer season. open on oct 1-JAN 1 And any weapon is legal but yoyou have a set number of deer allowwed to take.


I've been advocating that for years, simply because I'm tired of hearing hunters argue over who should have the most hunting days, bow hunters versus gun hunters versus pistol hunters, etc.

Just make it deer season. Let hunters choose which weapon they want to hunt with.


Maybe you're not serious, but just because there's arguments and elitism among the ranks...? Clearly, the commission hasn't just arbitrarily set up the seasons as they are.


Actually, I'm quite serious. I would have no problem with just "deer" season (no individual weapons seasons).

You have to understand how all of these special weapons seasons got started. Back during the deer restoration effort, the primary deer season was gun season. Then advocates for hunting with more difficult/less effective (and rarely used weapons) lobbied for these "special" seasons. Considering very few hunters would participate in these seasons, they were enacted because their influence on annual deer harvests would be almost non-existant. In essence, they were allowed because the agency believed few deer would ever be killed during these special weapons season. Archery season was first adopted before the compound bow craze started. MZ season started when just a few people were shooting the first Hawken "kit" side-hammers (build them yourself). The "real" deer season was always gun season and these other special weapons season were just after-thoughts that would provide some opportunity for a few while doing no harm.

Yet the popularity of the seasons (because they offered more hunting time than gun season) grew to the point that now some participants in these seasons feel they somehow deserve their special time in the woods, and that their time should dominate all other weapon hunters' times.
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#3070353 - 12/09/12 07:40 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: redblood]
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 Originally Posted By: redblood
 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
Yes have just a deer season. open on oct 1-JAN 1 And any weapon is legal but yoyou have a set number of deer allowwed to take.


I've been advocating that for years, simply because I'm tired of hearing hunters argue over who should have the most hunting days, bow hunters versus gun hunters versus pistol hunters, etc.

Just make it deer season. Let hunters choose which weapon they want to hunt with.




fine with me to. hate bows and stink poles. but the season would need to be drastically cut to prevent overharvest, especially of young bucks


I think a three month any-weapon season would be feasible, but bag limits might need to be adjusted to prevent overharvest. How much they would need to be adjusted is something that would have to be experimented with.
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#3070402 - 12/09/12 08:11 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Coach
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Bowhunters in all orange would be interesting?
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#3070425 - 12/09/12 08:21 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Wes Parrish
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 Originally Posted By: BSK
You have to understand how all of these special weapons seasons got started. . . . . . advocates for hunting with more difficult/less effective (and rarely used weapons) lobbied for these "special" seasons. Considering very few hunters would participate in these seasons, they were enacted because their influence on annual deer harvests would be almost non-existant. . . . . . . MZ season started when just a few people were shooting the first Hawken "kit" side-hammers (build them yourself). The "real" deer season was always gun season and these other special weapons season were just after-thoughts that would provide some opportunity for a few while doing no harm.

Yet the popularity of the seasons (because they offered more hunting time than gun season) grew to the point that now some participants in these seasons feel they somehow deserve their special time in the woods, and that their time should dominate all other weapon hunters' times.

Exactly.

And having these "special" weapons season has come at a very high price to the sport of hunting in general. It's been a very mixed blessing. IMO, the promotion of more deer hunting "opportunities" has come along with a price of losing other hunting opportunity, ending in fewer youth getting into hunting that might have happened with only a "traditional" November gun season. And I love bowhunting, and using my muzzleloaders, but creating this mindset that those who pick up a bow or muzzleloader are somehow more "special" than "regular" old rifle-carrying deer hunters . . . . . . that's not been a good thing.

 Originally Posted By: redblood
nov 1 to jan 1. 2 bucks. simply and easy. give october back to squirrel hunters. give january back to rabbit and quail hunters

This idea would probably do more good than harm to hunting in general.

Think about what a small percentage of deer (of the total annual harvest) are killed prior to Nov. 1.

In retrospect, it may have been a mistake for TWRA to have ever established "special" weapons season segments. But I wouldn't change it much now. May be more need for change in future years, especially should the deer population continue to increase and the number of deer hunters continue to decrease. Not to mention, archery-only deer hunters will continue to gain opportunity as so many "urban" areas outlaw firearms.

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#3070427 - 12/09/12 08:22 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
TNDeerGuy
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My answer is a big fat NO, here are just few of a long-list of my reasons why I say no. There would have to be a reduction of available days to hunt to prevent over-harvest (I want the season lengthened to what we have because I love being out there knowing I have an opportunity), too much competition in the woods with various weapons, deer going nocturnal quickly because of the pressure, reduction in TWRA's license revenue due to a percentage that would only buy a rifle tag instead of let's say rifle AND archery tag—TWRA would have to raise license fees under the current regulations to maintain the current revenue amount and it would anger alot more people that it would make happy as previously stated. Tennessee already has one of the longer firearms seasons out there already and why we should increase it completely baffles me.

I don't see what would be so wrong with emulating the midwest and northern states, as far as their firearms seasons and the timing of it, but extending the entire season to maintain control of the population. Then again....that would anger all of those elitiest firearm users that think they deserve over two months of blasting away in the woods (that argument can go both directions, so be careful to those that use "elitism" as an argument). \:\)

Just leave it the way it currently is, it seems to make the most happy! Debates like this "what if" aren't healthy for our past time/sport and does nothing but divide various segments of the sport further.

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#3070449 - 12/09/12 08:34 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: TNDeerGuy]
Wes Parrish
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 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy
Just leave it the way it currently is, it seems to make the most happy! Debates like this "what if" aren't healthy for our past time/sport and does nothing but divide various segments of the sport further.

I'm fine with leaving it the way it is.
But it's not these debates that have divided various segments of the sport. Much of the division has come by the idea that one is not a "real" hunter if he chooses to hunt "small" game instead of "big" game. But more of the division has come by the prior promotion of these "special" season segments and the idea that one becomes an "elite" hunter should he decide to use a less effective weapon. Throughout history, the best hunters have always used the most effective weapons they had.

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#3070454 - 12/09/12 08:43 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
Main Beam
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I wouldnt be opposed to a week of flintlock/archery prior to muzzle loader with the weeks loss coming from the front end of rifle.
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#3070461 - 12/09/12 08:52 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Main Beam]
pseshooter300
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I think we need to to go to 1 buck a year

Edited by pseshooter300 (12/09/12 08:53 AM)

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#3070508 - 12/09/12 09:37 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: pseshooter300]
baller_9
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TWRA has perfected the season structure how it is now. Well done and no changes needed other than a two buck limit!
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#3070513 - 12/09/12 09:42 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: pseshooter300]
Wes Parrish
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I remember the days when most hunters were very excited about the opening of rabbit & quail season, and headed afield in mass, without concern of interfering with someone's deer hunting, without concern of property lines, since most land was not "posted". Today, many hunters see the opening of rabbit & quail seasons as an interference to deer hunting, and most hunting clubs don't allow any small-game hunting during November.

Times past, even after deer season opened right before Thanksgiving, we'd go "bird" hunting in between a morning & afternoon deer hunt. On a personal level, my passion for hunting was developed mainly from small game hunting, mainly dove, squirrel, rabbit, and quail. Never mind now that I spend more time deer hunting than small-game hunting, but I became a lifetime hunter more from a start with small-game than big-game hunting.

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#3070517 - 12/09/12 09:45 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
redblood
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 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish
I remember the days when most hunters were very excited about the opening of rabbit & quail season, and headed afield in mass, without concern of interfering with someone's deer hunting, without concern of property lines, since most land was not "posted".

Even after deer season opened right before Thanksgiving, we'd go "bird" hunting in between a morning & afternoon deer hunt. On a personal level, my passion for hunting was developed mainly from small game hunting, mainly dove, squirrel, rabbit, and quail. Never mind now that I spend more time deer hunting than small-game hunting, but I became a lifetime hunter more from a start with small-game than big-game hunting.



great post Wes. some many have forrgotten that some of the purest forms of hunting, do not involve a kill tag
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#3070525 - 12/09/12 09:47 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: redblood]
Wes Parrish
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And the typical day of small-game hunting was typically more "exciting" than the typical day of deer hunting. Unlike most of today's deer hunting (most of the hunting time spent just "sitting"), quail & rabbit hunting is walking and moving all day, getting a lot more exercise.
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#3070526 - 12/09/12 09:48 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: redblood]
Coach
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 Originally Posted By: redblood
 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish
I remember the days when most hunters were very excited about the opening of rabbit & quail season, and headed afield in mass, without concern of interfering with someone's deer hunting, without concern of property lines, since most land was not "posted".

Even after deer season opened right before Thanksgiving, we'd go "bird" hunting in between a morning & afternoon deer hunt. On a personal level, my passion for hunting was developed mainly from small game hunting, mainly dove, squirrel, rabbit, and quail. Never mind now that I spend more time deer hunting than small-game hunting, but I became a lifetime hunter more from a start with small-game than big-game hunting.



great post Wes. some many have forrgotten that some of the purest forms of hunting, do not involve a kill tag


Wes, we sometimes squirrel hunt between our morning and afternoon deer hunt. Especially, with the young grandkids at deer camp. It has not affected the deer hunting at all in my opinion. Son and grandson squirrel hunted on the northwest side of the property at noon and that evening one of my other sons and I killed a really nice 8pt...I still love to rabbit and squirrel hunt...and in Michigan pheasant and grouse.
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#3070677 - 12/09/12 11:20 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: redblood]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: redblood
nov 1 to jan 1. 2 bucks. simply and easy. give october back to squirrel hunters. give january back to rabbit and quail hunters


Honestly redblood, I could actually live with that. My desire is that every deer hunter gets to hunt their local peak of breeding. I think November 1 to January 1 (or even January 15 for those along thr AL/MS border) would cover the peak of breeding in all of TN.
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#3070679 - 12/09/12 11:21 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish
And having these "special" weapons season has come at a very high price to the sport of hunting in general. It's been a very mixed blessing. IMO, the promotion of more deer hunting "opportunities" has come along with a price of losing other hunting opportunity, ending in fewer youth getting into hunting that might have happened with only a "traditional" November gun season. And I love bowhunting, and using my muzzleloaders, but creating this mindset that those who pick up a bow or muzzleloader are somehow more "special" than "regular" old rifle-carrying deer hunters . . . . . . that's not been a good thing.


Excellent post Wes.
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#3070708 - 12/09/12 11:38 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: TNDeerGuy]
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 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy
...There would have to be a reduction of available days to hunt to prevent over-harvest...


Maybe. We would have to see. The southeastern half of South Carolina has a 4-month-long gun season, and very high bag limits for the entire season. They've had this for years and there is no indication they've shot out their deer herd.

Now I'm not saying TN is exactly like the coastal plain of SC, but the concept that hunters would quickly over-harvest the deer population under long gun seasons might not be accurate.


 Quote:
...too much competition in the woods with various weapons, deer going nocturnal quickly because of the pressure...


But TN gun hunters already face this. There would be no change except for those hunters who currently enjoy the benefits of getting to hunt before everybody else. That is exactly what I want to eliminated.


 Quote:
...TWRA would have to raise license fees under the current regulations to maintain the current revenue amount...


Absolutely true.


 Quote:
Tennessee already has one of the longer firearms seasons out there already and why we should increase it completely baffles me.


To increase opportunity for more hunters.


 Quote:
I don't see what would be so wrong with emulating the midwest and northern states...


Because we are not the Midwest or Northern states. Their regulations are based on their situation in the way of habitat and hunter density. Ou state's seasons should be based on our state's habitat and hunter densities. We should allow the maximum amount of hunting possibile for the maximum number of hunters that does no harm to the deer population.


