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#3053784 - 11/28/12 06:20 PM Age BSK and others
WesNW
4 Point


Registered: 11/29/10
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Loc: Vanleer/Erin

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Age this deer. I killed him earlier in the year but was on the fence about his age


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#3054088 - 11/28/12 08:31 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: WesNW]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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Hard to say from that picture.
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#3054169 - 11/28/12 09:05 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: BSK]
WesNW
4 Point


Registered: 11/29/10
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I'm on my phone posting it. Is pic too small? Or is it the pic itself? I have another pic I could send
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#3054222 - 11/28/12 09:27 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: WesNW]
WesNW
4 Point


Registered: 11/29/10
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Here is another pic. Same deer. Anybody got any guesses on this thing


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#3054243 - 11/28/12 09:44 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: WesNW]
catman529
spiderboy
16 Point


Registered: 11/10/10
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Loc: Franklin TN

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Looks 3.5 to me
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#3054271 - 11/28/12 10:07 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: catman529]
WesNW
4 Point


Registered: 11/29/10
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Yeah we thought 4.5 for a long time, and then we started to lean towards 3.5.
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#3054463 - 11/29/12 06:37 AM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: WesNW]
easy45
Non-Typical


Registered: 11/06/07
Posts: 30344
Loc: Chester County

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3.5
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#3054509 - 11/29/12 07:10 AM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: easy45]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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Looks mature (4 1/2).
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"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3054638 - 11/29/12 08:35 AM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: BSK]
Southern Sportsman
8 Point


Registered: 09/18/11
Posts: 1110
Loc: West TN

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Definitely looks older than any 3.5 I've seen.
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#3054664 - 11/29/12 08:43 AM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: Southern Sportsman]
BigGame
10 Point


Registered: 11/16/03
Posts: 2673
Loc: Humphreys,TN

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3.5
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#3054683 - 11/29/12 08:51 AM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: BigGame]
WesNW
4 Point


Registered: 11/29/10
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Thanks guys. I feel pretty good about my aging skills, but had a hard time with this deer. I'm curious BSK what things you see that make you think mature, and vice versa. Btw this deer was killed somewhat near u BSK, near the duck river.
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#3054684 - 11/29/12 08:53 AM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: BigGame]
MUP
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Registered: 08/01/07
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My first guess was 4.5 as well.
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#3054706 - 11/29/12 09:05 AM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: WesNW]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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 Originally Posted By: WesNW
Thanks guys. I feel pretty good about my aging skills, but had a hard time with this deer. I'm curious BSK what things you see that make you think mature, and vice versa. Btw this deer was killed somewhat near u BSK, near the duck river.


Although many body characteristics can be used to judge buck age, the most accurate is the relationship between chest depth to the length of the front legs. The older a buck is, the shorter his front legs will look in relation to the depth of his chest. That buck looks like his front legs are of equal length to the depth of his chest, which is an indication of 4 1/2 years of age.
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"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3054783 - 11/29/12 09:49 AM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: BSK]
SelphLogging
4 Point


Registered: 12/08/11
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Loc: Humphreys Co., Tn

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He had a text book 3.5 jawbone. His 2nd to last tooth had absolutely no eear at all. very sharp points and very thin dentine. His 3rd from last had just a little wear. Those pics are in early nov. and his neck swell is very slim. I initially thought 4.5 during the velvet stages, but he never packed on the mature lbs in his face, neck, or body.

Any guesses on his inside spread?

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#3054893 - 11/29/12 10:55 AM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: BigGame]
Hollar Hunter
8 Point


Registered: 11/05/10
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4.5 to much bulk to be 3.5

Edited by Hollar Hunter (11/29/12 10:55 AM)
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#3055084 - 11/29/12 12:54 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: SelphLogging]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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 Originally Posted By: SelphLogging
He had a text book 3.5 jawbone. His 2nd to last tooth had absolutely no eear at all. very sharp points and very thin dentine. His 3rd from last had just a little wear. Those pics are in early nov. and his neck swell is very slim. I initially thought 4.5 during the velvet stages, but he never packed on the mature lbs in his face, neck, or body.


