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#3027029 - 11/10/12 09:09 PM Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States
Beardendy88
4 Point


Registered: 07/07/12
Posts: 343
Loc: North Alabama

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https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petitio...mpaign=shorturl
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#3027313 - 11/11/12 08:27 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Beardendy88]
youngandfree
6 Point


Registered: 09/26/12
Posts: 650
Loc: Greene County, Tn.

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I have spoken with good friends who are members of the Tennessee legislature about this. It wont ever happen. We will be crushed with import and export taxes.
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#3027429 - 11/11/12 09:47 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: youngandfree]
Locksley
16 Point


Registered: 10/23/01
Posts: 19679
Loc: Antioch TN

Offline
Hey this was tried years ago by better men than us and they were defeated in the end .
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To know wisdom and instruction; to perceive the words of understanding;"The greatest pain a man can suffer is to have knowledge of much, and power over nothing" - Herodotus

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#3027465 - 11/11/12 10:20 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Locksley]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10493
Loc: Warren Co

Offline
I think it would be a better choice to "opt out" of most federal programs....AND refuse to make the citizens of TN pay the taxes to fund them.

Those that want to keep the Federal Programs are free to move away.
_________________________
If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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#3027823 - 11/11/12 03:38 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: youngandfree]
waynesworld
8 Point


Registered: 05/13/12
Posts: 1470
Loc: Mboro, Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: youngandfree
I have spoken with good friends who are members of the Tennessee legislature about this. It wont ever happen. We will be crushed with import and export taxes.


There are a lot of reasons why this will not happen but all they would do is join the NAFTA \:\) But if the red states were to join together and leave then the other states could not inforce import taxes they would have to trade free with the red states. They would starve. And if some thing like that would start you would see states breaking apart

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#3028037 - 11/11/12 05:45 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: waynesworld]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10493
Loc: Warren Co

Offline
I think One simple change would "FIX" what is wrong with America.

If you have received funds from the Federal government in the past 24 months you are ineligible to vote. Employment, loans, welfare....
_________________________
If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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#3028043 - 11/11/12 05:47 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: waynesworld]
timberjack86
12 Point


Registered: 06/20/11
Posts: 7452
Loc: Grundy county

Offline
Signed it!
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#3028060 - 11/11/12 05:59 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: fishboy1]
MidTennFisher
4 Point


Registered: 07/23/12
Posts: 172
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
I think One simple change would "FIX" what is wrong with America.

If you have received funds from the Federal government in the past 24 months you are ineligible to vote. Employment, loans, welfare....


So because I receive student loans to finish up college I wouldn't be allowed to vote? I'm not going for some B.S. major either like womens studies or art history, I'm studying electrical engineering. Having to have a photo ID to vote would help. Isn't it amazing how Obama lost every state that has voter ID laws? It's time to face the facts here, it's over for this country. Roughly 50% of this country was ready and willing to re-elect a Communist and they succeeded. We're not America anymore, not what great men fought and died for. We've been rolled by a community organizer Marxist and it's disgusting. We'll survive but things are going to be very different going forward (no pun intended). Save your money, I can't stress it enough. Save your money, and buy ammo.

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#3028787 - 11/12/12 06:27 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: MidTennFisher]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10493
Loc: Warren Co

Offline
 Originally Posted By: MidTennFisher
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
I think One simple change would "FIX" what is wrong with America.

If you have received funds from the Federal government in the past 24 months you are ineligible to vote. Employment, loans, welfare....


So because I receive student loans to finish up college I wouldn't be allowed to vote? I'm not going for some B.S. major either like womens studies or art history, I'm studying electrical engineering. Having to have a photo ID to vote would help. Isn't it amazing how Obama lost every state that has voter ID laws? It's time to face the facts here, it's over for this country. Roughly 50% of this country was ready and willing to re-elect a Communist and they succeeded. We're not America anymore, not what great men fought and died for. We've been rolled by a community organizer Marxist and it's disgusting. We'll survive but things are going to be very different going forward (no pun intended). Save your money, I can't stress it enough. Save your money, and buy ammo.



Yes.. If you receive student loans there is a direct conflict of interest. No vote.

Government should NOT be in the student loan business.
College degrees were worth something when they were hard to get.
_________________________
If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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#3029172 - 11/12/12 09:51 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: fishboy1]
MidTennFisher
4 Point


Registered: 07/23/12
Posts: 172
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
 Originally Posted By: MidTennFisher
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
I think One simple change would "FIX" what is wrong with America.

If you have received funds from the Federal government in the past 24 months you are ineligible to vote. Employment, loans, welfare....


So because I receive student loans to finish up college I wouldn't be allowed to vote? I'm not going for some B.S. major either like womens studies or art history, I'm studying electrical engineering. Having to have a photo ID to vote would help. Isn't it amazing how Obama lost every state that has voter ID laws? It's time to face the facts here, it's over for this country. Roughly 50% of this country was ready and willing to re-elect a Communist and they succeeded. We're not America anymore, not what great men fought and died for. We've been rolled by a community organizer Marxist and it's disgusting. We'll survive but things are going to be very different going forward (no pun intended). Save your money, I can't stress it enough. Save your money, and buy ammo.