 Quote:
Then again....that would anger all of those elitiest firearm users that think they deserve over two months of blasting away in the woods (that argument can go both directions, so be careful to those that use "elitism" as an argument). \:\)


Don't you just love how elitist bow-hunters try to turn the tables by calling gun hunters--who share the woods with everybody--"elitist?" But I guess when you have no rational argument...
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#3070773 - 12/09/12 12:23 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
TNDeerGuy
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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy
Then again....that would anger all of those elitiest firearm users that think they deserve over two months of blasting away in the woods (that argument can go both directions, so be careful to those that use "elitism" as an argument). \:\)


Don't you just love how elitist bow-hunters try to turn the tables by calling gun hunters--who share the woods with everybody--"elitist?" But I guess when you have no rational argument...



No, I'm just merely pointing out the fact that argument to increase the total time in the woods with a gun is just as much as an elitiest argument, as the one your making as the majority of archery hunters hang up their bows as soon as firearms season opens and it does not have a negative effect on the gun seasons with deer behavior being changed due to pressure—as the harvest data supports.
I have no problem with an archery only season, as you should know by now, and it certainly is a completely different methodology than "gun" hunting which makes it exponentially more difficult—which is magnified once the guns start going off and deer become weary, "spooky" and alot harder to pattern. If you want to call that line of thinking elitiest...then go ahead, but you will be disagreed with all day long.

 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy
Tennessee already has one of the longer firearms seasons out there already and why we should increase it completely baffles me.


 Originally Posted By: BSK
To increase opportunity for more hunters.


If we lose total hunting days how is that increasing opportunity? Furthermore, why does that opportunity have to be done with a gun season....couldn't the same opportunity be done with adding days to an archery season like adding days before or after the traditional open and close of the seasons how they are now? Archers are just as elitiest as gun users, as both want more days with their weapons. The ones that call archers elitiest, either refuse to acknowledge that bowhunting becomes alot more difficult than it already is when guns are blasting nearby, or they are ignorant of the fact—especially if it is a significant portion of the population that hunts public land. If you want more opportunity on the land you hunt get your archery equipment back out—if you didn't wrap the bow around the tree years ago. ;\)


I could argue the point all day long, as you could also I'm sure, but I assure you after we are done there will not be a winner on either side and neither will change the other's mind, so we will have to agree to disagree on this one subject. \:\)

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#3070815 - 12/09/12 12:52 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: TNDeerGuy]
deerhunter10
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If we go to an all weapon season the bag limit. I am against it. And i can kind of agree with redblood but they can hunt small game already during deer season. I do not think it's fair for the bow hunters and ml hunters and the archery shops to go to an all weapon season.
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#3070825 - 12/09/12 01:02 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: cecil30-30]
Rackseeker
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 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
Yes have just a deer season. open on oct 1-JAN 1 And any weapon is legal but yoyou have a set number of deer allowwed to take.



X2
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#3070894 - 12/09/12 01:45 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Rackseeker]
Dolan82
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Just look at the states that have huge deer killed in them each year. Do they have a long gun season ? No. They have a one week gun season. And in that one week if you research the numbers they kill more deer in that one week than are killed in here in a year. So I don't know how anyone could think a longer gun season could benefit anyone. Jmo
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#3070909 - 12/09/12 01:51 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Dolan82]
deerhunter10
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^^ you are right and i agree with you but this site seems to have more meat hunters then trophy hunters. So you are about to have a lot of people disagree with you. But i completely agree with you.
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#3070920 - 12/09/12 02:02 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
Doskil
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The shorter the season, the more deer taken.

With a long season, people pass on deer.

Not so with a shorter season.

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#3071207 - 12/09/12 04:45 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Dolan82]
redblood
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 Originally Posted By: Dolan82
Just look at the states that have huge deer killed in them each year. Do they have a long gun season ? No. They have a one week gun season. And in that one week if you research the numbers they kill more deer in that one week than are killed in here in a year. So I don't know how anyone could think a longer gun season could benefit anyone. Jmo


true
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#3071221 - 12/09/12 04:58 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Dolan82]
Beekeeper
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 Originally Posted By: Dolan82
Just look at the states that have huge deer killed in them each year. Do they have a long gun season ? No. They have a one week gun season. And in that one week if you research the numbers they kill more deer in that one week than are killed in here in a year. So I don't know how anyone could think a longer gun season could benefit anyone. Jmo
Gives hunters more time to hunt.
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#3071323 - 12/09/12 06:19 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Buzzard Breath
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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Quote:
...TWRA would have to raise license fees under the current regulations to maintain the current revenue amount...


Absolutely true.

The question then becomes, how much can TWRA raise license fees before they start losing customers? Can they raise them high enough to cover the lost revenues from the archery and muzzleloader fees? Can they restructure how they sell licenses to keep the same amount of money coming in?

These are questions I thought about while hunting today. I buy a sportsman's license every year and consider it a donation to TWRA. I hunt very little in this state anymore due to their season dates and could save some money by purchasing weapon specific licenses. I look at simply as a donation such as I make to NWTF and RMEF. I don't think that will change no matter what they do. But, I do know several guys that quit buying TN hunting licenses over the past 5 years when they extended the muzzleloader season and dropped the December bow hunts. At what point does TWRA lose their client base? If they were to make it an all weapon season, would more people participate in the sport or would TWRA lose participants?
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#3071336 - 12/09/12 06:30 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Buzzard Breath]
Dolan82
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Don't misunderstand me. I think the season is set up fine as it is. But I do think making a all weapons season would hurt the deer herd and also it may cause some hunters to quit hunting this state also. I think it should be left as it is. Maybe put a break in the middle of gun season on public land to give the deer a break and hopefully start moving again.
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#3071374 - 12/09/12 07:00 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Dolan82]
TNDeerGuy
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 Originally Posted By: Dolan82
Don't misunderstand me. I think the season is set up fine as it is. But I do think making a all weapons season would hurt the deer herd and also it may cause some hunters to quit hunting this state also. I think it should be left as it is. Maybe put a break in the middle of gun season on public land to give the deer a break and hopefully start moving again.


We used to have a break during the firearms seasons, as recently as a few years ago, but that was done away with because it is believed that some of us don't have the ability to read a freaking calender, or was it part of a more machivellian plot to lengthen the firearms even further so to get those elitiest archery crowd stirred up? LOL \:D \:\)
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#3071903 - 12/10/12 04:45 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Stalkhunter]
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No
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#3072114 - 12/10/12 08:35 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: TNDeerGuy]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy
 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy
Then again....that would anger all of those elitiest firearm users that think they deserve over two months of blasting away in the woods (that argument can go both directions, so be careful to those that use "elitism" as an argument). \:\)


Don't you just love how elitist bow-hunters try to turn the tables by calling gun hunters--who share the woods with everybody--"elitist?" But I guess when you have no rational argument...



No, I'm just merely pointing out the fact that argument to increase the total time in the woods with a gun is just as much as an elitiest argument


Bow hunters only share the woods with other bow-hunters, who are the smallest continent of all deer hunters. And that's the way they want it to stay--an elitist and selfish desire; to not share the deer woods. Gun hunters already share the wood with everybody, hence they can't be called elitist.


 Quote:
...the majority of archery hunters hang up their bows as soon as firearms season opens and it does not have a negative effect on the gun seasons with deer behavior being changed due to pressure...


Are you actually trying to say that bow hunters having been in the woods for over a month before any firearms season opens doesn't negatively affect the hunting for those who have to wait until gun season open? That's ludicrous. Of course bow hunters stinking up the woods and pressuring deer reduces the harvest opportunities for gun hunters. I can prove that.


 Quote:
I have no problem with an archery only season, as you should know by now, and it certainly is a completely different methodology than "gun" hunting which makes it exponentially more difficult—which is magnified once the guns start going off and deer become weary, "spooky" and alot harder to pattern.


So?

If you bow hunt for the added challenge archery equipment requires, then accept the challenge. Don't ask other hunters not to hunt so the challenge is easier to accomplish.


 Quote:
If you want to call that line of thinking elitiest...then go ahead, but you will be disagreed with all day long.


I will only be disagreed with by those bow hunter who won't look in the mirror and admit that wanting to "have the woods to themselves" is a selfish desire.


 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy
 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy
Tennessee already has one of the longer firearms seasons out there already and why we should increase it completely baffles me.


To increase opportunity for more hunters.


If we lose total hunting days how is that increasing opportunity?


The only ones losing hunting days (and then only a week or so) are those who bow hunt, which is the smallest contingent of hunters. The majority of deer hunters gun hunt, and they would get far more opportunities. More opportunities for a larger number of deer hunters IS increasing opportunities.


 Quote:
Furthermore, why does that opportunity have to be done with a gun season....couldn't the same opportunity be done with adding days to an archery season...


Because that only benefits the smallest group of deer hunters (those who bow hunt), and they ALREADY get the most days to hunt.


 Quote:
Archers are just as elitiest as gun users, as both want more days with their weapons.


You are either forgetting or not acknowleding that those who bow hunt also hunt during MZ and gun season. They already get to hunt from late September through early January. Gun hunters only get late November into early January. That's a huge disparity in hunting days.


 Quote:
The ones that call archers elitiest, either refuse to acknowledge that bowhunting becomes alot more difficult than it already is when guns are blasting nearby, or they are ignorant of the fact


Of course it is more difficult. But bow-hunting, by its very nature, is more challenging. But isn't that the point of choosing to bow-hunt? Because of the challenge? So challenge yourself.


 Quote:
I could argue the point all day long, as you could also I'm sure, but I assure you after we are done there will not be a winner on either side and neither will change the other's mind, so we will have to agree to disagree on this one subject. \:\)


That's because, as a bow hunter, you refuse to admit the obvious--that bow hunters are being selfish in not wanting to share the woods with other hunters. That is all this argument comes down to. MOST bow hunters only bow hunt for two reasons: 1) to get first crack at unpressured deer before the "orange army" invades the woods; and 2) for more hunting time. Yet when more hunting time is offered to everybody, bow hunters oppose the idea because they don't want to share the time that is curently exclusively theirs. That's the definition of "selfish." Why--just because they want to hunt with a particular weapon--should any hunters get a "special" time to hunt alone? If you want to hunt with a special weapon, then do so. Just don't ask other hunters to stay out of the woods while you do so.
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#3072161 - 12/10/12 09:04 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Wes Parrish
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Let me preface this by stating I'm a deer hunter who has spent more of the past 40 years bowhunting than gun hunting.

 Originally Posted By: BSK
Are you actually trying to say that bow hunters having been in the woods for over a month before any firearms season opens doesn't negatively affect the hunting for those who have to wait until gun season open? That's ludicrous. Of course bow hunters stinking up the woods and pressuring deer reduces the harvest opportunities for gun hunters.

Truth be know, if may be that we who bowhunt (in the early archery season segment) put more "pressure" on the deer than that larger group who gun hunts.

It's interesting to note so many accomplished bowhunters who "save" their best areas to hunt until November (since they don't want to "disturb" their best spots), then pick up a muzzleloader or centerfire for hunting the best times in their best places. Why is that? Could it be most of us are more "deer hunters" than a particular weapon enthusiast?

Yes, there is a relatively small group of "bowhunters" who maybe should be labeled "archery enthusiasts" who deer hunt, rather than throwing them in with the larger group of "bowhunters" who put their bows down and gun hunt when legal.

At least 90% of Tennessee's "bowhunters" seem to prefer to hunt with a firearm when it's legal. At the end of the day, most of us are "deer hunters", and we simply take advantage of our opportunities, part of which can be an early archery season segment. Tennessee's current weapon's season segments are in a good overall balance right now, with few adjustments being desired, much less necessary. I would prefer to see a simple 2-buck limit, but that has nothing to do with the weapon season segments, which are the best overall they've ever been.