Can you post pictures of that jawbone?
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3055090 - 11/29/12 12:58 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: BigGame]
SelphLogging
4 Point


Registered: 12/08/11
Posts: 263
Loc: Humphreys Co., Tn

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If this deer is 4.5, then it's just another deer that proves there really is no good method to aging deer. Those pictures are deceiving. The deer had a very narrow head, short eye to nose, 3.25" bases. Small pedicles. I have pics of this deer that stick 2" out on both sides of ears but he's only 16.5" wide inside. I have other mature deer on camera and he is no match to their maturity and broad changes to their body during early November.

Bsk has said many times before, the teeth is the best way in these parts. And that deer are like humans in their different body variations

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#3055099 - 11/29/12 01:01 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: SelphLogging]
SelphLogging
4 Point


Registered: 12/08/11
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Loc: Humphreys Co., Tn

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Bsk I'm going this evening to see if I can get the jawbone. It is at Wallace's processing where I caped it out to mount it. I hope the part of the shop that i left it in hasn't been cleaned up yet.
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#3055108 - 11/29/12 01:06 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: SelphLogging]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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Registered: 03/11/99
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 Originally Posted By: SelphLogging
If this deer is 4.5, then it's just another deer that proves there really is no good method to aging deer. Those pictures are deceiving. The deer had a very narrow head, short eye to nose, 3.25" bases. Small pedicles. I have pics of this deer that stick 2" out on both sides of ears but he's only 16.5" wide inside. I have other mature deer on camera and he is no match to their maturity and broad changes to their body during early November.


None of those characteristics are good indicators of age.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3055202 - 11/29/12 02:04 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: BSK]
SelphLogging
4 Point


Registered: 12/08/11
Posts: 263
Loc: Humphreys Co., Tn

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Those are body characteristics, just as you use body characteristics to age deer by photo.
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#3055222 - 11/29/12 02:21 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: SelphLogging]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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 Originally Posted By: SelphLogging
Those are body characteristics, just as you use body characteristics to age deer by photo.


And they are body characteristics that do not accurately describe age. So much variation exists in those measurements between age-classes, that the measurements for an individual buck are meaningless when it comes to determining his age.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#3055243 - 11/29/12 02:36 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: SelphLogging]
SelphLogging
4 Point


Registered: 12/08/11
Posts: 263
Loc: Humphreys Co., Tn

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Bsk, you use the neck all the time when aging deer. You say that when there is no distinction between the neck and chest it shows maturity. This deer doesn't have that huge neck flowing into the chest.

Body characteristics are body characteristics. If I can't use them, then you can't. You have to use them all. You preach on here all the time that deer are like human in their variations of body sizes. And you also use leg length appearance in conjunction with the body depth. Well, that my friend could simply be a short legged deer. I'm not buying it. You say one thing then say something that contradicts.

It's this simple, nobody really knows the age of a deer. Teeth are the closest thing to use when aging a deer. And just 2 weeks ago I mentioned of a deer that weighed 200+lbs field dressed, huge head, deep body, short leg appearance, long roman nose, all the "correct" body characteristics and the teeth aged 3.5.

"Maybe I don't know how to age teeth" I'm sure that is your thoughts exactly. Well, considering I age them standing by a wildlife biologist himself, and learned from him, and we've aged hundreds, I think I might have it. It's not rocket science. "Normal" people can do it, I promise! Oh, I did take genetics, zoology, and mammalogy in college. Learned tons, just didn't finish on that path.

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#3055315 - 11/29/12 03:26 PM Re: Age BSK and others [Re: SelphLogging]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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Registered: 03/11/99
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 Originally Posted By: SelphLogging
Bsk, you use the neck all the time when aging deer. You say that when there is no distinction between the neck and chest it shows maturity. This deer doesn't have that huge neck flowing into the chest.


I agree. His neck suggests 3 1/2. However, other body characteristics, one in particular, that has been shown statistically to be a good judgement of age, suggest 4 1/2, so I'm going with 4 1/2 until I see his teeth. But hey, field-judging buck age is far more "art" than science, and I only get 4 out of 5 "right" (and by "right," I mean my age estimate matches the toothwear).


My comments about characteristics that aren't good indicators of age was referring to your comments:

"The deer had a very narrow head, short eye to nose, 3.25" bases. Small pedicles. I have pics of this deer that stick 2" out on both sides of ears but he's only 16.5" wide inside."

Those are not good body characteristics to judge age from.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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