Yes.. If you receive student loans there is a direct conflict of interest. No vote.

Government should NOT be in the student loan business.
College degrees were worth something when they were hard to get.


That's ridiculous. I'm as Conservative as everyone else in here and I see nothing wrong with taking out student loans for degrees that will result in me actually helping this country. Liberal Arts, Ethnic Studies, Art History, etc. yes...complete waste of time and money. Some college degrees are certainly still worth something and electrical engineering is one of them. It's still very hard to earn, regardless of student loans.


Edited by MidTennFisher (11/12/12 09:52 AM)

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#3029178 - 11/12/12 09:56 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: MidTennFisher]
Crappie Luck Moderator
Non-Typical


Registered: 01/29/03
Posts: 59489
Loc: Smith Co.

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The point is, student loans should NOT come from the govt. That's is what banks are for.
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#3029187 - 11/12/12 10:07 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Crappie Luck]
worriedman
6 Point


Registered: 10/12/06
Posts: 967
Loc: Bells

Offline
The whole point Crappie, is to make the average Citizen as dependent on Government as possible. In that, they are having marvelous success.
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#3029217 - 11/12/12 10:21 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: worriedman]
Crappie Luck Moderator
Non-Typical


Registered: 01/29/03
Posts: 59489
Loc: Smith Co.

Offline
No argument from me on that point
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#3029285 - 11/12/12 11:05 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Crappie Luck]
TennesseeRains
TnDeer Old Timer
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/01
Posts: 13329
Loc: Hixson,TN

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Alabama, Arkansas, Colorado, Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, New Jersey, New York, North Carolina, Oregon, South Carolina, Tennessee and Texas.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/elec...tion-to-secede/
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#3029317 - 11/12/12 11:34 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: TennesseeRains]
MidTennFisher
4 Point


Registered: 07/23/12
Posts: 172
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
If the petitions get 25,000 votes that means the White House will "respond" and we all know what the response is going to be. No. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad to see that America is fired up but I don't believe for a second that this administration is going to let states secede. That's not what they want, they want us all under their Marxist control and they're not going to stop until they have it.
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#3029375 - 11/12/12 12:06 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: MidTennFisher]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10493
Loc: Warren Co

Offline
 Originally Posted By: MidTennFisher
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
 Originally Posted By: MidTennFisher
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
I think One simple change would "FIX" what is wrong with America.

If you have received funds from the Federal government in the past 24 months you are ineligible to vote. Employment, loans, welfare....


So because I receive student loans to finish up college I wouldn't be allowed to vote? I'm not going for some B.S. major either like womens studies or art history, I'm studying electrical engineering. Having to have a photo ID to vote would help. Isn't it amazing how Obama lost every state that has voter ID laws? It's time to face the facts here, it's over for this country. Roughly 50% of this country was ready and willing to re-elect a Communist and they succeeded. We're not America anymore, not what great men fought and died for. We've been rolled by a community organizer Marxist and it's disgusting. We'll survive but things are going to be very different going forward (no pun intended). Save your money, I can't stress it enough. Save your money, and buy ammo.



Yes.. If you receive student loans there is a direct conflict of interest. No vote.

Government should NOT be in the student loan business.
College degrees were worth something when they were hard to get.


That's ridiculous. I'm as Conservative as everyone else in here and I see nothing wrong with taking out student loans for degrees that will result in me actually helping this country. Liberal Arts, Ethnic Studies, Art History, etc. yes...complete waste of time and money. Some college degrees are certainly still worth something and electrical engineering is one of them. It's still very hard to earn, regardless of student loans.



Nothing ridiculous about it. While you are getting $$$ from the government you should not get to vote for people who will exchange MORE government $$$ for your vote. It is a clear and direct conflict of interest. As soon as you have your Government loan paid off, your voting rights are restored.

As soon as you leave government "service" and take a private sector job, your voting rights are restored.

People gripe about congress voting themselves benefits and pay raises..... The only difference is the scale.
_________________________
If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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#3029455 - 11/12/12 12:42 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: fishboy1]
LSUtigers
8 Point


Registered: 07/21/10
Posts: 1830
Loc: tn

Offline
Fishboy I have to agree!!
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#3029535 - 11/12/12 01:13 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: LSUtigers]
MidTennFisher
4 Point


Registered: 07/23/12
Posts: 172
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
Well I took a year off of school to work an internship... by your astounding logic if only the election were last year instead of this year I would have been able to vote huh? There is nothing in the Constitution about not having a right to vote if you're receiving some sort of Government service so your argument is beyond ridiculous. Do you drive on paved roads? Government service. Do you fish and/or hunt on TWRA managed property? Government service. Have you ever called the police or benefit from them protecting us? Guess what? Government service. None of you would be able to vote then. You said only when I take a private sector job I should be able to vote. I guess this excludes all military, policemen, firefighters, city workers, etc from voting. What you're saying is beyond ridiculous. I take out student loans to finish college with a REAL degree that I will use to provide for myself and my future family for the rest of our lives. I vote Conservative. I always have and always will.
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#3029551 - 11/12/12 01:18 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: fishboy1]
Outdoor Enthusiast
6 Point


Registered: 12/04/07
Posts: 961
Loc: Carthage, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1


As soon as you leave government "service" and take a private sector job, your voting rights are restored.