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#3072179 - 12/10/12 09:14 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
Bayou Buck
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I thought we already has an all weapons season judging by all the rifle shots I hear early in the mornings during bow season.
Somebody needs to tell the locals that they havent changed the seasons yet \:\)

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#3072182 - 12/10/12 09:16 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
W.Seay
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Open rifle November 1st thru last day in January. 2 buck limit
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#3072186 - 12/10/12 09:18 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Bayou Buck]
Rubberduck270
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I'm with BSK on this one. Open "deer" season and let it go. Wouldn't mind seeing an Earn a Buck program going along with it and would like to see a 2 or 1 buck per year limit.

I'll leave it up to the biologists to determine what's best for the heard and I'll hunt the season's they establish.
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#3072200 - 12/10/12 09:26 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: catman529]
plinker22
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NO!
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#3072203 - 12/10/12 09:27 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Rubberduck270]
Wes Parrish
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 Originally Posted By: Rubberduck270
Wouldn't mind seeing an Earn a Buck program . . . . .

My experiences with "earn a buck" is that most who advocate have had little or no experience hunting under such rules, and/or are dishonest to the point they don't follow the rules.

I've bumped into several people who love "earn a buck" simply because they've decided those rules are for others to follow, not them, as they shoot the first buck they see, regardless of the rules.

For the most part, "Earn a buck" is a politically-correct fad, promoted by non-hunters. It is seldom needed, and mainly just penalizes honest hunters who follow the rules, particularly on a public hunting area or a "statewide" basis.

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#3072211 - 12/10/12 09:32 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Rubberduck270]
EastTNHunter
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 Originally Posted By: Rubberduck270
I'll leave it up to the biologists to determine what's best for the heard and I'll hunt the season's they establish.


That is a very noble point, RD. There are too many "armchair biologists" that see videos and hear the term QDM and think that the latest fad is best. I noticed that you stated your 'drathers (which I don't necessarily agree with), but qualified them by stating politely that they were your opinion. Way too many people get on here and spew venom thinking that their opinions are the be-all/end-all, rather than simply stating them as an opinion. I agree that we should leave management to the managers.

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#3072219 - 12/10/12 09:34 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Rubberduck270]
BowGirl
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Gun/mzzldr hunters (myself included) kill the vast majority of all the deer. We have 40 times the range of a archery equip. I dont know why some are crying. There's too much pressure as it is imo. Look at our trickle rut, nocturnal deer, bad age structure in many parts of the state. I dont see adding to all those negatives improving the hunting experience one bit, but whatever.
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#3072231 - 12/10/12 09:40 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: chiggerbit]
shwackmaster
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Same as is now but jan 1st to feb 1st bow only
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#3072280 - 12/10/12 09:59 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: shwackmaster]
caretaker
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I would be all for it as long as I can use handgranades and claymores and my presonal favorite an M60.
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#3072326 - 12/10/12 10:34 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: LETMWALK]
plinker22
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 Originally Posted By: LETMWALK
I WOULD LIKE TO SEE A 1 BUCK LIMIT AND YOU MUST KILL A DOE FIRST TO RECEIVE YOURE BUCK TAG!!!

You should have served that comment with popcorn! \:\)
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#3072563 - 12/10/12 01:07 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: plinker22]
MUP
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The "earn a buck" program would hit the crapper really quick if some here were relegated to hunting where there weren't enough does to shoot 3 a day, everyday. Once again, the herd structure isn't the same all over the state.
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#3072589 - 12/10/12 01:21 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: MUP]
EastTNHunter
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 Originally Posted By: MUP
The "earn a buck" program would hit the crapper really quick if some here were relegated to hunting where there weren't enough does to shoot 3 a day, everyday. Once again, the herd structure isn't the same all over the state.


But that don't matter for many supposed QDMers... One size fits all.

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#3072591 - 12/10/12 01:26 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: EastTNHunter]
woodchuckc
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An all weapons season would be fine with me, but I don't have any problem at all with the way seasons are set right now. I do like our current season layout a lot better than a few years ago with all the shuffling back and forth between muzzleloader and regular gun periods, and the "time outs".

I definitely do NOT like the earn a buck idea, and do not think it is necessary.

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#3072606 - 12/10/12 01:41 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: woodchuckc]
Urban_Hunter
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I've never witnessed BSK be so wrong about something \:\)

The truth is, everyone wants it set up the way it benefits them most. Gun only hunters want an open season, ML hunters want it combined with archery, and archers want it to stay the same. Wanting to eliminate archery season to extend gun season is selfish as well (even though I understand your argument that it is "more" selfish to want the woods to yourself as a bow hunter).

Personally, I have a lot invested in bow hunting (both time, labor, and mostly money). If there was no dedicated archery season I would never carry a bow into the woods again. Even though I love it and find it the most rewarding, I would not put myself at that disadvantage knowing the woods are full of hunters with guns. Therefore, I must vote to keep the season the same. PS: My opinion is the right one ;\)
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#3072613 - 12/10/12 01:44 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: EastTNHunter]
Bayou Buck
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 Originally Posted By: EastTNHunter
 Originally Posted By: MUP
The "earn a buck" program would hit the crapper really quick if some here were relegated to hunting where there weren't enough does to shoot 3 a day, everyday. Once again, the herd structure isn't the same all over the state.


But that don't matter for many supposed QDMers... One size fits all.


I practice QDM on my farm (Allowing bucks to reach an adult age of 2.5 yrs old) QDM and Trophy Management are two different things but sadly are beginning to blend together.

I am completely against any Earn a Buck program. In the area I hunt the deer are nowhere near the biological carrying capacity and my buck to doe ratio is pretty good. Shooting more does than necessary will not benefit the deer herd at all on my place. Also, if I wouldnt have shot a doe during bow season, that would mean I would have had to pass a 4.5 and a 5.5 yr old buck this year. Tell me how that would have benefitted anything!

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#3072658 - 12/10/12 02:12 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: MUP]
Redfred16
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 Originally Posted By: MUP
The "earn a buck" program would hit the crapper really quick if some here were relegated to hunting where there weren't enough does to shoot 3 a day, everyday. Once again, the herd structure isn't the same all over the state.


As someone who lived through "earn a buck" its the worst idea ever. It doesn't even help the reason we're told it was put in place. Finally Wisconsin DNR was forced to end it.
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#3072662 - 12/10/12 02:15 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Rubberduck270]
BigAl
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I'm fine with current weapon structure (crossbows during bow season, in-lines during mz, etc)
- I'm fine with season start and end dates

And the argument about crossbows during bow season is getting old AND rediculous. Get over it.
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#3072678 - 12/10/12 02:20 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
chiggerbit
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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: chiggerbit
 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: cecil30-30
Yes have just a deer season. open on oct 1-JAN 1 And any weapon is legal but yoyou have a set number of deer allowwed to take.


I've been advocating that for years, simply because I'm tired of hearing hunters argue over who should have the most hunting days, bow hunters versus gun hunters versus pistol hunters, etc.

Just make it deer season. Let hunters choose which weapon they want to hunt with.


Maybe you're not serious, but just because there's arguments and elitism among the ranks...? Clearly, the commission hasn't just arbitrarily set up the seasons as they are.


Actually, I'm quite serious. I would have no problem with just "deer" season (no individual weapons seasons).

You have to understand how all of these special weapons seasons got started. Back during the deer restoration effort, the primary deer season was gun season. Then advocates for hunting with more difficult/less effective (and rarely used weapons) lobbied for these "special" seasons. Considering very few hunters would participate in these seasons, they were enacted because their influence on annual deer harvests would be almost non-existant. In essence, they were allowed because the agency believed few deer would ever be killed during these special weapons season. Archery season was first adopted before the compound bow craze started. MZ season started when just a few people were shooting the first Hawken "kit" side-hammers (build them yourself). The "real" deer season was always gun season and these other special weapons season were just after-thoughts that would provide some opportunity for a few while doing no harm.

Yet the popularity of the seasons (because they offered more hunting time than gun season) grew to the point that now some participants in these seasons feel they somehow deserve their special time in the woods, and that their time should dominate all other weapon hunters' times.


Yes, lobbying is usually the reason for any legislation, but that doesn't mean the seasons aren't reasonable or valid.

Seems to me like the factors to consider are what works and weigh the intended outcomes with possible unintended consequences, not so much to try to forsee changes in attitude unless it affected behavior.

Entitlement is a nationwide epidemic, but do you really want guys with high powered rifles out in the woods everywhere all fall while the leaves are still on? For instance, would the seasons say the same at a place like Big South Fork? Would other folks that deer hunters share the woods with embrace an all weapons deer season starting so early in the year? And back to privilege and entitlement, would or could this "early" army of orange also develop a sense of entitlement that made the hikers, leaf watchers, and squirrel hunters they shared the woods with, a little resentful?

I'm just saying. I think they could leave well enough alone.

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#3072802 - 12/10/12 03:21 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
Wanting to eliminate archery season to extend gun season is selfish as well...


Really?

I think we would all agree that the vast majority of bow hunters also hunt during MZ season (either with bow or MZ) and gun season (with bow, MZ, or gun). So those bow hunting get to hunt all the days hunting is open, which this year is 99. Those who are gun-only hunters get 50 days of hunting this year. Now please explain to me how those only getting 50 days to hunt, and would also like 99 days to hunt like the bow-hunters currently get, are selfish? Honestly, I can't wait to hear your logic for this! \:\)
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#3072808 - 12/10/12 03:22 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Redfred16]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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 Originally Posted By: Redfred16
 Originally Posted By: MUP
The "earn a buck" program would hit the crapper really quick if some here were relegated to hunting where there weren't enough does to shoot 3 a day, everyday. Once again, the herd structure isn't the same all over the state.


As someone who lived through "earn a buck" its the worst idea ever. It doesn't even help the reason we're told it was put in place. Finally Wisconsin DNR was forced to end it.



I agree that Earn-A-Buck can end up being a disaster.
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#3072815 - 12/10/12 03:25 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: chiggerbit]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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 Originally Posted By: chiggerbit
Seems to me like the factors to consider are what works and weigh the intended outcomes with possible unintended consequences, not so much to try to forsee changes in attitude unless it affected behavior.

Entitlement is a nationwide epidemic, but do you really want guys with high powered rifles out in the woods everywhere all fall while the leaves are still on? For instance, would the seasons say the same at a place like Big South Fork? Would other folks that deer hunters share the woods with embrace an all weapons deer season starting so early in the year? And back to privilege and entitlement, would or could this "early" army of orange also develop a sense of entitlement that made the hikers, leaf watchers, and squirrel hunters they shared the woods with, a little resentful?

I'm just saying. I think they could leave well enough alone.


Great post chiggerbit. I don't think public hunting areas, nor areas shared with non-hunting activities, could withstand a long all-weapons season.
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#3072838 - 12/10/12 03:36 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
UTGrad
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Wow I post this and come back a few days later and there are 15 pages lol
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#3072932 - 12/10/12 04:29 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Urban_Hunter
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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
Wanting to eliminate archery season to extend gun season is selfish as well...


Really?

