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#2942604 - 09/13/12 08:18 PM Re: My opinion on broad heads this year! [Re: yamaha200]
double browtine
8 Point


Registered: 12/04/10
Posts: 1579
Loc: north mid tn

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Going to go buy some new heads tomorrow. I am torn between the nap killzones and the schwackers. I have used nap products in the past with success, thunderheads and spitfires. Every nap product hit just like my field points in the past. Has anyone shot both and have an opinion? Great thread by the way!
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#2942714 - 09/13/12 09:22 PM Re: My opinion on broad heads this year! [Re: 102]
UTGrad
14 Point


Registered: 12/01/07
Posts: 8707
Loc: Franklin, TN

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 Originally Posted By: 102
Look,
I am not a scientist, so giving you EXACT, scientific details on knife sharpening just isn't going to happen.

What I can do is take HUGE amounts of information, say from a data pool of FIVE HUNDRED BOW KILLED deer, and translate THAT information into something PRACTICAL.

And here is what I have learned.

Dull broadheads simply PUSH veins and arteries out of the way, rather than slicing through them thus causing more severe bleeding and a quicker death.

Afterall, archery killed deer die from BLOOD LOSS. (unless it is asphyxiation due to lung collapse and diaphram damage)

I have recovered over 200 arrow killed deer personally and been involved with HUNDREDS more, gun and bow. I am pretty sure I have seen about every wound channel imaginable, and some that should NEVER be imagined.

DULL blades kill deer. And VERY effectively when you are talking about BOTH lungs. But, according to MY experience, NOT AS EFFECTIVELY as VERY SHARP HEADS.

And finally, I will add this. So many times I have heard hunters say, "hey, I hit that deer way too far back and he dropped after running ONLY a few yards". Yet they had NO CLUE that even thought they did indeed hit the animal high and back, toward the guts, the arrow sliced through the KIDNEYS, A LETHAL but VERY low percentage shot. Or maybe "hey, I GUT shot that deer RIGHT THROUGH THE STOMACH, and it fell after only 75 yards". And yet the hunter had NO IDEA that they sliced the pyloric artery in half.

Luck always plays a role in killing. But luck plays little role in killing effectively, humanely, purposefully, and CONSISTENTLY!!!

SHARP, WIDE (as you can afford), ACCURATE.



102,

Is there a REASON you have to capitalize your main points in a post? It comes across to me like I'm getting LECTURED. I appreciate your knowledge but you are not the ONLY person with solid advice or opinion.

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#2942874 - 09/14/12 03:26 AM Re: My opinion on broad heads this year! [Re: UTGrad]
102
10 Point


Registered: 08/01/02
Posts: 4021
Loc: Tennessee

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I can and will "lecture" if someone wants to be lectured.
But capitalizing was not intended to "LECTURE" in my writing.

I capitalize to EMPHASIZE a point I am trying to make.

And that point is to try to shed some light on yet another way for the TV media "propaganda bandits" to separate so many hard working hunters from their hard earned dollars.

It is absolutely NOT necessary to spend FIFTEEN dollars per broadhead to kill a deer effectively. There are PLENTY of SHARP, ACCURATE, and WIDE heads that one can buy that will do nicely.

If this comes across as a lecture, or "a gorilla beating his chest" or a "know it all" or whatever may offend, just place me on your ignore list and all will be fine.

But before you do this, I ask you to help me understand how can I can help other fellow bowhunters NOT make some of the same irritating, wasteful, costly and SICKENING mistakes I have made over the past 30 years by sharing my knowledge WITHOUT sounding like a know it all?

Or someone "beating my own chest". Or someone trying to brag or whatever.

It's funny, but in the past, when I have spoken in groups, I don't get this same reaction as I do occasionally on a message board. I wonder if it is just easier to voice agitation with a writer.

And one more thing. If I were asking questions about a topic like broadheads or ANYTHING to do with any subject for that matter, I would want answers from people who had the MOST experience available. NOT from people who just had ideas or a little experience. If that sounds like ego issues, ignore me.
_________________________
God, Family, Job, Bowhunting
Luck is where Opportunity and Preparation MEET!
When in doubt...back out!
SCAPAS.stay calm and pick a spot.

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#2942990 - 09/14/12 06:51 AM Re: My opinion on broad heads this year! [Re: W.Seay]
richmanbarbeque
16 Point


Registered: 07/17/03
Posts: 12774
Loc: Middle, Tn

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At times it appears 102 comes across as cocky, arrogant and whatever you want to think. in the past I have felt the same way. I now look at him as trying to get across his experiences so other people learn not to make mistakes he may have made in the past. I am sure he will admit he doesn't know everything but him and his hunting buddies have a lot of experience. Now, when he starts chasing gut shot deer like Bowriter and name dropping we can all kick him in the nuts but until then I will try to learn what I can.
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#2943164 - 09/14/12 09:21 AM Re: My opinion on broad heads this year! [Re: richmanbarbeque]
Crow Terminator
TnDeer Old Timer
14 Point


Registered: 10/23/99
Posts: 8873
Loc: McMinn County

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102 -- You're alright by me. No complaints here. Experience is the best teacher....listening to experience is right there with it. Sometimes newer archers act just like teenagers...they know it all and ain't nobody gonna tell them different. Then they get some time under their belt and they see them ole folks weren't as dumb and outdated as they first thought.

Now onto broadheads. I like mine sharp as well but I look at blade thickness and material as well. I like the concept of mechanical heads but I find most have really thin blades with very fine sharpened edges...basically my findings have been that these edges will dull extremely fast and why so many are bent or broken upon retrieving...just aren't built well. VS some of the thick blade fixed heads....where you can blow through a deer and still be sharp enough to cut you really bad.