Are you also implying that anyone working for the government, directly or indirectly, should not receive a vote?

If so, then not only does someone who is indebted to the government lose their vote, but also anyone who sells their skills, products, services, etc to a government assisted program.

Take for instance the following example: a self-employed building contractor was recently awarded a contract to perform a scope of work for a federal government entity. Does this small business owner also lose the right to vote due to a conflict of interest?

I understand that your point was in regards to student loan programs. Just curious of your views and possibly it's just a misinterpretation of a post.

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#3029578 - 11/12/12 01:33 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Outdoor Enthusiast]
JN
4 Point


Registered: 01/05/01
Posts: 253
Loc: Northeast TN

Offline
With that thought process we should also exclude our veterans and military personal and anyone else working at a veteran's hospital.
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#3029603 - 11/12/12 01:39 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: JN]
BMan
16 Point


Registered: 02/06/06
Posts: 10096
Loc: Middle TN

Offline
Only the 'rats try to exclude military votes.
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#3029685 - 11/12/12 02:16 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: BMan]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10493
Loc: Warren Co

Offline
Imagine just for a moment......

If we took the direct conflict of interest out of voting.

Not indirect stuff like roads.... but direct...cash to hand.

People on welfare would NOT be able to vote for people who will buy their allegiance with money taken from others.

Corporate crooks would not be able to vote for people who will buy their allegiance with tax dollars and contracts.

IF voting was a priority among people, then they would choose to work in the private sector.

As soon as the private sector regained its voice, sensible limits would be placed on the Federal Government and it would start to shrink.

Many of the Federal Government functions would be privatized and those government workers absorbed into the private sector.

Instead of viewing the Fed Govt as a giant pinata of cash that could be busted open by voting..... People would start to weigh the cost of freebies....

Government backed student loans would become less popular and the private sector would start pushing private loans.....

Welfare reforms would be possible once the people receiving the goodies were NOT the ones voting for a lifetime of ever increasing benefits.

Social Security and Medi/care/caid could finally be reformed backwards into the last resort safety net it was supposed to be.

The point is to change the way people think about government money. Right now, people think it is FREE federal money, if it cost you your vote, people might think twice before jumping on the gravy train.
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If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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#3029723 - 11/12/12 02:30 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: BMan]
JN
4 Point


Registered: 01/05/01
Posts: 253
Loc: Northeast TN

Offline
This whole post burns me up. To say I shouldnt have the right to vote because of the student loans I had. Also had scholarships as well so I guess they count too. I also work for a construction company who has several contracts with the state of TN to do construction projects on schools. I have busted my butt to get where I am today and to pay off my loans because I dont want to owe anybody anything and to say I shouldnt vote because of my ties with the government is just ridiculous.
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#3029733 - 11/12/12 02:35 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: fishboy1]
MidTennFisher
4 Point


Registered: 07/23/12
Posts: 172
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
So you're saying someone should pick and choose which Government services make a person ineligible to vote? Because as I mentioned earlier, if you drive on paved roads you use a Government service and according to your argument, you can't vote because of that.

There are so many things wrong with your statement that because I receive student loans I shouldn't be able to vote.

How about a test that demonstrates comprehensive knowledge of each candidate's policy before being allowed to vote? When you go to the booth, you should have a 20-30 question test and if you can't pass with a 90% or better, you can't vote. This way we don't get people like the Obamaphone lady and millions like her voting for Obama and having no idea of the consequences of their vote.

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#3029819 - 11/12/12 03:21 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: MidTennFisher]
waynesworld
8 Point


Registered: 05/13/12
Posts: 1470
Loc: Mboro, Tennessee

Offline
ya i guess if you get eic or child credit you should not be able to vote, Or if you own a company that gets any credits. I would bet you could find some form of conflect with all the voters. The different welfare programs are so ingrained in socicity now people do not even realize they are on welfare.
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#3029943 - 11/12/12 04:36 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Beardendy88]
HuntingandHarleys
6 Point


Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 564
Loc: woodbury TN

Offline
Should anyone listed on this link be able to vote??

http://farm.ewg.org/search.php?fips=00000®ionname=UnitedStatesFarmSubsidySummary

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#3030033 - 11/12/12 05:36 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: HuntingandHarleys]
348Winchester
6 Point


Registered: 08/13/12
Posts: 833
Loc: Coon Creek

Offline
The Union should be dissolved. The Union has been illegal since 1865.
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#3030034 - 11/12/12 05:36 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: HuntingandHarleys]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 15538
Loc: Tampa FL

Offline
1860 my friends, 1860.
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#3030114 - 11/12/12 06:13 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10493
Loc: Warren Co

Offline
Awesome. This thread points out how easily you can get someones brain to shut down via emotion.