I think we would all agree that the vast majority of bow hunters also hunt during MZ season (either with bow or MZ) and gun season (with bow, MZ, or gun). So those bow hunting get to hunt all the days hunting is open, which this year is 99. Those who are gun-only hunters get 50 days of hunting this year. Now please explain to me how those only getting 50 days to hunt, and would also like 99 days to hunt like the bow-hunters currently get, are selfish? Honestly, I can't wait to hear your logic for this! \:\)



My point remains the same as stated in the first part of my post, if each individual could change the rules then they would... to better fit their individual wants/needs. By eliminating archery season to better fit your wants/needs you will be affecting others negatively whether you see it or not. I enjoy archery season more so than rifle for the exact reason you state... less competition/careless deer. I NEVER claimed that this is not selfish, in fact I stated that it is MORE selfish in my original post. I do however feel that it is fair. You can bow hunt if you want... there is no reason why you can't now that anyone can hunt with a x-bow. You can hunt 99 days just as well as I can, but it is more work and requires more skill. To wish the season away so that it is easier for you to kill deer and to get you in the woods the extra days is selfish... even if it less selfish than wanting the woods to yourself as a bow hunter... its still selfish. For archery to survive, there must be a dedicated archery season. Same goes for ML. If you want more days in the woods, get a bow. That is fair.
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#3072962 - 12/10/12 04:42 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
Wes Parrish
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Just to add a different perspective . . . . . . .

 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
For archery to survive, there must be a dedicated archery season. Same goes for ML.

Are you saying there would be no archery or black-powder enthusiasts if we didn't have "special" hunting seasons for members of this group?

Should archery and black-powder weapons become less popular with hunters, is that necessarily "bad"?

Many of the most enthused over archery and "special" guns don't even hunt. To me, it's more about HUNTING, than the weapon.

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#3072980 - 12/10/12 04:50 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: EastTNHunter]
Swamphunter
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 Originally Posted By: EastTNHunter
 Originally Posted By: MUP
The "earn a buck" program would hit the crapper really quick if some here were relegated to hunting where there weren't enough does to shoot 3 a day, everyday. Once again, the herd structure isn't the same all over the state.


But that don't matter for many supposed QDMers... One size fits all.


Why not "one size fits all"? That's how TWRA does the turkey regs. If you live in a county with 10 turkeys or 10 million, the regs are the same.

By the way, I'm being facetious about doing deer that way. I think TWRA does a great job with the deer management. Turkeys? Not so much.


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#3073018 - 12/10/12 05:09 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
Wanting to eliminate archery season to extend gun season is selfish as well...


Really?

I think we would all agree that the vast majority of bow hunters also hunt during MZ season (either with bow or MZ) and gun season (with bow, MZ, or gun). So those bow hunting get to hunt all the days hunting is open, which this year is 99. Those who are gun-only hunters get 50 days of hunting this year. Now please explain to me how those only getting 50 days to hunt, and would also like 99 days to hunt like the bow-hunters currently get, are selfish? Honestly, I can't wait to hear your logic for this! \:\)



My point remains the same as stated in the first part of my post, if each individual could change the rules then they would... to better fit their individual wants/needs.


Or simply wanting equality of hunting time. How is that selfish?


 Quote:
By eliminating archery season...


I don't want to eliminate bow hunting, just bow only hunting. Why can't the bow hunters share the woods?


 Quote:
...you will be affecting others negatively whether you see it or not.


Of course it would negatively affect bow hunters. I never said it wouldn't. But again, how is "Group A" (gun hunters) wanting the same number of days in the woods as "Group B" (bow hunters) selfish?


 Quote:
I enjoy archery season more so than rifle for the exact reason you state... less competition/careless deer. I NEVER claimed that this is not selfish, in fact I stated that it is MORE selfish in my original post. I do however feel that it is fair.


How is thsi fair? Fair suggests equality. This is not equality. Equality is everyone getting to hunt the same number of days with their weapon of choice. If you want to use a bow, so be it. I prefer to use a gun. If we both get to hunt the same number of days with our weapon of choice, that would be fair.


 Quote:
You can bow hunt if you want... there is no reason why you can't now that anyone can hunt with a x-bow. You can hunt 99 days just as well as I can, but it is more work and requires more skill. To wish the season away so that it is easier for you to kill deer and to get you in the woods the extra days is selfish...


This has nothing to do with how "easy" or "hard" a weapon is to use. This all about fairness. So you get to hunt with your weaponof choice, but if i want to hunt, I have to use your weapon of choice, not mine? And that's fair? Don't think so...

 Quote:
...even if it less selfish than wanting the woods to yourself as a bow hunter... its still selfish.


So when people ask for equality of rights, that's selfishness? Hmmm, strange definition of selfishness.


 Quote:
For archery to survive, there must be a dedicated archery season. Same goes for ML.


Whether a type of weapon continues to be used is of no interest. We're talking fairness and selfishness here.


 Quote:
If you want more days in the woods, get a bow. That is fair.


No, getting to hunt with the weapon I personally want, and you getting to hunt with the weapon you prefer, for the same number of days, is fair.
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#3073055 - 12/10/12 05:28 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Pinwheeled]
Timber Ghost
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NO
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#3073064 - 12/10/12 05:32 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
KPH
10 Point


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Posts: 3155
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It an't going to happen to much money to be made like it is.
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#3073082 - 12/10/12 05:42 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Master Chief
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Wow, this post is getting crazy. It seems no hunter will ever be happy in TN. Life isn't fair. We should all realize that you can't always get what you want. In all honesty I don't care what our season is like. My suggestion for the TWRA is to continue doing their best to manage the herd health, numbers, age structure or whatever. If it would work, I'm sure the TWRA would let us have a 365 day bazooka season and kill 50 bucks a year. On the other hand "bowhunters" need to realize that we can't go to 100% compound bow hunting. There are too many deer for that to work as the harvest number would drop greatly.

Edited by Master Chief (12/10/12 05:43 PM)
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#3073128 - 12/10/12 06:03 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
BowGuy84
10 Point


Registered: 09/16/07
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 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish

To me, it's more about HUNTING, than the weapon.


I agree. I hunt with the maximum effective weapon legal most times. I love how lethal I feel when I get a gun or MZL in my hands after a long bow season.

That being said, I love bowhunting. It makes gun hunting seem easy. I don't know how I would handle a "deer season" and I would be more worried about how the deer would handle it...

Plus I love the solitude and quiet of bowhunting. Maybe it is selfish. I don't mean to detract from others experience, but it is what I know and what I enjoy the most.

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#3073146 - 12/10/12 06:14 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Master Chief]
BSK
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Don't worry Master Chief, I have no problem with out current seasons or bag limits (although I wouldn't mind shifting the opening of MZ a week earlier). My whole point in this thread is simply to force those bow hunters that have deluded themselves into thinking that they somehow deserve a separate season to face the selfishness and falicies of that argument. I do this in such an aggressive manner because this tends to irritate people, which in turn makes them react more emotionally, and emotional reactions tend to expose real motivations.

In esssence, I'm being an a-hole on purpose to get people riled up. Once riled, they will expose their real belief system, and that is what I'm trying to bring out.
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#3073170 - 12/10/12 06:25 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Coach
16 Point


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 Originally Posted By: BSK
Don't worry Master Chief, I have no problem with out current seasons or bag limits (although I wouldn't mind shifting the opening of MZ a week earlier). My whole point in this thread is simply to force those bow hunters that have deluded themselves into thinking that they somehow deserve a separate season to face the selfishness and falicies of that argument. I do this in such an aggressive manner because this tends to irritate people, which in turn makes them react more emotionally, and emotional reactions tend to expose real motivations.

In esssence, I'm being an a-hole on purpose to get people riled up. Once riled, they will expose their real belief system, and that is what I'm trying to bring out.


Well, aren't you the Dr Phil! Schoolin' us po' folk... \:D \:D
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#3073174 - 12/10/12 06:26 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
deerhunter10
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If gun hunters don't want to wait til ml season or rifle season. Then but bow hunt it's simple especially now that cross bows are legal.
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#3073181 - 12/10/12 06:28 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Master Chief
8 Point


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 Originally Posted By: BSK
Don't worry Master Chief, I have no problem with out current seasons or bag limits (although I wouldn't mind shifting the opening of MZ a week earlier). My whole point in this thread is simply to force those bow hunters that have deluded themselves into thinking that they somehow deserve a separate season to face the selfishness and falicies of that argument. I do this in such an aggressive manner because this tends to irritate people, which in turn makes them react more emotionally, and emotional reactions tend to expose real motivations.

In esssence, I'm being an a-hole on purpose to get people riled up. Once riled, they will expose their real belief system, and that is what I'm trying to bring out.


No worries.. I find the smart-a version BSK quite funny! I remember you mentioning you had a smart-a side when it came to elitists in the thread thanking you for everything you do, I didn't believe you.. now I do \:D
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#3073191 - 12/10/12 06:34 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
If gun hunters don't want to wait til ml season or rifle season. Then but bow hunt it's simple especially now that cross bows are legal.


I've got an easier way. Simply allow any weapon during the entire season. If the deer population can withstand that level of harvest pressure, then what's wrong with giving everyone the same amount of days to hunt on the same calendar days with whatever weapon they want to carry?
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#3073195 - 12/10/12 06:37 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Master Chief]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: Master Chief
I remember you mentioning you had a smart-a side when it came to elitists in the thread thanking you for everything you do, I didn't believe you.. now I do \:D


Welcome to the world of BSK the a-hole!

Notice how many of the old-timers on this site don't even bother to respond to me? They know I'm just in "rile the newbies" mode.
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#3073244 - 12/10/12 06:57 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Kirk Moderator
Farmer and Gunfighter
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Registered: 08/07/01
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 Originally Posted By: BSK

Welcome to the world of BSK the a-hole!

Notice how many of the old-timers on this site don't even bother to respond to me? They know I'm just in "rile the newbies" mode.


Most of us have heard the wind blow before. \:D

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#3073252 - 12/10/12 07:04 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Kirk]
Kirk Moderator
Farmer and Gunfighter
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I use to bow hunt a lot in the 80's and 90's. Then I got on a MZ kick and used it exclusively during rifle season. Now I am back to just hunting with whatever strikes my fancy that day.

I have a recurve, compound and a crossbow. I use them all during archery season.

If center fire rifle was allowed during "archery' season I would use it if I was on a big buck.

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#3073254 - 12/10/12 07:05 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
deerhunter10
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Gun hunters put more pressure on the deer then bow hunter's. There are more of them. So if you take away the month of bow season it is a disadvantage for the bow hunters. Because the deer are more skittish and way more pressured.
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#3073264 - 12/10/12 07:13 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Coach
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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: Master Chief
I remember you mentioning you had a smart-a side when it came to elitists in the thread thanking you for everything you do, I didn't believe you.. now I do \:D


Welcome to the world of BSK the a-hole!

Notice how many of the old-timers on this site don't even bother to respond to me? They know I'm just in "rile the newbies" mode.


Some of us old timers help where we can...what was that guys name that was on here and always the a-hole...I kinda miss those days!


Edited by Coach (12/10/12 07:13 PM)
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#3073481 - 12/10/12 08:59 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Coach]
UTGrad
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I do believe that if TN allowed all weapons starting Octobber 1st the fields and woods would be shot to pieces.
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#3073552 - 12/10/12 09:41 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: UTGrad]
Wes Parrish
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Doesn't Georgia open its "all weapons" season in October?
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#3073852 - 12/11/12 07:37 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
Gun hunters put more pressure on the deer then bow hunter's. There are more of them. So if you take away the month of bow season it is a disadvantage for the bow hunters. Because the deer are more skittish and way more pressured.


Yes, more hunters does put more pressure on the deer, which would be a disadvantage to those who currently bow hunt. But who cares, beyond those bow hunters? They have no special right to hunt less pressured deer.

