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#3044497 - 11/22/12 05:19 AM here they come for you 401k
Crappie Luck Moderator
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Registered: 01/29/03
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http://www.theminorityreportblog.com/201...irement-system/
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#3044516 - 11/22/12 05:44 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Crappie Luck]
Beekeeper
Good ol' Boys "Team Buckcreek"
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Registered: 08/26/09
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Loc: McMinn Co. Tennessee

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Another socialist program.
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.
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#3044528 - 11/22/12 06:13 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Beekeeper]
Wildcat
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Registered: 06/10/00
Posts: 42706
Loc: Western Ky.

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Here's what it adds up to. Say you put away $200 a month into your 401K plan and have been doing it for years, that's YOUR money. Wither it comes of anything down the road or not has always been YOUR responsibility. It might be worth twice what you put in on worth nothing, that's up to you.

With a govt controled 401 retirement plan you will get something but so will the people that don't put in as much as you. It will NOT be like Social Security, they have already said that will never happen. What really happens is PART OF YOUR $200 you put in will not only come back to you but it will also go to the guy that put in $50 a month. In other words YOUR money will be going to support YOU and the OTHER GUY.
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Obama, “the very danger the Constitution was designed to avoid." Liberal law professor Jonathan Turley.




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#3044574 - 11/22/12 07:29 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Wildcat]
muddyboots
12 Point


Registered: 11/06/02
Posts: 7406
Loc: savannah, tn., usa

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I knew it was coming.
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Let em go and let em grow!
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#3044716 - 11/22/12 09:24 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: muddyboots]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 16574
Loc: Tampa FL

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That's okay, my 401k is right next to my shotgun. Come and get it.
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"The fore horse of this frightful team is public debt. Taxation follow that, and in its turn wretchedness and oppression."
--Thomas Jefferson
18 Trillion http://www.usdebtclock.org/

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#3044765 - 11/22/12 10:05 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
Rebel
TnDeer Old Timer
12 Point


Registered: 03/16/99
Posts: 5400
Loc: East Tennessee USA

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Yep - I knew it was coming too. I may start just contributing the minimum to get the company match. I'll then take out what's already in ther, take the 30% hit and then buy junk silver. Not sure what else to do...
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#3045126 - 11/22/12 05:11 PM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Rebel]
Kirk
Cerebral Assassin
16 Point


Registered: 08/07/01
Posts: 10428
Loc: Cleveland, TN USA

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I have watched just about all my motivation to work anymore evaporate in the last two weeks.
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I make good money, I help the Family, but one thing must be understood, I would never go against the Godfather. Ruger is a man I respect. Luca Brasi

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#3045293 - 11/22/12 08:15 PM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Kirk]
AndyW
10 Point


Registered: 10/21/10
Posts: 4566
Loc: Allardt, TN

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 Originally Posted By: Kirk
I have watched just about all my motivation to work anymore evaporate in the last two weeks.


On the flip side, I've never been more motivated to try to become part of the evil 1%.
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This fall, FIRE THEM ALL. Re-elect NO ONE!!!!!

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#3045682 - 11/23/12 08:37 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: ]
Hangnail
14 Point


Registered: 11/30/00
Posts: 7579
Loc: Murfreesboro, TN

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I think Clinton brought up tapping private reatirement accounts back in the early/mid 1990's. There were a couple of liberal congressmen that took the ball and ran with it until they were shamed into letting it go. The day will come when YOUR retirement will be yours only to the point the government allows you access to it. The reason I think this is what is the chance that the 47% is going to stay 47%? It's gonna grow like a freakin weed.
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#3045699 - 11/23/12 08:48 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Hangnail]
iowavf
10 Point


Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 3263
Loc: southwest iowa

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Only in America, you won't have to work and still get paid right up to the day you die from the government!
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#3045776 - 11/23/12 09:58 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: iowavf]
de novo
10 Point


Registered: 07/21/08
Posts: 4032
Loc: Middle TN

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You will get a much better ROI by placing cash under your mattress or burying it in your yard. Too many public pension funds do not have the money they have promised. So for the public good the government will eventuallty take your retirement money and spread your wealth. It's all part of doing your fair share.
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#3045848 - 11/23/12 11:41 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: de novo]
Jer
8 Point


Registered: 11/25/07
Posts: 2068
Loc: Old Hickory, TN

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Well now that the SCOTUS has ruled that the government can force you to buy something it is never ending what they can come up with...
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#3045876 - 11/23/12 12:40 PM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Jer]
muddyboots
12 Point


Registered: 11/06/02
Posts: 7406
Loc: savannah, tn., usa

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So how do we beat this. i have worked too hard too save it too give it too someone else. Draw it out and pay the penalty before they take it?
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Let em go and let em grow!
There is a difference in a turkey killer and a turkey hunter!