My wife has student loans. We have made the deliberate decision to make the absolute minimum payments on that loan. IF voter eligibility came into play, it would change our priorities.

Perhaps we would just pay them off. Perhaps we would roll them into something else. Perhaps we would start hammering them hard with extra $$ each month.

The point is that we would THINK about those Government loans differently. Instead of being "cheap" money at 2.4% they would have a much higher perceived cost if it cost her voting privileges.

The end goal is to get the Feds OUT OF OUR LIVES, not punish people. That is going to require incentives, and yes... sacrifice and some pain.

The idea that any frosted turd the government puts out is something we should all revel in needs to change.

Student loans are the next big housing crisis/bubble but that isn't the source of the problem.

Its the perception that the government can offer perks/benefits and freebies at no cost to you, regardless of what form they take. It costs us plenty. The costs are financed with 101398942 easy payments at 400% interest and our freedom.
_________________________
If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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#3030116 - 11/12/12 06:15 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
NBF7240
8 Point


Registered: 08/16/06
Posts: 1566
Loc: Tn

Offline
Fyi

The roads we drive on, the people own.

Everything the govt pays for is either borrowed or derived from the people.
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#3030847 - 11/13/12 08:08 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: NBF7240]
huntinkev
8 Point


Registered: 11/23/06
Posts: 1359
Loc: East Tenn

Offline
I agree with fishboy.
If you receive any Government assistance; welfare, student loans, etc. then you should not be allowed to vote until you have it paid off and you stop receiving assistance for 12 months.

I don't think you can disallow the vote of someone who is simply working for the government.
They do, for the most part, provide some sort of service for their paycheck.

Anyway it will never happen because the 47+% are the ones who vote for Obama and the dems as to keep their checks rolling in and maybe get more assistance.

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#3030879 - 11/13/12 08:22 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: NBF7240]
JWW4
8 Point


Registered: 06/09/07
Posts: 1931
Loc: Signal Mtn, TN

Offline
This electoral map shows how the 2012 election would have turned out if only people that pay taxes were allowed to vote.


http://goldwaterconservative.tumblr.com/...-has-passed-and

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#3030891 - 11/13/12 08:30 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: MidTennFisher]
The_Utility_Dude
8 Point


Registered: 12/21/01
Posts: 1693
Loc: East Tennessee

Offline
If you want to "clean up" the voting process to exclude most of the knuckleheads that probably shouldn't be voting anyway,I think I have a simple solution:

In order to vote in a federal election you must be able to answer one two simple questions. "Name the three branches of the Federal Government" & "Name the two members of the United States Senate that represent your State".

It's a win win situation. Nobody gets offended and you eliminate most of the uneducated voters. ;):P
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#3030980 - 11/13/12 09:16 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: The_Utility_Dude]
Grizzly Johnson
Turkey Forum Police
16 Point


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 14725
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
How about you must have a job 6 months prior to election, be approved by the IRS you paid taxes the previous year.... and are 30 years old...

The age thing you say.... well too many young adults are influenced by media, parents, friends, and online social sites.... by 30, hopefully they are responsible for their own life and have an idea how things really work in reality.
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#3031014 - 11/13/12 09:34 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
MidTennFisher
4 Point


Registered: 07/23/12
Posts: 172
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
I still like the 20-30 question quiz on each candidate's policies. Again, saying I shouldn't be able to vote because I took student loans is absurd.
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#3031015 - 11/13/12 09:35 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
Happy Birthday DntBrnDPig
8 Point


Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 2034
Loc: Cleveland, TN

Offline
How about you can only vote if you are white, over 30, and promise to vote Republican. Then maybe we can turn this thing around. (that was sarcasm)

Not being allowed to vote because of student loans? What?! 30 years old? So you are going to allow kids to fight for their country, but not vote?
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#3031047 - 11/13/12 09:55 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: DntBrnDPig]
Grizzly Johnson
Turkey Forum Police
16 Point


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 14725
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: DntBrnDPig
So you are going to allow kids to fight for their country, but not vote?


I would allow an exception in the age under military service....


When you have kids voting what do they really know and how familiar are they really with how things are supposed to be governed?

Most are too busy texting, partying, living their life on FaceBook, or whatever. Look at how the voting went this past election.... you think all the madness ended with the "adults" voting? No I would say the kids will or did vote the same way because of their lifestyle and whatever was easier or promised to them for their vote.

You think atmosphere with the crap being taught/forced in schools in the recent years is giving them a real "informed" and unbiased understanding of how America was founded and supposed to be for the "people"?

So why should the informed (minority) suffer because we are outnumbered by the stupid/lazy/selfish (majority).... does that sould like a "free" society?

I don't know everything about politics or government for that matter..... but stupid crap like the outcome of this past election showing how the majority of this country has been pimped out just really pisses me off and why at times I could care less about politics.... I will take care of me and mine and to he11 with everything else.