If it would do no harm to the deer population, open that part of the season up to everybody. That provides more hunting opportunty to far more people than it would harm (bow hunters are a minority of hunters).
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#3073855 - 12/11/12 07:38 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish
Doesn't Georgia open its "all weapons" season in October?


In parts of South Carolina, gun season open September 1.
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#3073955 - 12/11/12 08:55 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
deerhunter10
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Granted they are the minority but can the person complaining about not having that month to hunt go buy a bow and hunt? Yes they can. Plus all of the other problems it would cause. Licenses would go up, hunting industry would go down in tn. All of the archery shops that would most likely go out of business. I think it would cause much more trouble then it would please people going to it.
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#3074077 - 12/11/12 10:32 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
Hunter 257W
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I say to let the Bow hunters have/keep October! I wouldn't sit out there in the ticks, snakes, mosquitoes, poison oak/ivy, etc. wiping sweat for the biggest buck in TN. \:\)
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#3074108 - 12/11/12 10:48 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
Granted they are the minority but can the person complaining about not having that month to hunt go buy a bow and hunt? Yes they can.


But you want to hunt with a bow. What if others don't? If a long all-weapons season would do no harm to the deer herd, why not implement it? That gives the maximum number of hunters the maximum hunting opportunities. That sounds like the best deal going to me. Every hunter gets the same number of hunting days with their weapon of choice. THAT is fair.
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#3074368 - 12/11/12 01:22 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
UTGrad
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Season structure is great the way it is...best it's ever been. It's clear that everyone is happy lol
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#3074406 - 12/11/12 01:43 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
BigAl
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 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
Gun hunters put more pressure on the deer then bow hunter's. There are more of them. So if you take away the month of bow season it is a disadvantage for the bow hunters. Because the deer are more skittish and way more pressured.

With this rationale, I would think this would provide support for doing away with bow season in October, and make deer season any weapon from Nov 1 - Jan 1. Why should only the bow hunters be awarded the opportunity to hunt deer that haven't been pressured?
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#3074413 - 12/11/12 01:49 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
deerhunter10
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Ill say this if tn does end up going to one i think it'll open up a can of worm's that they don't want open. It'll hurt the sport of hunting in tn.
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#3074418 - 12/11/12 01:52 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
deerhunter10
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Plus if you want to get technical gun hunters actually get the best month to hunt if anything i would like everything to start a week earlier. And it is harder to kill a deer with a bow that's why i think they should be able to have the month that they do. I'm not saying it is our right to have it but i sure do enjoy it and if some of the gun hunters would give it a try they would to.
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#3074432 - 12/11/12 02:01 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
Plus if you want to get technical gun hunters actually get the best month to hunt...


Right, like bow hunters stop hunting at the end of bow season. Bow hunters currently get 99 days of hunting (bow/MZ/gun seasons), late September through early January, with 35 of them in September and October with no competition from other weapons hunters. Let's let everyone have 99 days of hunting with their weapon of choice.
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#3074433 - 12/11/12 02:01 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
Ill say this if tn does end up going to one i think it'll open up a can of worm's that they don't want open. It'll hurt the sport of hunting in tn.


No it won't. Just bow hunting. ;\)
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#3074445 - 12/11/12 02:08 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
deerhunter10
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Plus if we go to all weapon season do you not think our deer herd would take a big hit?? I am asking in all honestly i know you the biologist. Here's my logic please correct me if i am wrong bsk. If you give people the chance to hunt with a gun the whole season a whole lot more deer would be killed. They would e pressured like crazy plus more deer would diffenetly be killed. I believe that the deer herd would take a pretty big hit with an all weapon season especially year after year of doing it.
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#3074455 - 12/11/12 02:11 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
Plus if we go to all weapon season do you not think our deer herd would take a big hit?? I am asking in all honestly i know you the biologist.


That would have to be monitored very closely. I suspect bag limits would need to be reduced to prevent over-harvest during a 3+ month any-weapon season.
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#3074464 - 12/11/12 02:15 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
deerhunter10
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Suppose we went to it what would you think the bag limit would be?
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#3074482 - 12/11/12 02:24 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
Suppose we went to it what would you think the bag limit would be?


I have no idea. But I think it would be smart to lower it more than you think is needed for the first year, for safety sake, and then once participation and hunter harvest were assessed for a few years, slowly liberalize the limits up to the maximum number of deer allowable without doing harm.

But even with the very long seasons we have now, I think most hunters would find it shocking just how few deer are currently being taken under our liberal limits and long seasons.

A few "amazing" facts:

Only 1/3 of deer hunters in TN kill even one buck in a given year.

Only around 45% of hunters kill even one deer in a given year.

Only a tiny percentage of deer hunters (a few percent) kill 3 bucks in a given year.

Even in Unit L, where the doe limit is three per day for over 3 months, doe harvests often don't equal buck harvest. It is very common in Unit L counties for buck kills to still outnumber doe kills, even with an annual bag limit disparity of 300+ does to 3 bucks.
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#3074491 - 12/11/12 02:29 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
UTGrad
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BSK

You are an excellent resource and great member of tndeer.

I just want to say that TN would never go to a shorter, all weapons system lol

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#3074505 - 12/11/12 02:35 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: UTGrad]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: UTGrad
I just want to say that TN would never go to a shorter, all weapons system lol


It wouldn't need to be shorter, just adjust bag limits to prevent over-harvest.

Although I agree. We will probably never see just "deer season," with weapon choice up to the hunter. Bow and MZ seasons are too deeply ingrained now. They have become part of the traditions of the state, whether they are biologically needed or not.
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#3074511 - 12/11/12 02:39 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: UTGrad]
deerhunter10
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Oh yeah i believe you that's why i want to lower it any way. Noone out of our group has ever tagged out
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#3074518 - 12/11/12 02:42 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
Outdoor Enthusiast
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I am not so concerned with the bow hunting discussion.

However, I would much prefer rifle season to begin Nov 1. I hate carrying a MZ to the woods during the best hunting of the year in my area.

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#3074520 - 12/11/12 02:45 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Outdoor Enthusiast]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: Outdoor Enthusiast
However, I would much prefer rifle season to begin Nov 1. I hate carrying a MZ to the woods during the best hunting of the year in my area.


I would love to see every hunter able to hunt the peak of the rut in their local area with the weapon of their choice. And for TN, it appears the peak of breeding occurs over a range of dates from early November through early January, depending on the location.
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#3074523 - 12/11/12 02:50 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
deerhunter10
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I am not a fan of an all weapon season. However if that is what the people want then the people that don't will have to deal with it. I will say this back in bow season i wish i would have had a gun i would had killed my biggest buck ever but he skirted me. But that is the fun of bow season!!
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#3074529 - 12/11/12 02:53 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
BSK
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 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
But that is the fun of bow season!!


I'm not sure I would call it "fun" (being forced to watch a buck of a lifetime walk by out of bow-range), but I can easily say I learned more about deer behavior and woodsmanship skills from bow hunting than any other type of hunting. All my years of bow-hunting were a great learning experience.
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#3074534 - 12/11/12 02:56 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Hunter 257W
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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
Suppose we went to it what would you think the bag limit would be?


I have no idea. But I think it would be smart to lower it more than you think is needed for the first year, for safety sake, and then once participation and hunter harvest were assessed for a few years, slowly liberalize the limits up to the maximum number of deer allowable without doing harm.

But even with the very long seasons we have now, I think most hunters would find it shocking just how few deer are currently being taken under our liberal limits and long seasons.

A few "amazing" facts:

Only 1/3 of deer hunters in TN kill even one buck in a given year.

Only around 45% of hunters kill even one deer in a given year.

Only a tiny percentage of deer hunters (a few percent) kill 3 bucks in a given year.

Even in Unit L, where the doe limit is three per day for over 3 months, doe harvests often don't equal buck harvest. It is very common in Unit L counties for buck kills to still outnumber doe kills, even with an annual bag limit disparity of 300+ does to 3 bucks.


I know this is true from reading past TWRA Harvest reports. I try to keep it in mind too when reacting to discussions about reducing the buck limits as it's obvious that reducing the buck limit would have no real impact whatsoever. Still sometimes I react emotionally to those game hogs killing all the big bucks! ;\)

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#3074538 - 12/11/12 03:01 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
deerhunter10
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It is fun atleast to me! I mean it's a giant chess match with big deer. As i have stated over and over on here to me it's not about the kill some of my best hunts ever i never even got the bow or gun off the hook. It's about the experience. Bow hunting is a blast but don't get me wrong by ml season i am ready to hang up the bow, but i would never vote to go all weapons all the time.
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#3075308 - 12/12/12 04:50 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
MUP
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 Originally Posted By: BSK
 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
Plus if we go to all weapon season do you not think our deer herd would take a big hit?? I am asking in all honestly i know you the biologist.


That would have to be monitored very closely. I suspect bag limits would need to be reduced to prevent over-harvest during a 3+ month any-weapon season.


Then that is yet another reason I wouldn't be for it. Folks are gonna keep on complaining till they get something they really don't want imo. The season/weapon/bag limits are fine the way they are.

And remember, this is an SE Tn guy talking here, not a 3 doe a day unit hunter. I saw 3 does yesterday evening right at dark, and I count that as a good day in the woods. ;\)
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#3075431 - 12/12/12 07:46 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: MUP]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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 Originally Posted By: MUP
Folks are gonna keep on complaining till they get something they really don't want imo. The season/weapon/bag limits are fine the way they are.


Other than a few minor tweeks I would love to see, I completely agree with that.
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#3075441 - 12/12/12 07:54 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
contendershooter
4 Point


Registered: 12/07/12
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I will say this, when I proposed allowing the use of single shot rifles and slug guns last year during muzzleloader season, I spoke with TWRA and some commissioners on their pros and cons of the proposal, and on the biology side it wasn't as big of a concern as it was on the law enforcement side. It seems they knew they could adjust the season if need be, but since its only a two week period, the overall statewide impact is minimum. Your not going to see more deer just because you have a different weapon, the only change is you may be able to have a better shooting opportunity or you may have a few more hunters, but nothing devastating to the herd.
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#3075482 - 12/12/12 08:34 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: contendershooter]
BSK
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I don't work for the TWRA, so I'm not privy to their internal discussions, but from conversations I've had with the TWRA personnel, they have stressed that their season/bag-limit discussions have usually revolved around a philosophy of providing the largest number of hunters with the maximum opportunities to hunt, and the maximum opportunity to kill deer, without doing harm to the deer herd. I think that is a great philosophy. As long as no harm is being done to the resource, why not provide the most people with the most time to hunt and the maximum number of deer they can kill?

Unfortunately, that philosophy, which benefits the most hunters, is often up against entrenched minority groups who want to limit others hunting time so they get more hunting time with less competition from other hunters, and the opportunity to hunt "less pressured" deer. That selfish goal, and the minority groups that push it, really irk me.
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#3075617 - 12/12/12 10:05 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


Registered: 10/15/12
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Loc: TN

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 Originally Posted By: BSK


Unfortunately, that philosophy, which benefits the most hunters, is often up against entrenched minority groups who want to limit others hunting time so they get more hunting time with less competition from other hunters, and the opportunity to hunt "less pressured" deer. That selfish goal, and the minority groups that push it, really irk me.