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#3046628 - 11/24/12 06:56 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: ]
waynesworld
8 Point


Registered: 05/13/12
Posts: 1489
Loc: Mboro, Tennessee

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Well it may be getting time to look at other countries to hide assets in
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#3048916 - 11/25/12 09:44 PM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Hangnail]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 16574
Loc: Tampa FL

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http://www.retirement-usa.org/
_________________________
"The fore horse of this frightful team is public debt. Taxation follow that, and in its turn wretchedness and oppression."
--Thomas Jefferson
18 Trillion http://www.usdebtclock.org/

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#3049092 - 11/26/12 06:05 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
44fanatic
12 Point


Registered: 01/01/08
Posts: 6126
Loc: Clarksville, Montgomery Cnty

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And these retirement plans will be managed by an organization that cannot manage a budget and spends more than it makes. For us normal folks, when the times have gotten bad, what have we done, tapped our IRAs and other retirement plans to help pay the bills. If this goes through, I can see the govt debt going down as our govt sponsored 401s get tapped to bay the bills.

Lets pass on another legacy plan to our children and grandchildren to pay our bills.
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Bill

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#3049513 - 11/26/12 11:06 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: 44fanatic]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10574
Loc: Warren Co

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Government sponsored 401K retirement plans were a HORRIBLE idea from the get go. It took me a LONG time to realize and I have lost the better part of $100K in contributions and opportunity over the years.

Anytime the government has a "plan" or "program" look through the alleged benefits to the end result. Government knows better than anybody how to herd people and their money into the slaughter house. Money flows and moves. "give" us a tax "break" on our own money and people will flow trillions of dollars through a system designed to continually skim off a piece.

No need to confiscate property or retirement accounts, simply give the people a tax "break" and institute some rules on where the money can go and POOF! you have created the next mega-bubble. The government just plants a few taxes, fees, and regulations along the way and they can skim BILLIONS or TRILLIONS of dollars out of your retirement without us realizing it. Meanwhile congress knows where they money will be flowing (since they set up the rules) and invests heavily in those areas making millions with near zero risk. The rest of us get to work, sacrifice, scrimp, save, and lead frugal lives in preparation for retirement.
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If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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#3051305 - 11/27/12 10:28 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: fishboy1]
Happy Birthday ChippewaPartners
10 Point


Registered: 08/25/01
Posts: 3045
Loc: Pamelot, my farm near Catoosa

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#3054407 - 11/29/12 05:34 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Beekeeper]
MUP
Non-Typical


Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 46480
Loc: Just North of Chatt-town

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“This whole issue is moving forward very quickly,” warns Crone. “Already there is a bill requiring all businesses to automatically enroll their employees in IRA plans in which part of every employee’s paycheck would be automatically deducted and deposited into this account. If this passes, the government will be just one step away from being able to confiscate all these retirement accounts.”

What the heck can we do then, if we're just lowly pions working a 6-3 job and don't own our own business? Looks like we're gonna get it regardless of what we do.
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MUP

Amateurs: Built the Ark

Professionals: Built the Titanic

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#3054410 - 11/29/12 05:37 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Crappie Luck]
MUP
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Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 46480
Loc: Just North of Chatt-town

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“This effort ultimately is designed to grab the retirement nest eggs of America’s senior citizens. This new government annuity scheme, even if it is at first optional, will turn into a giant effort to redistribute the wealth of America’s older citizens,” explains Crone. “This scheme mirrors what I expect the President will try to do with Social Security. He wants to turn that program into a welfare program, too.”

AARp still endorses this admin? How STUPID can someone, some group of people be?!
_________________________
MUP

Amateurs: Built the Ark

Professionals: Built the Titanic

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#3054516 - 11/29/12 07:13 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: MUP]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10574
Loc: Warren Co

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 Originally Posted By: MUP
“This whole issue is moving forward very quickly,” warns Crone. “Already there is a bill requiring all businesses to automatically enroll their employees in IRA plans in which part of every employee’s paycheck would be automatically deducted and deposited into this account. If this passes, the government will be just one step away from being able to confiscate all these retirement accounts.”