I am sick and tired of the (D) & (R) crap..... I am not labeled for either "side"..... People need to remove their thinking end from their stinking end and get things done... quit the bickering and finger pointing and make it happen. We as a nation are suffering a slow death.... I will not be shackled or chained... will die a free man if that is what it comes to.
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#3031072 - 11/13/12 10:12 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
Happy Birthday DntBrnDPig
8 Point


Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 2034
Loc: Cleveland, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Grizzly Johnson
I am sick and tired of the (D) & (R) crap..... I am not labeled for either "side"..... People need to remove their thinking end from their stinking end and get things done... quit the bickering and finger pointing and make it happen


Truer words have never been scribed in this forum.

I don't think taking rights away from kids, which is essentially what you are doing, is the right call. Instead make that battle at the educational level to get the 'crap out of the schools' as you call it.

I think the younger generation just doesn't trust the 'old white guy' anymore. When Ryan was added to the ticket, there was a fresh sense of optimism that didn't exist in the race up until then.

I think one thing a lot of people misunderstand is that not all of the younger voters are ignorant to the issues. They understand the issues a lot more than you think they do, they just believe that there is another way.
_________________________
Any time you can get out to hunt, is a good day to hunt.

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#3031109 - 11/13/12 10:26 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: DntBrnDPig]
de novo
10 Point


Registered: 07/21/08
Posts: 3994
Loc: Middle TN

Offline
Most everyone is on the right track. Our current problems are based on everyone voting. This was never the design of the republic and we were warned repeatedly about the dangers (Evils) of a democracy.

To me disallowing those with federal student loans to vote is no more radical than allowing those on welfare, Section 8, foodstamps, etc. to vote. We have reports of the mentally ill being loaded up in vans to vote. We're trying to push for felons to have their voting rights restored due to racism, etc.

IMO, voting rights should be restricted not expanded.
_________________________
“Reality is what continues to exist whether you believe in it or not.” 

“The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it.”

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#3031169 - 11/13/12 10:57 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: de novo]
Beardendy88
4 Point


Registered: 07/07/12
Posts: 343
Loc: North Alabama

Offline
Could not agree more! I believe you must pay taxes whether you receive any goverment money or not. I receive FASFA funding to attend college. We need a revamping of our election system and we need to fix the electoral college. States like Texas, California and New York have to many electoral votes to go to the same party every year. I really don't know what we can do to fix it but it needs to be fixed
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#3031178 - 11/13/12 11:02 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: de novo]
Beardendy88
4 Point


Registered: 07/07/12
Posts: 343
Loc: North Alabama

Offline
 Originally Posted By: de novo
Most everyone is on the right track. Our current problems are based on everyone voting. This was never the design of the republic and we were warned repeatedly about the dangers (Evils) of a democracy.

To me disallowing those with federal student loans to vote is no more radical than allowing those on welfare, Section 8, foodstamps, etc. to vote. We have reports of the mentally ill being loaded up in vans to vote. We're trying to push for felons to have their voting rights restored due to racism, etc.

IMO, voting rights should be restricted not expanded.

Remember the movie the Patriot with Mel Gibson when he said why should I trade 1 tyrant 3,000 miles away for 3,000 tyrants one mile away. Well boys we have 3,000 tyrants

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#3031240 - 11/13/12 11:45 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Beardendy88]
TennesseeRains
TnDeer Old Timer
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/01
Posts: 13329
Loc: Hixson,TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Beardendy88

Remember the movie the Patriot with Mel Gibson when he said why should I trade 1 tyrant 3,000 miles away for 3,000 tyrants one mile away. Well boys we have 3,000 tyrants



“They call me a brainless Tory; but tell me, my young friend, which is better—to be ruled by one tyrant three thousand miles away, or by three thousand tyrants not a mile away?”

- Mather Byles, Sr while watching the funeral procession of Crispus Attucks in March 1770.
_________________________
I don't always eat meat but when I do I prefer deer. Stay hungry my friends-nbforrest#3

To be fair, we can now blame everything on everything else-Wildcat

A nation of sheep breeds a gov't of wolves

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#3031598 - 11/13/12 03:50 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: MidTennFisher]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 15538
Loc: Tampa FL

Offline
we petition the obama administration to:
Strip the Citizenship from Everyone who Signed a Petition to Secede and Exile Them

Mr. President, please sign an executive order such that each American citizen who signed a petition from any state to secede from the USA shall have their citizenship stripped and be peacefully deported.

duCk, exactly how long did it take you to sign the petition 3620 times????

Bwwaaahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!
_________________________
The Second Amendment - George Washington didn't use free speech to defeat the British, he shot them.
"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." - Thomas Paine





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#3031610 - 11/13/12 04:01 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 15538
Loc: Tampa FL

Offline
Silly Season?


_________________________
The Second Amendment - George Washington didn't use free speech to defeat the British, he shot them.
"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." - Thomas Paine





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#3031613 - 11/13/12 04:04 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
Beardendy88
4 Point


Registered: 07/07/12
Posts: 343
Loc: North Alabama

Offline
 Originally Posted By: FLTENNHUNTER1
we petition the obama administration to:
Strip the Citizenship from Everyone who Signed a Petition to Secede and Exile Them

Mr. President, please sign an executive order such that each American citizen who signed a petition from any state to secede from the USA shall have their citizenship stripped and be peacefully deported.

duCk, exactly how long did it take you to sign the petition
Bwwaaahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!