Ha, you make us sound like terrorists. Entrenched minority groups?
We are not entrenched nor are we a "minority group". We are not an organized group and do not hold rallies to fight off the machine of Big Gun Socialists. It also isn't a goal, your proposal would be a goal considering that it is something you want but do not have. I wish you would also realize that we do not want to limit others hunting time. I have never met a hunter that I haven't tried to peer pressure into bow hunting. It would suit me just fine if every single gun hunter owned a bow. IM NOT JOKING, GO GET A BOW OR X-BOW YOU WON'T OFFEND ANYONE BY INVADING THEIR PRIVATE BOW SEASON SANCTUARY ONLY OFFERED TO GUN HUNTERS A MIND BLOWING 50+ DAYS A YEAR. Bow hunters don't walk and stalk, shoot at deer running, shoot at deer they jump up, etc. I think that this is what pressures the deer. Bow hunters actually TRY to keep the pressure down, where as (especially on public land) I see orange vests walking around ALL DAY LONG! When asked what they are doing... they are "scouting"... during season on a Saturday at lunch time...???? Bow hunters are just more aware of pressure because it is more important. It's not that we want to keep the woods to ourselves, its that we would drastically kill our chances trying to bow hunt while you are stomping around shooting at deer with a rifle all day. (I know that's how you hunt, I spy on you from my airplane). You don't have to admit it, but I know you get my point. You also know that you can shoot a x-bow if you want an easy hunt AND more days in the woods. You just like stirring the pot.

As for your earlier A-Hole and "riling the newbies" comment, I think it is a true shame that the most knowledgeable asset to this site for deer behavior and management takes pride in being an A-Hole to newbies. Please realize that newbies to this site are more than likely not newbie hunters, and we all have something to give and take from this site. Trying to run them in the ground by being Big Pete does not help anyone but your ego. I love your input when it comes to anything technical, but I hate that you think it's cool that the older members "look the other way" when you are expressing your "Jerkasourous" title.


Edited by Urban_Hunter (12/12/12 10:19 AM)
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#3075655 - 12/12/12 10:36 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
MUP
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Dang. I don't think all "orange vests" are as you say either Urban Hunter. I know I'm not. And I'd venture to say that some bow hunters are the same as well. Just my opinion.
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#3075666 - 12/12/12 10:44 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: MUP]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


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 Originally Posted By: MUP
Dang. I don't think all "orange vests" are as you say either Urban Hunter. I know I'm not. And I'd venture to say that some bow hunters are the same as well. Just my opinion.


No, many gun hunters are not. I'm an "orange vest" too during gun season, and this isn't how I hunt. But, I have killed deer while walking in/out of the woods. I think when deer see someone walking, see them shoot, see their buddy die, run away... that is when they become pressured. When deer see someone walking, see them stop, see them walk away... they do not see you as a serious threat. That was my point, not that gun hunters are wild and crazy, just that by nature it puts more pressure on the deer.

I gun hunt the full gun season... with a gun. I know I am less concerned about everything that pressures deer, from scent to sound, when it comes that time of year. Its because it is less important. 100 yds in gun season is 10 yds in bow season.


Edited by Urban_Hunter (12/12/12 10:44 AM)
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#3075670 - 12/12/12 10:48 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
TNDeerGuy
12 Point


Registered: 11/28/06
Posts: 5892
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 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
 Originally Posted By: BSK


Unfortunately, that philosophy, which benefits the most hunters, is often up against entrenched minority groups who want to limit others hunting time so they get more hunting time with less competition from other hunters, and the opportunity to hunt "less pressured" deer. That selfish goal, and the minority groups that push it, really irk me.


Ha, you make us sound like terrorists. Entrenched minority groups?
We are not entrenched nor are we a "minority group". We are not an organized group and do not hold rallies to fight off the machine of Big Gun Socialists. It also isn't a goal, your proposal would be a goal considering that it is something you want but do not have. I wish you would also realize that we do not want to limit others hunting time. I have never met a hunter that I haven't tried to peer pressure into bow hunting. It would suit me just fine if every single gun hunter owned a bow. IM NOT JOKING, GO GET A BOW OR X-BOW YOU WON'T OFFEND ANYONE BY INVADING THEIR PRIVATE BOW SEASON SANCTUARY ONLY OFFERED TO GUN HUNTERS A MIND BLOWING 50+ DAYS A YEAR. Bow hunters don't walk and stalk, shoot at deer running, shoot at deer they jump up, etc. I think that this is what pressures the deer. Bow hunters actually TRY to keep the pressure down, where as (especially on public land) I see orange vests walking around ALL DAY LONG! When asked what they are doing... they are "scouting"... during season on a Saturday at lunch time...???? Bow hunters are just more aware of pressure because it is more important. It's not that we want to keep the woods to ourselves, its that we would drastically kill our chances trying to bow hunt while you are stomping around shooting at deer with a rifle all day. (I know that's how you hunt, I spy on you from my airplane). You don't have to admit it, but I know you get my point. You also know that you can shoot a x-bow if you want an easy hunt AND more days in the woods. You just like stirring the pot.

As for your earlier A-Hole and "riling the newbies" comment, I think it is a true shame that the most knowledgeable asset to this site for deer behavior and management takes pride in being an A-Hole to newbies. Please realize that newbies to this site are more than likely not newbie hunters, and we all have something to give and take from this site. Trying to run them in the ground by being Big Pete does not help anyone but your ego. I love your input when it comes to anything technical, but I hate that you think it's cool that the older members "look the other way" when you are expressing your "Jerkasourous" title.


Great post Urban, I couldn't agree more—trolling, regardless of who it is or the reason, is a very immature/unneccesary way to get a point across.

I do believe that if BSK hunted public land only, like a significant portion of us do, instead of his well-managed private land, his position/attitude would very likely change.
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#3075672 - 12/12/12 10:52 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


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I guess what I'm getting at, is that it isn't the sheer number of hunters that bow hunters are worried about. It is the style of hunting we are worried about. I think if the season went like BSK suggests I would probably kill at least as many, if not more deer per year as I do now. It is just more enjoyable and rewarding to kill them with a bow, and I would not carry a bow if I could carry a rifle. I think the season is balanced pretty well now and gives everyone the same opportunities. If BSK was SERIOUSLY concerned about hunting the extra days, I think he would bow hunt. Other than "I just don't want to", I would like to hear his reason for not bow hunting. As honestly as I can possibly be, I truly don't agree with BSK suggesting that we want the woods to ourselves. We are more than happy to share them with all, and now TWRA makes that possible with the semi-new X-Bow laws. Anyone of any age that can hunt with a gun can feasibly hunt with a bow. I just don't see how this is unfair.
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#3075675 - 12/12/12 10:53 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
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Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN

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Again, let's keep in perspective that a super-majority of "bowhunters" are also orange-vested "gun hunters" who kill most of their deer with a gun.

Most "bowhunters" would all but stop bowhunting should rifles be legalized during what has traditionally been archery season. I'm not wanting that to happen, but if if did, imo, as soon as the "new" wore off, we would again see relatively few hunters in the woods (regardless of weapons in hands) on the traditional early archery days?

Why? Because the hunters wouldn't see that many deer in the warmer weather and pre-rut. Most hunters would still do more of their deer hunting in November, although by shifting some of their vacation days spent hunting to Sept-Oct, we might actually see fewer gun hunters during November?

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#3075682 - 12/12/12 10:55 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: TNDeerGuy]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


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Loc: TN

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 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy


Great post Urban, I couldn't agree more—trolling, regardless of who it is or the reason, is a very immature/unneccesary way to get a point across.

I do believe that if BSK hunted public land only, like a significant portion of us do, instead of his well-managed private land, his position/attitude would very likely change.


Thanks. And I think you are right, I think a large portion of us hunt public land and these lands cannot compare to vast ranges of privately managed land.
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#3075683 - 12/12/12 10:56 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 18645
Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN

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 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
It is just more enjoyable and rewarding to kill them with a bow, and I would not carry a bow if I could carry a rifle.

Perhaps your issue is more with yourself than with the orange-vested gun hunters?

If you truly find it more enjoyable and rewarding to kill them with a bow, then why would you CHOOSE to hunt with a gun?

Perhaps you're a lot like me in that in reality you're more a deer hunter than a bowhunter? \:\)

 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
. . . . a large portion of us hunt public land and these lands cannot compare to vast ranges of privately managed land.

But most hunters hunting private land are NOT hunting "vast ranges" of intensely "managed" land, and that includes BSK.

I personally enjoy hunting a variety of areas, and have taken 3 of my past 5 bucks on public land, with those 3 each being taken on a totally different WMA. Many of you have little basis for comparison and are only assuming the grass must be greener on the other side of the fence. Much of the public land hunting is better than much of the private land hunting.

I've been hunting Tennessee's public lands since back in the 70's. The overall quality of the deer hunting, and the lack of hunting pressure, has never been better. Not saying some days and some areas are not heavily hunted, but am saying it's a better situation now across TN than it was in the past.

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#3075685 - 12/12/12 10:56 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
deerhunter10
10 Point


Registered: 08/21/12
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Good post urban hunter. And wes i highly doubt most of them would not take off sept and oct and hunt in the heat.
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#3075693 - 12/12/12 11:01 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
BlountArrow
8 Point


Registered: 07/13/12
Posts: 2336
Loc: SouthEast Tenn

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 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
....As for your earlier A-Hole and "riling the newbies" comment, I think it is a true shame that the most knowledgeable asset to this site for deer behavior and management takes pride in being an A-Hole to newbies. Please realize that newbies to this site are more than likely not newbie hunters, and we all have something to give and take from this site. Trying to run them in the ground by being Big Pete does not help anyone but your ego. I love your input when it comes to anything technical, but I hate that you think it's cool that the older members "look the other way" when you are expressing your "Jerkasourous" title.


Now you've done it! There is no way BeeKeeper will let you talk about BSK that way. You're in for a good keyboard lashing.
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#3075702 - 12/12/12 11:10 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 1469
Loc: TN

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 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish



Perhaps you're a lot like me in that in reality you're more a deer hunter than a bowhunter? \:\)

But most hunters hunting private land are NOT hunting "vast ranges" of intensely "managed" land, and that includes BSK.



I am more of a deer hunter than a bow hunter, I just don't want to see bow season abolished as BSK wishes. I have zero problems with "orange vests", as I have stated, I enlist ever November. I love gun season... just as much as I love Bow Season

As for BSK's private land, he has thousands of cameras, stands, etc all over it (I can see them from my plane). I can assure you these are luxuries that can not be had on public land... for long anyways.


Edited by Urban_Hunter (12/12/12 11:11 AM)
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#3075705 - 12/12/12 11:13 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
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 Originally Posted By: deerhunter10
And wes i highly doubt most of them would not take off sept and oct and hunt in the heat.

I figure if we went to an all weapons season (like South Carolina did), yes, many hunters would shift their deer-hunting vacation days from November to September & October.

But what would be the end result?

For most, they would then be hunting less in November.
Sure, lots more deer would be killed in Sept & Oct than in prior years. Only to be followed by less hunting and less deer being killed in November. Kinda balances out.

After a year or two of seeing fewer deer and not enjoying the hunting as much in September & October, the woods would go back to being relatively empty during this time-frame that's traditionally been "bow season".

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#3075707 - 12/12/12 11:16 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BlountArrow]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


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 Originally Posted By: BlountArrow


Now you've done it! There is no way BeeKeeper will let you talk about BSK that way. You're in for a good keyboard lashing.


LOL, I'm not trying to talk bad about anyone. I just said it is a shame to bully the new guys, especially when you possess the largest piece of the deer knowledge pie. It is even a bigger shame to take pride in running the new guys off. I just wish everyone could express their opinion without being scared of Big Pete's lashing.
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#3075708 - 12/12/12 11:18 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 18645
Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN

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 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
As for BSK's private land, he has thousands of cameras, stands, etc all over it (I can see them from my plane). I can assure you these are luxuries that can not be had on public land... for long anyways.

BSK is a personal friend of mine, I've seen his land, and know quite a bit about his land and hunting.