What the heck can we do then, if we're just lowly pions working a 6-3 job and don't own our own business? Looks like we're gonna get it regardless of what we do.



Start getting the word out. Yeah, you are going to have to be one of "those" guys. Tell your friends, family, co-workers. Ask your boss of the entire company can take a couple hours off and go to your state senator and reps office. Politely tell them "enough of this crap! Kill this bill or I will dedicate 40 hours a week to your recall and opponents in the next election, after all, YOU put me out of work."

When you or people you know get laid off due to government actions (obumbla care etc...) spend a day camping out in your elected representatives offices. Encourage others to do the same. Don't be a D-shnozzle like those occupy clowns, be a respectful concerned citizen. The kind of guy who takes care of business and would be a BIG asset in an election campaign.

Most elected reps feel pretty untouchable. Once the populace starts showing up at their offices on a regular basis, even the king of France started getting jittery.
_________________________
If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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#3054928 - 11/29/12 11:18 AM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: fishboy1]
dr
10 Point


Registered: 02/24/03
Posts: 4408
Loc: USA

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So, If I cash in my 401k, what do I do with the money? Invest in gold, silver, rental property, land? I don't have much faith in the stock market.
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"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him --- better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford

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#3055033 - 11/29/12 12:26 PM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: dr]
Hogbear
10 Point


Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 4034
Loc: Cuba (near Memphis)

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Does Government Want To Drain Americans' 401(k) Plan?

http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/112812-634984-401k-on-the-table-for-fiscal-cliff.htm
Posted 11/28/2012 06:39 PM ET


War On Wealth: As Washington debates what to do about the fiscal cliff that it foolishly created, many potential sources of new revenue will be thrown on the table. One of them is likely to be 401(k) plans.

Retirement is an American's reasonable expectation. We put money into investment plans so that our work today funds our hard-earned leisure of tomorrow.

But many in Washington see our investment accounts not as the expressions of well-planned, disciplined decisions but as untapped reservoirs of wealth they can drain to fix the problems that they caused.

The tax protection that 401(k)s have now can be wiped out by grasping politicians who refuse to do what's right, which is to severely cut spending.

The war on retirement, particularly 401(k)s, is quiet now. But that's because it's a cold war.

And like the postwar tensions between the East and West, it could erupt at any time into a hot war.

One group of retirement plan professionals is warning that the hostilities might be closer than many of us think. The American Society of Pension Professionals and Actuaries launched on Monday, according to Reuters, "a media campaign intended to educate U.S. employers and workers that the federal government might consider changing the tax benefits of retirement savings accounts."

A website set up by the ASPPA advises account holders to tell lawmakers to "keep their hands off your retirement savings" and explains that "Congress needs to reduce the deficit, and part of deficit reduction will most likely be 'tax reform' that increases tax revenue" — the strong suggestion being that Washington is coming after Americans' 401(k)s.

If the ASPPA were alone in issuing its warnings, it could be written off as the hyperbole of an isolated group. But Washington's lust for Americans' retirement investments is well documented.

President Obama's National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform, for instance, proposed lowering the cap on the amount workers could place in their 401(k)s without incurring taxes.

And nearly three years ago, Newt Gingrich and Peter Ferrara wrote on these pages about the Treasury and Labor departments "asking for public comment on 'the conversion of 401(k) savings and Individual Retirement Accounts into annuities or other steady payment streams.'"

"In plain English," said Gingrich and Ferrara, "the idea is for the government to take your retirement savings in return for a promise to pay you some monthly benefit in your retirement years."

More than 60 million American workers have a 401(k) or similar — 403(b) or 457(b) — plan. But taxing these accounts or lowering the amount that can be contributed to them tax-free would do little to close the deficit and cut the debt.

Total assets in 401(k)s are roughly $3 trillion. So even if they were seized in their entirety, they would merely retire less than 19% of Washington's $16.3 trillion debt.

Taxed at 50%, 401(k)s would narrowly cover the $1.3 trillion deficit that Washington rang up in 2012.

Already a large chunk of America's retirement is held in the federal government's hands. Between 1937 and 2009, Social Security took in nearly $14 trillion in payroll tax revenue.

In all but 11 of those years, the government collected more than it spent on benefits.

Yet despite all the surpluses, the Social Security program is in financial trouble and Congress needs more revenue to fix it, just as it is looking for more of other people's money to avoid the fiscal cliff plunge.