Yeah that'll work as well as our little petition


Edited by Beardendy88 (11/13/12 04:23 PM)

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#3031628 - 11/13/12 04:14 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: MidTennFisher]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 15538
Loc: Tampa FL

Offline
Texas

81000 and growing.


1860 my friends, 1860
_________________________
The Second Amendment - George Washington didn't use free speech to defeat the British, he shot them.
"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." - Thomas Paine





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#3031697 - 11/13/12 04:56 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
de novo
10 Point


Registered: 07/21/08
Posts: 3994
Loc: Middle TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: FLTENNHUNTER1
Mr. President, please sign an executive order such that each American citizen who signed a petition from any state to secede from the USA shall have their citizenship stripped and be peacefully deported.


How ironic! A citizen staunchly opposed to deporting ilegal immigrants would advocate for the deportation of an American citizen who disagreed with his political beliefs.
_________________________
“Reality is what continues to exist whether you believe in it or not.” 

“The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it.”

Top
#3031735 - 11/13/12 05:29 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: de novo]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 15538
Loc: Tampa FL

Offline
 Originally Posted By: de novo
 Originally Posted By: FLTENNHUNTER1
Mr. President, please sign an executive order such that each American citizen who signed a petition from any state to secede from the USA shall have their citizenship stripped and be peacefully deported.


How ironic! A citizen staunchly opposed to deporting ilegal immigrants would advocate for the deportation of an American citizen who disagreed with his political beliefs.


Freakin hypocrites!!
_________________________
The Second Amendment - George Washington didn't use free speech to defeat the British, he shot them.
"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." - Thomas Paine





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#3031936 - 11/13/12 07:01 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
guthooked
4 Point


Registered: 08/10/08
Posts: 132
Loc: Gibbs

Offline
I'm disappointed by the secession discussions. It is akin to turning over the game board when one realizes they're losing the game. The tea party mindset propagates this "my way or the highway" attitude. It's as though people can't stand any moderate opinions.

Were we to make a college degree and property ownership essential for voter qualification we would have perhaps the most "fit" voter population, but it wouldn't be democratic. I'm disappointed that we seem to forget that its the tolerance of diverse ideas and protection of personal liberties that make us a great country. I'm as worried about gun rights as the next guy, but frankly there were several ideas that protected more by the democratic party than the republican. I'd love a party that was truly libertarian. They would get my vote...
_________________________
I want no part of life without death, nor hunt with assurance of kill.

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#3032021 - 11/13/12 07:40 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: guthooked]
sgtwebb1
14 Point


Registered: 08/06/00
Posts: 9365
Loc: Ooltewah/Harrison TN, USA

Offline
 Originally Posted By: guthooked
I'm disappointed by the secession discussions. It is akin to turning over the game board when one realizes they're losing the game. The tea party mindset propagates this "my way or the highway" attitude. It's as though people can't stand any moderate opinions.

Were we to make a college degree and property ownership essential for voter qualification we would have perhaps the most "fit" voter population, but it wouldn't be democratic. I'm disappointed that we seem to forget that its the tolerance of diverse ideas and protection of personal liberties that make us a great country. I'm as worried about gun rights as the next guy, but frankly there were several ideas that protected more by the democratic party than the republican. I'd love a party that was truly libertarian. They would get my vote...


Your post is full of contradictions;

"Democracy" sounds good, but it's nothing but mob rule.

Libertarians are anything but "moderate" or "democratic".

Do you want a more "moderate"/"democratic", or "Libertarian" government?
Which is it?

Because 2 of the 3 are light years apart from the 3rd.

And as far as I'm concerned, the Tea Party is the ONLY Conservative outfit out there.
_________________________
~~Death from above~~
)))---------------->>


Visit my Blog:
Sons of LiberTea Blog

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#3032105 - 11/13/12 08:23 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: guthooked]
de novo
10 Point


Registered: 07/21/08
Posts: 3994
Loc: Middle TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: guthooked
It's as though people can't stand any moderate opinions.

I'm sorry I must have missed these moderate opinions from the Obama administration. What were they again?

 Originally Posted By: guthooked

Were we to make a college degree and property ownership essential for voter qualification we would have perhaps the most "fit" voter population, but it wouldn't be democratic.


Someone with a college degree should understand that our form of government is a constitutional republic. Our Founders went out of their way to avoid fighting a revolution to start democracy. Their are numerous papers on the faults and failures of democracy.

 Originally Posted By: guthooked


I'm disappointed that we seem to forget that its the tolerance of diverse ideas and protection of personal liberties that make us a great country.


The above statement is pure BS. Personal liberties were the foundation of this country. This tolerance of diverse ideas is the new foundation and it will lead to our nation's fall.
_________________________
“Reality is what continues to exist whether you believe in it or not.” 

“The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it.”