His hunting land (the only place I've known him to hunt in over a decade) consists of 400 and something acres. He shares that hunting with about a dozen other family & friends hunting it. The only bucks protected from harvest are buttons and yearlings. True, he does have a lot of cams and stands on it, and they do a good job with hunter coordination, i.e. communicating where everyone is hunting on a daily basis. But by no means does this qualify as "vast acreage" that is intensely managed for trophy bucks. It's just not. The quality of the hunting on BSK's place is mainly due to communications between the hunters hunting it. They don't "mess up" each other's hunting, as is commonly seen on a lot of public and private land.

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#3075711 - 12/12/12 11:20 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 1469
Loc: TN

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 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish


After a year or two of seeing fewer deer and not enjoying the hunting as much in September & October, the woods would go back to being relatively empty during this time-frame that's traditionally been "bow season".


I have heard this numerous times and it is interesting to me. Do most of you see more deer in November than you do in October? Maybe it is just my areas, but I see a LOT more deer during bow season than I do during November, December. But, I believe it has a lot to do with pressure and I hunt some Heavy Pressure areas.
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#3075713 - 12/12/12 11:28 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


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 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish


His hunting land (the only place I've known him to hunt in over a decade) consists of 400 and something acres. He shares that hunting with about a dozen other family & friends hunting it. The only bucks protected from harvest are buttons and yearlings. True, he does have a lot of cams and stands on it, and they do a good job with hunter coordination, i.e. communicating where everyone is hunting on a daily basis. But by no means does this qualify as "vast acreage" that is intensely managed for trophy bucks. It's just not. The quality of he hunting on BSK's place is mainly due to communications between the hunters hunting it. They don't "mess up" each other's hunting, as is commonly seen on a lot of public and private land.


I promise I'm not trying to argue. I'm just trying to make sure we look at it from all perspectives. BSK has all the same public land that I have to hunt. On top of this, BSK has 400+ acres to hunt. He chooses to hunt on his 400+ acres more so than public land because it is better hunting. If the grass wasn't greener he wouldn't be hunting on it... right?
All I'm saying is, 400 acres is about 300 more acres of private land than I have to hunt (that I also share with family/owners). And, I'm pretty sure I have about 100 more acres of private land than the vast majority of public land hunters. Would you agree?


Edited by Urban_Hunter (12/12/12 11:34 AM)
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#3075720 - 12/12/12 11:33 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
deerhunter10
10 Point


Registered: 08/21/12
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^^ i see way more deer in bow season also way more deer.i don't hunt very pressured areas it's just crazy how much even a little gun hunting has on movement. Don't get me wrong i gun hunt also mainly because by the time ml season is past and opening weekend has past so much pressure has been on them that it is extremely tough to see mature bucks in daylight much less in bow range. Although i do take both with me in many cases.
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#3075722 - 12/12/12 11:35 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
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Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN

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 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
He chooses to hunt on his 400+ acres more so than public land because it is better hunting. If the grass wasn't greener he wouldn't be hunting on it... right?

I'd say he chooses to hunt on HIS 400+ acres mostly as a matter of convenience and pride, and not because the hunting is necessarily any better than some nearby land he COULD hunt. But to what extent "his" hunting might be better on that particular area, HE is the person who worked so hard to make it better by the decisions he made and time he's spent working to make his hunting there better. That's not something I begrudge, as I believe most better hunting opportunities are earned, not given.

This is kinda like a person owning a home, and not CHOOSING to spend the night in a motel on the other side of town. BSK can simply walk out his back door and go hunting, so it would be an unnecessary inconvenience for him to hunt elsewhere. On the other hand, I'm in a similar situation, yet I periodically enjoy hunting a lot of different public lands simply for a change of scenery.

Generally speaking, where most of us hunt boils down to a matter of priorities. I decided a long time ago that if I didn't spend my money on the latest deer-hunting gimmicks, if I would buy used vehicles instead of new, if I wouldn't buy a new gun or bow every year or two, etc., etc., etc., THEN I could maybe afford some better places to deer hunt.

I often hear the complaints about public land hunting, coming from a young man driving a brand new Ford F-150 4x4, pulling a trailer with a new ATV, as he pulls out his newest high-tech bow, complaining about there being too much pressure on this particular WMA. Of course there are exceptions, but where most of us hunt boils down more to those priorities and prior choices rather than those exceptions. Legalize breech-loading centerfires for use during what has been the "muzzleloader" season, and many hunters will choose to buy a new gun rather than look for a better place to hunt. That's freedom of choice, and a matter of priority.

Being from West TN, the choice was once we had to drive to the public lands of the Cherokee National Forest to go deer hunting (no deer season in West TN). Now, we can go out the back door, yet still enjoy those occasional road trips, whether to the Cherokee NF (where there is maybe 10% as much hunting pressure as there was 30 to 40 years ago), or to one of the many public WMA's now open "same as statewide".

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#3075749 - 12/12/12 11:54 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 1469
Loc: TN

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 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish

I'd say he chooses to hunt on HIS 400+ acres mostly as a matter of convenience and pride, and not because the hunting is necessarily any better than some nearby land he COULD hunt.

This is kinda like a person owning a home, and not CHOOSING to spend the night in a motel on the other side of town. BSK can simply walk out his back door and go hunting, so it would be an unnecessary inconvenience for him to hunt elsewhere. On the other hand, I'm in a similar situation, yet I periodically enjoy hunting a lot of different public lands simply for a change of scenery.


However, if you didn't own a home (like people who don't have access to private land) you would HAVE to spend the night in a motel on the other side of town... or just not sleep (hunt). I don't really understand what you are trying to say. Being able to hunt "conveniently" is part of better hunting. Knowing who is on the land is part of better hunting. Knowing your stands and cameras won't be stolen is part of better hunting. Right?
_________________________
I used to be indecisive. Now I'm not sure.

You're never to old to learn something stupid.

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#3075767 - 12/12/12 12:04 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 18645
Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
However, if you didn't own a home (like people who don't have access to private land) you would HAVE to spend the night in a motel on the other side of town... or just not sleep (hunt). I don't really understand what you are trying to say.

Most people are not born owning a home, most people don't have access to private land until they acquire access to private land. Regarding those hunters who have access to private land, how did they acquire it?

What I'm trying to say is that, GENERALLY SPEAKING, most of the circumstances we find ourselves have a lot to do with our own personal priorities and personal choices. These can sometimes include whether we choose to live more in an urban area or a rural area, whether we choose to go into debt or save in advance, used car vs. new car, the list could go on and on.

But I'm telling you again, most of the "private" land most TN hunters are hunting is not necessarily that different of a hunting situation than much of the the "public" hunting areas. I'm saying this because most private lands are less than 100 acres and have multiple people being granted permission to hunt them, most of whom do not communicate in advance where on those small parcels they're hunting on any given day, i.e. very much like most public land hunting.

True, some people have larger acreages and totally control the hunting. For most of these people, this was a very high priority to them, and they've made many sacrifices in other areas to achieve a more controlled hunting environment.

Let me throw something else out here to think about, since I know close to half of us hunters smoke cigarettes. One of the best managed and best quality hunting areas in the State of TN is the Ames Plantation, which is over 20,000 acres of very "private" land. For about the annual cost of smoking cigarettes, one can become a member of the Ames deer hunting club.

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#3075831 - 12/12/12 12:47 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
contendershooter
4 Point


Registered: 12/07/12
Posts: 111
Loc: TN, USA

Offline
really the whole argument boils around would it be beneficial to allow an all weapons season or harmful, and in some ways it would balance out and change in others.

I think hunters here in Tennessee have become accustomed to having designated seasons and look forward to the split seasons. As I have stated on the post I started, I don't think it would make much of a difference modifying the two week muzzleloader season to allow single shot shotguns, and/or single shot rifles and handguns that are of "x" caliber, but I do think it does good having a designated archery season early on, then going into a firearms season. Maybe if hunters were hung on having a split season, then do Archery from the first Saturday in Sept. to the last Sunday in Oct., have that week break and have the youth hunt on the first weekend in Nov, have one more week break and then open it up to all weapons from the second Saturday in November thru the last Sunday in January.

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#3076134 - 12/12/12 03:46 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: contendershooter]
n20_stang
Button


Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 10
Loc: White House

Offline
after spending 20 minutes reading through this thread, I thought i would give a noob's input. I've been hunting for 2 1/2 years and finally killed my 1st deer on the mz opener. I do bow hunt and gun hunt during all seasons. Even though I havent killed( or shot at one for that matter)a deer with a bow, I like it more than gun hunting. Like most people, I wouldnt bow hunt if I could carry a gun. The benefit of hunting in less crowded woods during archery are obviously nice, but I think archery hunters are just playing the hand we are delt. In a sense, dont hate the player, hate the game. If someone wants to hunt in october, step up and get the correct equipment. Dont try to stir the pot to get an all gun season. I dont see bow hunters trying to get more archery only time. Twra does a great job in managing deer seasons and they would change it if all things considered would benefit. I guess what I'm saying is if it aint broke then dont mess with it. Either buy a bow or sit back and watch the kill thread through october and wish you were hunting. Just because you dont want to bow hunt doesnt justify messing with the seasons. Lastly, the "messing with the noobs" comment was not called for. I respect BSK's opinion on most things but not this
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#3076264 - 12/12/12 05:08 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: n20_stang]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 64196
Loc: Nashville, TN

Offline
Urban Hunter,

Apparently, you took my artifical rants far too seriously. You might have missed all the winking emoticons in my later posts, meaning my points were being made in jest, facetiously, or as a joke. I also believe you misinterpretted my point of "riling the newbies." I don't really mean all of the new members of this Forum, but the "newbies" who--when discussing seasons and bag limits--are so quick to suggest rules that would mean less hunting for others and more hunting for themselves. All of the veterans of this Forum have seen this topic come up repeatedly over time, hence know what I'm up to.

I wouldn't even have posted on this thread or the previous "suggestions for 2013-14 seasons" thread if I hadn't read all the posts by those wanting to reduce the number of gun-hunting days, and/or reduce buck bag limits or implement buck harvest restrictions. None of these are biologically needed. And that wasn't really the reason they were suggested. They were suggested out of selfishness--to take away hunting opportunities from one group (gun-only hunters: the majority) and give them to their own group (those who bow hunt: the minority).

I answered these posts in the most contrarian and aggressive manner possible simply to rile the earlier posters up. Once I get them riled, I hope to draw them into a one-sided argument that opens their eyes (eventually) to the selfishness of their desires. During the argument, I hope to teach them something about why bow season was first implemented, and how season-setting decisions are made; i.e. maximizing opportunity and harvest without doing biological harm.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3076275 - 12/12/12 05:12 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: contendershooter]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 64196
Loc: Nashville, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: contendershooter
really the whole argument boils around would it be beneficial to allow an all weapons season or harmful.

I think hunters here in Tennessee have become accustomed to having designated seasons and look forward to the split seasons.


Exactly contendershooter. Although separate weapons seasons probably aren't biologically necessary anymore, split weapons seasons have become a part of hunting tradition in TN, and for this reason, I doubt we would ever see the state go to just an all-weapon season.

And that's fine with me.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3076682 - 12/12/12 09:06 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BlountArrow]
Swamphunter
12 Point


Registered: 12/27/07
Posts: 6452
Loc: Munford, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: BlountArrow
Now you've done it! There is no way BeeKeeper will let you talk about BSK that way. You're in for a good keyboard lashing.



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#3076703 - 12/12/12 09:20 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Swamphunter]
timberjack86
12 Point


Registered: 06/20/11
Posts: 7452
Loc: Grundy county

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Swamphunter
 Originally Posted By: BlountArrow
Now you've done it! There is no way BeeKeeper will let you talk about BSK that way. You're in for a good keyboard lashing.


