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#304173 - 07/18/07 01:21 PM Re: Question for Triple 7 Users [Re: Food Plot 101]
tndeer101
4 Point


Registered: 05/23/05
Posts: 176
Loc: Lebanon,Tn

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I'm using the Winchester Triple 7 primers with 100 gr of Triple 7 FFg powder in my 50 cal Encore, and I have a lot less ring crud than using other primers including the Remington Kleanbore primers. I have anyways used a spit patch between shots but with other primers I had a tough crud ring right in front of the breech plug. The Winchester primers seems to mostly eliminate this problem. I recently saw the Winchester primers at Dick's at Mt. Juliet for about $5.95. Wished I had bought a few more before season. There is definitely an increase in velocity using Triple 7. For years, all I used was Goex FFg blackpowder in my Knight MK85. When I bought the Encore, I decided to try the Triple 7. Glad I did. I got drawn for the first gun season in Iowa this year, and I'm taking the Encore. I bought up a boatload of Barnes 250 and 290 gr polmertipped bullets last year before copper prices soared. I need to shoot each and see which is more accurate. When I was shooting T/C Shockwaves, I got better accuracy with the 300 gr, so maybe the 290 Barnes will be the better bullet. A little time and powder will tell.
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#305422 - 07/19/07 12:10 PM Re: Question for Triple 7 Users [Re: ]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65075
Loc: Nashville, TN

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Here's another strange 777 question:

My brother just bought a new T/C Triumph MZ. He took it out and shot it with 100 grns of 777 pellets (two 50 grn pellets) and a 295 Powerbelt aerotips. The gun shot awesome right out of the box.

However, he went out and shot it again a few days later and it's throwing bullets all over the place. He loctited the scope in so that isn't the problem. He was cleaning the gun between every shot. The only difference is he used T/C bore butter in the barrel and left it in thick to season the barrel, but cleaned it thuroughly before shooting. Is there something about the combination of 777 and bore butter we should know? I use Powerbelt bullets and bore butter in my Omega with no problems, but then I shoot real Goex FFg black powder.

My brother also mentioned that the 777 residue in the barrel is completely different after the bore butter than before. The first time he shot it, there would only be some gray, dusty residue in the barrel after each shot. Now, with the same package of pellets, same amount of powder, same primers and same bullets, the residue is muck blacker and thicker.

Any ideas?
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#305498 - 07/19/07 01:01 PM Re: Question for Triple 7 Users [Re: BSK]
muddyboots
12 Point


Registered: 11/06/02
Posts: 7045
Loc: savannah, tn., usa

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99 % of the accuracy problems with a muzzleloader i have had have been scopes. The mounts may be tight but muzzleloaders are very hard on scopes. I would try a different scope just to see. I have noticed nothing different about using bore butter.
_________________________
X Force is Bad!
Let em go and let em grow!
There is a difference in a turkey killer and a turkey hunter!

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#307625 - 07/21/07 08:37 AM Re: Question for Triple 7 Users [Re: muddyboots]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65075
Loc: Nashville, TN

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Well, my brother cleaned the barrel with products that will break down the bore butter and the gun is shooting better again. I still can't imagine it was the bore butter, but that is the only thing he changed.


muddyboots,

I agree scopes are usually the issue, but my brother is using a T/C muzzleloader scope that has been on another MZ for years with no problem.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#307785 - 07/21/07 11:40 AM Re: Question for Triple 7 Users [Re: BSK]
SAWDUST
TnDeer Old Timer
8 Point


Registered: 11/25/99
Posts: 1015
Loc: cookeville tn.

content Online
bsk go to http://www.bpbullets.com and check out those 25 acp primer adapter and the vari-flame adapters.
not saying this is your problem by no means but if the gun is throwing fliers every now and again it is possible.
the article also talks about the crud ring that you are talking about and which my encore has.
i will probably have one soon.
_________________________
2 TIMOTHY 2:11 This is a faithful saying:
For if we died with HIM,
We shall also live with HIM.