Two of the sharpest out of pack broadheads I've handled have been the Slick Tricks and a G5 Stryker. In mechanicals it would be the Grim Reapers. I have a Slick Trick my wife killed a deer with that still has hair and gore on it...the blades aren't nicked or rolled over and its still sharper than some heads I've pulled straight out of the packages.

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#2943220 - 09/14/12 10:06 AM Re: My opinion on broad heads this year! [Re: richmanbarbeque]
scn
14 Point


Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 9681
Loc: Brentwood, TN US

content Online
 Originally Posted By: richmanbarbeque
At times it appears 102 comes across as cocky, arrogant and whatever you want to think. in the past I have felt the same way. I now look at him as trying to get across his experiences so other people learn not to make mistakes he may have made in the past. I am sure he will admit he doesn't know everything but him and his hunting buddies have a lot of experience. Now, when he starts chasing gut shot deer like Bowriter and name dropping we can all kick him in the nuts but until then I will try to learn what I can.


x2 on 102, Rich.

I think this is my 43 consecutive bow season. I've seen a lot of changes and waded through a lot of bs during those years. You learn to recognize knowledge. When 102 and Radar speak about bows and bow hunting, I listen and learn.
_________________________
Life is too short to fish with a dead cricket.

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#2943271 - 09/14/12 10:45 AM Re: My opinion on broad heads this year! [Re: scn]
thejetman
6 Point


Registered: 09/11/11
Posts: 537
Loc: Knox

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What ever happened to Muzzy brand heads? I shot those for years until this year. My belief is that the arrows are going so fast now that any discrepency between broadhead and wind will throw it off. They act like "canards" on an aircraft. I switched to mechanicals because, in my experiance, were more accurate than my ol Muzzies. I have killed many deer with a fixed blade head. But speed exemplifies inconsistencies in arrow/broadhead/fletching configurations. Its all just a theory though.
_________________________
Archers see how far away they can hit a target, Bowhunters see how close they can get to theirs.

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#2943302 - 09/14/12 11:09 AM Re: My opinion on broad heads this year! [Re: thejetman]
TNDeerGuy
12 Point


Registered: 11/28/06
Posts: 6003
Loc: Old Hickory/Mt.Juliet, TN

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 Originally Posted By: thejetman
What ever happened to Muzzy brand heads? I shot those for years until this year. My belief is that the arrows are going so fast now that any discrepency between broadhead and wind will throw it off. They act like "canards" on an aircraft. I switched to mechanicals because, in my experiance, were more accurate than my ol Muzzies. I have killed many deer with a fixed blade head. But speed exemplifies inconsistencies in arrow/broadhead/fletching configurations. Its all just a theory though.


It actually is not a theory, you have brought up a very valid point, one that many don't consider—the effects on air movement around a broadhead and the proper fletching. Even though many of us agree that the key to proper arrow flight is a properly tuned arrow and bow, the correlation between broadhead flight and the type of fletching is often removed from the equation because of the popularity of the mini fletchings such as the Blazer. In certain cases, some of the larger profile designed broadheads will require the stability and control a larger fletching, such as a 4-inch vane, will give so that it negates, or minimizes, the effects of the "canard" effect coming from the front of the arrow.

Muzzy's are stone-cold killers and have definately stood up to the test of time, but I have seen in several cases that they can be finicky. All that is needed is the time and patience to figure out the "sweet-spot" of someone's entire setup. Most just don't take the time, or have the tools, to find that "sweet-spot"—it's not intended as a knock, just a fact.
_________________________


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#2943333 - 09/14/12 11:31 AM Re: My opinion on broad heads this year! [Re: TNDeerGuy]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 19042
Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN

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 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy
 Originally Posted By: thejetman
What ever happened to Muzzy brand heads? I shot those for years until this year.


Muzzy's are stone-cold killers and have definately stood up to the test of time, but I have seen in several cases that they can be finicky. All that is needed is the time and patience to figure out the "sweet-spot" of someone's entire setup. Most just don't take the time, or have the tools, to find that "sweet-spot"—it's not intended as a knock, just a fact.

x 2

Muzzys had been my head of choice for many, many years.
But believe there are better-flying heads today, reasonably priced.

This year, I'm hunting with 4-blade Slick-Tricks which I believe are a tad more forgiving and with more total cutting edge than the 3-blade muzzys.

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#2943348 - 09/14/12 11:43 AM Re: My opinion on broad heads this year! [Re: TNDeerGuy]
thejetman
6 Point


Registered: 09/11/11
Posts: 537
Loc: Knox

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 Originally Posted By: TNDeerGuy
[quote=thejetman]What ever happened to Muzzy brand heads? I shot those for years until this year. My belief is that the arrows are going so fast now that any discrepency between broadhead and wind will throw it off. They act like "canards" on an aircraft. I switched to mechanicals because, in my experiance, were more accurate than my ol Muzzies. I have killed many deer with a fixed blade head. But speed exemplifies inconsistencies in arrow/broadhead/fletching configurations. Its all just a theory though.



Right. I had to refletch my arrows to make the Muzzies shot right. I had to remove the blazer vanes. And I installed Bigger fusion vanes with a helical fletch. Then I had to spend a week dialing it in. Then, I bought some Rage heads, and had to start all over. The muzzies shot high out of the same setup, 4 inches to be exact. With older, slower bows, the effect of wind accross the blades was negligable at best. But, the faster an object moves through air, the more suseptable it is to drag, at any point, and will then make small differences in resistance huge differences in flight.


Edited by thejetman (09/14/12 11:44 AM)
_________________________
Archers see how far away they can hit a target, Bowhunters see how close they can get to theirs.

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