Don't think for a minute that 401(k)s aren't on the table as a part of the solution.

And when they are served up in front of hungry politicians, they can be quickly devoured. All that will be left for the account holders will be a few crumbs.

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#3055047 - 11/29/12 12:34 PM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Hogbear]
Hogbear
10 Point


Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 4034
Loc: Cuba (near Memphis)

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Fiscal Cliff: Why Congress Might Have to Mess with the 401(k)
By Dan Kadlec
Nov. 28, 2012

One of the earliest fears about tax-favored savings accounts like IRAs and 401(k) plans was that when this pool of savings grew large enough Congress would not be able to resist tapping it to help solve the nation’s debt problems. We’re about to find out if those fears—persistent for decades—have been justified.

Everything including the sacred mortgage deduction is on the table as lawmakers wrestle with the fiscal cliff, a year-end avalanche of scheduled spending cuts and tax increases. With a combined $10 trillion sitting in IRAs and 401(k) plans, retirement accounts make a juicy target. Some of this money has never been taxed, and under current law never will be.

To maintain this savings incentive the government “spends” $100 billion a year in the form of tax breaks to those who stash money in these kinds of accounts. Now, a new study suggests this tax incentive does little to change saving behavior. Some lawmakers, no doubt, are wondering: Why keep an expensive tax incentive that does not incent?

The study, reported in The New York Times, comes from Raj Chetty and John N. Friedman of Harvard, Soren Leth-Petersen and Tore Olsen of the University of Copenhagen, and Torben Heien Nielsen of the Danish National Center for Social Research. It looked at data from Denmark, where the pension system is similar to that in the U.S., and found that every dollar that government spent on tax breaks increased total savings by about one penny.

That’s not much of a payoff. Meanwhile, the Tax Policy Center in Washington has found that about 80% of retirement savings benefits flow to the top 20% of earners. Eliminating the deduction for retirement savings would hit the well-off disproportionately, a condition with a lot of appeal in the current political climate.

Trying to head off this line of thinking, the American Society of Pension Professionals & Actuaries recently launched a save-my-401(k) campaign, encouraging workers to email their representatives in congress. The group notes that having a 401(k) plan is the single most important factor in determining if a worker is saving for retirement and that families with a retirement savings account, on average, have two-thirds of their assets in that account.

Yet the Danish study suggests that little would change if the tax incentives were removed. Only 15% of savers actively respond to tax incentives, the study found. Far more important are features like automatic enrollment and contribution rates that automatically increase with pay raises.

So hold on to your wallet. Congress has many options when it comes to tapping this vast reservoir. It could eliminate the deduction altogether or just for top earners, further restrict the amount that is deductible (currently $17,500; for those over 50, $23,000), start taxing retirement savings growth, or take back the part that has grown tax-free.

In the throes of a retirement savings crisis, none of these options is appealing. But that last one is most troublesome. At stake is any savings that has accrued tax-free in a Roth IRA. Tax-deferred growth could be a target too if you find yourself in a lower tax bracket in retirement. There is no discernible momentum behind such measures. But a retroactive tax on this sheltered income has been a worry from the start. And now these accounts have a meaningful total—and everything is on the table.



Read more: http://business.time.com/2012/11/28/fisc.../#ixzz2DddQZhOD

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#3055133 - 11/29/12 01:22 PM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Hogbear]
Locksley
16 Point


Registered: 10/23/01
Posts: 19744
Loc: Antioch TN

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WOW NOT GOOD.
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To know wisdom and instruction; to perceive the words of understanding;"The greatest pain a man can suffer is to have knowledge of much, and power over nothing" - Herodotus

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#3055536 - 11/29/12 05:35 PM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: Hangnail]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 16574
Loc: Tampa FL

Offline
Get a rope
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"The fore horse of this frightful team is public debt. Taxation follow that, and in its turn wretchedness and oppression."
--Thomas Jefferson
18 Trillion http://www.usdebtclock.org/

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#3057069 - 11/30/12 02:50 PM Re: here they come for you 401k [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
Greg .
aPoStROpHe PolIcE
16 Point


Registered: 08/24/04
Posts: 11122
Loc: NC Piedmonts

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Article I - The Legislative Branch
Section 9

Clause 3:

No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed.


.... not that they EVER gave a $#!% about the Constitution ...
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Abandon all rational and unbiased thought. Just blame Boooosh.
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