Top
#3032193 - 11/13/12 09:04 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: sgtwebb1]
guthooked
4 Point


Registered: 08/10/08
Posts: 132
Loc: Gibbs

Offline
so you can't see libertarian qualities in both parties platforms? There are. In fact, they're about equally represented. Can you put it together or do I need to spell it out?

Gun rights, less gov. involvement, pro-choice, gay rights, marijuana deregulation, all pretty libertarian ideas.
Pro-life, anti gay rights, push for less separation of church and state, government subsidy, bigger government all pretty anti-libertarian ideas.

Makes it hard to put them in a box eh...? Moderate: in between the extreme views of either parties.

Democratic: what we have inherited. To voice disproval of democracy is allowed only because you're in the democracy. So flaunt it... You're a lesson in irony.

All that to say that I think personal freedoms should reign supreme. So believe what you want, do what you want, and I'll do the same (personal liberties are supreme see?)

Vive la liberte.


Edited by guthooked (11/13/12 09:06 PM)
_________________________
I want no part of life without death, nor hunt with assurance of kill.

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#3032210 - 11/13/12 09:18 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: guthooked]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 15538
Loc: Tampa FL

Offline
 Originally Posted By: guthooked
I'm disappointed by the secession discussions. It is akin to turning over the game board when one realizes they're losing the game. The tea party mindset propagates this "my way or the highway" attitude. It's as though people can't stand any moderate opinions.

Were we to make a college degree and property ownership essential for voter qualification we would have perhaps the most "fit" voter population, but it wouldn't be democratic. I'm disappointed that we seem to forget that its the tolerance of diverse ideas and protection of personal liberties that make us a great country. I'm as worried about gun rights as the next guy, but frankly there were several ideas that protected more by the democratic party than the republican. I'd love a party that was truly libertarian. They would get my vote...


I'll bet your opinion changes by 2016. The liBerAls have taken over this country and we have re-elected a Marxist. This country is polarized and fundamentally disagree on too many issues that in my opinion cannot be resolved at the ballot box. That boat sailed on November 6th. We are so far from the Constitution we will never get back without bloodshed. A financial collapse could be the trigger. At that point in time I expect states like Texas to take up arms.

Prepare accordingly.
_________________________
The Second Amendment - George Washington didn't use free speech to defeat the British, he shot them.
"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." - Thomas Paine





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#3032296 - 11/13/12 10:32 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: FLTENNHUNTER1]
Wildcat
Non-Typical


Registered: 06/10/00
Posts: 41312
Loc: Western Ky.

Offline
If the states want to withdraw from the United States then that's true democraty.

If the states were to leave the country that would be the THIRD time it happened.

The first one was when we left Great Britain. The Loyalists that wanted to stay with the mother country said much the same things some people are saying now about the secession discussions. Same thing happened in 1860 when talk about secession came up.
_________________________
A Government that does not trust its law abiding citizens to keep and bear arms, is itself unworthy of trust..... - James Madison





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#3032520 - 11/14/12 07:48 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: guthooked]
de novo
10 Point


Registered: 07/21/08
Posts: 3994
Loc: Middle TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: guthooked
so you can't see libertarian qualities in both parties platforms? There are. In fact, they're about equally represented. Can you put it together or do I need to spell it out?

Gun rights, less gov. involvement, pro-choice, gay rights, marijuana deregulation, all pretty libertarian ideas.
Pro-life, anti gay rights, push for less separation of church and state, government subsidy, bigger government all pretty anti-libertarian ideas.

Makes it hard to put them in a box eh...? Moderate: in between the extreme views of either parties.

Democratic: what we have inherited. To voice disproval of democracy is allowed only because you're in the democracy. So flaunt it... You're a lesson in irony.

All that to say that I think personal freedoms should reign supreme. So believe what you want, do what you want, and I'll do the same (personal liberties are supreme see?)

Vive la liberte.


You can choose to support abortion and gay rights and call yourself a moderate libertarian if you please. There is nothing libertarian in our current Presidential administration or in the national democratic leadership. They even take your "moderate" examples and twist them into partial birth abortion and gay marrriage.
_________________________
“Reality is what continues to exist whether you believe in it or not.” 

“The further a society drifts from truth the more it will hate those who speak it.”

Top
#3032627 - 11/14/12 08:55 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: de novo]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10493
Loc: Warren Co

Offline
Gay marriage is not a libertarian point of view. Its a far left wing point of view.

The libertarian point of view on gay marriage would be "how dare you stick your nose into my personal and private business? I will keep my personal private business private and you keep your stinking government out of it. "

See how easy it is for the progressives to co-opt almost any group into supporting them simply by saying "we are for your special interest group ! Vote for us and we will grant you special status and perk$ ! "
_________________________
If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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#3033447 - 11/14/12 05:56 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: MidTennFisher]
Bobcat
TnDeer Old Timer
10 Point


Registered: 05/04/00
Posts: 3203
Loc: Jackson, TN USA

Offline
 Originally Posted By: MidTennFisher
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
 Originally Posted By: MidTennFisher
 Originally Posted By: fishboy1
I think One simple change would "FIX" what is wrong with America.