\:D
_________________________
Team Run 'N Gunners

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#3076905 - 12/13/12 05:04 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Wes Parrish]
MUP
Non-Typical


Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 42471
Loc: Just North of Chatt-town

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish
 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
However, if you didn't own a home (like people who don't have access to private land) you would HAVE to spend the night in a motel on the other side of town... or just not sleep (hunt). I don't really understand what you are trying to say.

Most people are not born owning a home, most people don't have access to private land until they acquire access to private land. Regarding those hunters who have access to private land, how did they acquire it?

What I'm trying to say is that, GENERALLY SPEAKING, most of the circumstances we find ourselves have a lot to do with our own personal priorities and personal choices. These can sometimes include whether we choose to live more in an urban area or a rural area, whether we choose to go into debt or save in advance, used car vs. new car, the list could go on and on.

But I'm telling you again, most of the "private" land most TN hunters are hunting is not necessarily that different of a hunting situation than much of the the "public" hunting areas. I'm saying this because most private lands are less than 100 acres and have multiple people being granted permission to hunt them, most of whom do not communicate in advance where on those small parcels they're hunting on any given day, i.e. very much like most public land hunting.

True, some people have larger acreages and totally control the hunting. For most of these people, this was a very high priority to them, and they've made many sacrifices in other areas to achieve a more controlled hunting environment.

Let me throw something else out here to think about, since I know close to half of us hunters smoke cigarettes. One of the best managed and best quality hunting areas in the State of TN is the Ames Plantation, which is over 20,000 acres of very "private" land. For about the annual cost of smoking cigarettes, one can become a member of the Ames deer hunting club.


This is true in my case Wes. I own 42 acres of wooded property that I hunt on, while my relatives own another 110 around me that some of them hunt as well. The public aspect is that all our neighbors hunt, and some of them try to hunt on our land as well, uninvited that is \:\/ , thus making it seem like you're vying for a spot to hunt just as in public hunting, almost I say.

And I'll throw this out there as well, when I'm gun hunting, I still pay close attn to my scent, and over-hunting stands. I also am very limited to the distance I can shoot, being all wooded land, so I like to take my shots as close as possible. 40-50 yds is probably the average shot I take, some farther, and some much closer even...even what I consider bow range. I still like to get close to the animals no matter what weapon I have in hand. ;\)
_________________________
MUP

Amateurs: Built the Ark

Professionals: Built the Titanic

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#3076942 - 12/13/12 06:11 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: MUP]
Football Hunter
Non-Typical


Registered: 10/22/07
Posts: 25298
Loc: Wilson Co/Perry Co

Offline
No.No.No.
_________________________
The best day to plant a tree,IS TODAY!

You wont know,if you dont go!


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#3077211 - 12/13/12 09:53 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Football Hunter]
contendershooter
4 Point


Registered: 12/07/12
Posts: 111
Loc: TN, USA

Offline
I am posting this on this thread also, as I have modified my survey to include the AWS season post archery, and this was done in response to the post on my thread and this one.

Please take the time to retake the survey, as it will not be modified again. Survey will come down January 18, 2013

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/Z6R68PS

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#3077224 - 12/13/12 09:58 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: contendershooter]
BlountArrow
8 Point


Registered: 07/13/12
Posts: 2336
Loc: SouthEast Tenn

Offline
 Originally Posted By: contendershooter
I am posting this on this thread also, as I have modified my survey to include the AWS season post archery, and this was done in response to the post on my thread and this one.

Please take the time to retake the survey, as it will not be modified again. Survey will come down January 18, 2013

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/Z6R68PS


Be sure to let us know the results after 1/13/13.
_________________________
"The world is so dreadfully managed, one hardly knows to whom to complain."
-Ronald Firbank

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#3077253 - 12/13/12 10:16 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BlountArrow]
contendershooter
4 Point


Registered: 12/07/12
Posts: 111
Loc: TN, USA

Offline
 Originally Posted By: BlountArrow
 Originally Posted By: contendershooter
I am posting this on this thread also, as I have modified my survey to include the AWS season post archery, and this was done in response to the post on my thread and this one.

Please take the time to retake the survey, as it will not be modified again. Survey will come down January 18, 2013

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/Z6R68PS


Be sure to let us know the results after 1/13/13.
I will post them up on that day.

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#3077529 - 12/13/12 01:41 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: contendershooter]
UTGrad
14 Point


Registered: 12/01/07
Posts: 8275
Loc: Franklin, TN

Offline
Anyone ever try to reload an inline in a tree stand? Even though the first shot is pretty lethal, good luck trying to reload while deer are around lol
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#3077711 - 12/13/12 04:01 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: UTGrad]
Hoss
TnDeer Old Timer
8 Point


Registered: 02/14/00
Posts: 1424
Loc: Hendersonville , TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: UTGrad
Should TN go to an all weapon season?

I say no


No! But, then again I'm an elitist.... Soooooo!
_________________________
"The future of bowhunting depends on effective education"..... Bill Wadsworth

A mere shadow of the man I once was... Me!

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#3077722 - 12/13/12 04:10 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Hoss]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 64196
Loc: Nashville, TN

Offline
Hey, at least you admit it Hoss. ;\)
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3077735 - 12/13/12 04:17 PM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: BSK]
deerhunter10
10 Point


Registered: 08/21/12
Posts: 3235
Loc: maury county tn

Offline
It sure does feel good to be an elitist! I feel special hahaha this it pretty funny I'm not going to lie.
_________________________
Team Run 'N Gunners






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#3078542 - 12/14/12 07:32 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: deerhunter10]
contendershooter
4 Point


Registered: 12/07/12
Posts: 111
Loc: TN, USA

Offline
responses on this thread are slowing down, looks like a close 50/50 battle
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#3078595 - 12/14/12 08:02 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: contendershooter]
Rubberduck270
10 Point


Registered: 11/01/10
Posts: 2556
Loc: Lawrence Co.

Offline
 Originally Posted By: contendershooter
responses on this thread are slowing down, looks like a close 50/50 battle

Yup, I'd say 50/50 alright. 50% think we need to leave it be and the other 50% we need to just open gun season the first weekend of November.
_________________________
Smokeless Muzzleloading: It ain't your Grampa's flintlock

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#3078745 - 12/14/12 09:21 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Rubberduck270]
contendershooter
4 Point


Registered: 12/07/12
Posts: 111
Loc: TN, USA

Offline
well I know you have commented on my proposal on the single shots during muzzleloader which makes it somewhat an any weapon season with a handicap, but i guess in reality, what I have said and most others on here have said in-lines are basically cartridgeless centerfire rifles, so I guess doing an all weapons from the start of muzzleloader forward isn't a bad idea, but I still don't know
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#3078864 - 12/14/12 10:25 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: contendershooter]
Rubberduck270
10 Point


Registered: 11/01/10
Posts: 2556
Loc: Lawrence Co.

Offline
 Originally Posted By: contendershooter
...what I have said and most others on here have said in-lines are basically cartridgeless centerfire rifles...

The cartridge is the key. Speed of second shot is the determining factor. Even allowing shot gun slugs gives a major advantage in a woods setting where a semi auto slug gun can rattle off 4 rounds in a matter of seconds. Want primitive you say? Muzzleloaders were the predecessors of black powder cartridges. Seems more primitive to me. I'll eagerly await the announcement of the time and place of your presentation...
_________________________
Smokeless Muzzleloading: It ain't your Grampa's flintlock

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#3078877 - 12/14/12 10:34 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: contendershooter]
Urban_Hunter
8 Point


Registered: 10/15/12
Posts: 1469
Loc: TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: contendershooter
but i guess in reality, what I have said and most others on here have said in-lines are basically cartridgeless centerfire rifles


What? How do they relate so closely to centerfire rifles? The bullet is different, the propellant is different, the barrel is different, the method of reloading is different, the trajectory is different... etc, etc, etc...

Are you implying that hunting with a ML is not a handicap to hunting with a centerfire rifle? I think most everyone would disagree.
_________________________
I used to be indecisive. Now I'm not sure.

You're never to old to learn something stupid.

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#3078907 - 12/14/12 10:48 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Hoss]
LSUtigers
8 Point


Registered: 07/21/10
Posts: 1829
Loc: tn

Offline
NO
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#3089797 - 12/21/12 08:33 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Rubberduck270]
contendershooter
4 Point


Registered: 12/07/12
Posts: 111
Loc: TN, USA

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Rubberduck270
 Originally Posted By: contendershooter
...what I have said and most others on here have said in-lines are basically cartridgeless centerfire rifles...

The cartridge is the key. Speed of second shot is the determining factor. Even allowing shot gun slugs gives a major advantage in a woods setting where a semi auto slug gun can rattle off 4 rounds in a matter of seconds. Want primitive you say? Muzzleloaders were the predecessors of black powder cartridges. Seems more primitive to me. I'll eagerly await the announcement of the time and place of your presentation...
That is why in my proposal I stated SINGLE SHOT shotguns, rifles and handguns

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#3089832 - 12/21/12 08:46 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Urban_Hunter]
contendershooter
4 Point


Registered: 12/07/12
Posts: 111
Loc: TN, USA

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Urban_Hunter
 Originally Posted By: contendershooter
but i guess in reality, what I have said and most others on here have said in-lines are basically cartridgeless centerfire rifles


What? How do they relate so closely to centerfire rifles? The bullet is different, the propellant is different, the barrel is different, the method of reloading is different, the trajectory is different... etc, etc, etc...

Are you implying that hunting with a ML is not a handicap to hunting with a centerfire rifle? I think most everyone would disagree.
no I am saying that we don't use primitive muzzleloaders much anymore, and the modern in-lines that now even use smokeless powder, aerodynamic projectiles, etc, are essentially equal to a single shot centerfire rifle minus the brass cartridge. Muzzleloaders are more than capable of 200+yard shots now and that is why I think we should either go to a primitive or "alternative weapons" season like Mississippi, Louisiana and Missouri has done, to which you can use a single shot shotgun with a slug, single shot handgun, with a minimum .35 caliber or larger or a single shot rifle with the same caliber restrictions would not really change much. If you want to really have a true muzzleloader season, then we need to change to a season like Oregon, Washington State and Idaho has where they still allow in-lines, but you have to use either open sights or a scope with a max power of 2x, you must use #11 percussion caps or musket caps, and you can't use sabots, you must use round balls, ball-ets, conicals, or power belts. You can't use a bullet with a separate sabot. T/C makes a Omega called the "northwest explorer" that has a 1 in 48" twist barrel designed for those conicals, it has a #11 nipple, and fiber optic sights. The easier proposal would be to just mimic Louisiana, Mississippi or Missouri, and go that route, but I see the point people are making about some of the centerfire calibers provide too much of an advantage. Maybe we should limit to single shot shotguns and muzzleloaders since if you dissect a sabot shotgun slug, you will find the exact same projectile, a similar sabot, and the exact same 209 primer we use in our in-lines now.

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#3089837 - 12/21/12 08:48 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: Pinwheeled]
jeff034fun
4 Point


Registered: 01/02/07
Posts: 411
Loc: lenoir city

Offline
big no
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#3090197 - 12/21/12 11:44 AM Re: Should TN Go to All Weapons Season? [Re: jeff034fun]
UTGrad
14 Point


Registered: 12/01/07
Posts: 8275
Loc: Franklin, TN

Offline
Sorry but a modern inline, regardless how efficient the first shot maybe, is still a muzzleloader. Its a real pain to reload for a 2nd shot, so it's not a "cartridge less" center fire.
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