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#307866 - 07/21/07 02:45 PM Re: Question for Triple 7 Users [Re: SAWDUST]
Trapper John
TnDeer Old Timer
16 Point


Registered: 03/13/99
Posts: 11790
Loc: La Vergne,TN/Decaturville, TN

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I don't shoot 777, but "seasoning" the barrel in my last muzzleloader with Bore Butter gave me the same accuracy problems. I cleaned it all out and all was well.

I threw the tube of Bore Butter away.

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#309506 - 07/23/07 07:07 AM Re: Question for Triple 7 Users [Re: Trapper John]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65075
Loc: Nashville, TN

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Sawdust,

Not an occassional flier, but every shot went wild all over the place. And it wasn't a crud ring, but all of the fouling was much blacker and greasier.


Trapper,

That's basically what my brother did, threw the stuff away, although we've always had great luck with it in guns that are using real black powder.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#312275 - 07/25/07 12:02 AM Re: Question for Triple 7 Users [Re: SAWDUST]
Model70Man
12 Point


Registered: 09/30/05
Posts: 6757
Loc: Knoxville, TN

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 Originally Posted By: SAWDUST
bsk go to http://www.bpbullets.com and check out those 25 acp primer adapter and the vari-flame adapters.
not saying this is your problem by no means but if the gun is throwing fliers every now and again it is possible.
the article also talks about the crud ring that you are talking about and which my encore has.
i will probably have one soon.


I have the 25 ACP primer breech plug, and honestly there is no change in accuracy. Biggest load of crapola I ever bought into for my ML. I shoot 110 grains of pellets (1 50 grain pellet and 2 30 grain pellets) with a 245 grain Barnes Spitfire and shoot the Remington Kleenbore 209 primers. I bought the 777 Winchester 209 primers and had too many hang fires at the range and strongly do not recommend them to anyone. The basic 209 Winchester primer works fine and the Remington Kleenbore is so easy to clean.
_________________________
Winchester Model 70 Stainless Left Hand .270 Win.
McMillan Edge
Talley Lightweights
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#312387 - 07/25/07 07:12 AM Re: Question for Triple 7 Users [Re: Model70Man]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 65075
Loc: Nashville, TN

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Another very disturbing problem my brother is having is the number of misfires he's experiencing. The gun just "fizzes" and the bullet plops about 10 yards away on the ground. The 777 pellets are no longer in the gun, but they obviously did not burn correctly. I'm wondering about the 777 loose powder now. I had concidered switching to 777 from real black powder (because real black powder is so hard to buy these days), but with the kind of problems my brother is experiencing, I doubt I will.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#312558 - 07/25/07 09:52 AM Re: Question for Triple 7 Users [Re: BSK]
CHRIS WILSON
8 Point


Registered: 05/31/05
Posts: 2108
Loc: Lebanon, TN

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 Quote:
Another very disturbing problem my brother is having is the number of misfires he's experiencing. The gun just "fizzes" and the bullet plops about 10 yards away on the ground. The 777 pellets are no longer in the gun, but they obviously did not burn correctly. I'm wondering about the 777 loose powder now. I had concidered switching to 777 from real black powder (because real black powder is so hard to buy these days), but with the kind of problems my brother is experiencing, I doubt I will.
I've been shooting 777 for 3 years now. I shot pellets the first year and loose for the last two. With several hundred rounds through 3 different muzzleloaders, I've never experience the problem you've just described. Does he swab with a wet patch between shots? Could be he's not getting all the residual moisture out of the barrel before loading the next charge. The residual moisture could cause the charge to fizzle. Is he sure he actually loaded a charge? I've heard of that happening before, folks getting distracted and loading a bullet without loading a powder charge. You'd be surprised at how much power a 209 primer has.
_________________________
"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have."...Thomas Jefferson

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