If you have received funds from the Federal government in the past 24 months you are ineligible to vote. Employment, loans, welfare....


So because I receive student loans to finish up college I wouldn't be allowed to vote? I'm not going for some B.S. major either like womens studies or art history, I'm studying electrical engineering. Having to have a photo ID to vote would help. Isn't it amazing how Obama lost every state that has voter ID laws? It's time to face the facts here, it's over for this country. Roughly 50% of this country was ready and willing to re-elect a Communist and they succeeded. We're not America anymore, not what great men fought and died for. We've been rolled by a community organizer Marxist and it's disgusting. We'll survive but things are going to be very different going forward (no pun intended). Save your money, I can't stress it enough. Save your money, and buy ammo.



Yes.. If you receive student loans there is a direct conflict of interest. No vote.

Government should NOT be in the student loan business.
College degrees were worth something when they were hard to get.


That's ridiculous. I'm as Conservative as everyone else in here and I see nothing wrong with taking out student loans for degrees that will result in me actually helping this country. Liberal Arts, Ethnic Studies, Art History, etc. yes...complete waste of time and money. Some college degrees are certainly still worth something and electrical engineering is one of them. It's still very hard to earn, regardless of student loans.


Being an art major, let me be the first to say, "Piss on you." You may think my area of study is BS, but I think that you, all by yourself, are big steamin' pile of BS.

Carry on.

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#3033458 - 11/14/12 06:05 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Bobcat]
Beardendy88
4 Point


Registered: 07/07/12
Posts: 343
Loc: North Alabama

Offline
There is a lot of estrogen floating around here. Bobcat let me be the first to say I commend you for getting a degree no matter what your concentration of studies. I personally am studying radiology so I know how hard some classes can be.
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#3033460 - 11/14/12 06:06 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Bobcat]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10493
Loc: Warren Co

Offline
See how easily people are derailed from a coherent line of thought?

Ridicule is one of the major weapons in rules for radicals. Once the insults start thought ceases and anger takes over.

Im glad people get riled up over the idea of loosing their voting privileges in exchange for government hand outs. It firmly establishes in their mind that they are under the thumb of the government where they might not have thought of it that way before.

There is no shame in making the best of a bad situation. The government makes rules to benefit certain interest groups. Student loans are SOLD as a benefit to students when they are really a taxpayer funded benefit to the banks and universities.
THAT is who is really coming out ahead.

So IF you are sold on going to university then do a cost benefit analysis of your desired degree. Then run the numbers again taking into consideration the interest on the student loan debt.
Evaluate your REALISTIC expected income and ability to get a job based on your degree. The added income you receive for your degree should be enough to pay off your student loan debt in 5 years or less.
_________________________
If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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#3033576 - 11/14/12 07:34 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: fishboy1]
Bobcat
TnDeer Old Timer
10 Point


Registered: 05/04/00
Posts: 3203
Loc: Jackson, TN USA

Offline
My post was directed at MidTennFisher and noone else. I got my degree in an area that interested me and I make a comfortable living because of it. For someone to call my degree a waste of time and money ticks me off a little. Sorry to derail the train of thought
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#3033615 - 11/14/12 08:04 PM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Bobcat]
FLTENNHUNTER1
16 Point


Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 15538
Loc: Tampa FL

Offline
47 states so far...

Very, VERY interesting times we are living in.
_________________________
The Second Amendment - George Washington didn't use free speech to defeat the British, he shot them.
"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." - Thomas Paine





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#3034081 - 11/15/12 08:32 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: de novo]
Baxter83
Good ol' Boys
12 Point


Registered: 09/03/08
Posts: 7300
Loc: Winchester, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: de novo


To me disallowing those with federal student loans to vote is no more radical than allowing those on welfare, Section 8, foodstamps, etc. to vote. We have reports of the mentally ill being loaded up in vans to vote. We're trying to push for felons to have their voting rights restored due to racism, etc.

IMO, voting rights should be restricted not expanded.


Amen to that!

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#3035852 - 11/16/12 06:43 AM Re: Tennessee Petition to withdraw from United States [Re: Baxter83]
fishboy1
16 Point


Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 10493
Loc: Warren Co

Offline
This secession movement nonsense needs to stop and that energy needs to be placed into strategic action for the next election cycle.

Conservatives have a HUGE opportunity that they keep overlooking due to poor leadership. The YOUNG.

Want to make a near clean sweep of the under 30 voter demographic?

Here is the message "how do you feel about your future? Before you even entered highschool the government opened a credit card in your name with $136,000 on the balance. And guess what? Those arseclowns in washington want to keep spending up that balance. How do you feel about the job market? Competing with hundreds of other people with years of experience for that same one job? Maybe its time we turn our backs on the old way of doing business. No more Spend spend spend, tax tax tax... Maybe a radical new(old) idea of severely limiting the Feds ability to bankrupt you before you even get out of elementary school makes sense."

The young are the ones with the time and energy to make a sea change happen.
_________________________
If you can't trust people with freedom, how can you trust them with power ?




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