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#2899175 - 08/07/12 03:03 PM Blind Buying
Donk
4 Point


Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 142
Loc: Tn,USA

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Perhaps some one can explain to me how that many sworn Twra personel can watch as Duck blinds are bought and sold in plain view and Nothing be done.This happens year after year.He spoke of the riot act this year before the draw started,didnt even slow'em down.I know they saw many blinds sold.Several groups were watching the OFFicers watch the people buying and selling.There has to be a reason for not enforcing the law on this matter.Just wanting someone to explain it to me.
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#2899194 - 08/07/12 03:24 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Donk]
scn
14 Point


Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 9809
Loc: Brentwood, TN US

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 Originally Posted By: Donk
Perhaps some one can explain to me how that many sworn Twra personel can watch as Duck blinds are bought and sold in plain view and Nothing be done.This happens year after year.He spoke of the riot act this year before the draw started,didnt even slow'em down.I know they saw many blinds sold.Several groups were watching the OFFicers watch the people buying and selling.There has to be a reason for not enforcing the law on this matter.Just wanting someone to explain it to me.


If you can come up with a way to make a prosecuable case, please give me a PM and I'll be happy to listen. There are MANY times in law enforcement where you can know a violation has taken place but do not have sufficient evidence to prosecute the case. I understand your frustration. Our officers are frustrated as well. But, under the current scenarios it is very difficult to enforce that regulation.
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#2899239 - 08/07/12 03:59 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: scn]
Pic IN the Casa
14 Point


Registered: 03/18/11
Posts: 9430
Loc: TN

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How can one sell a blind when you must posess a sign on card? Just curious.
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#2899317 - 08/07/12 05:23 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Pic IN the Casa]
cmn
Spike


Registered: 11/07/10
Posts: 78
Loc: nashville,tn

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Lawbreakers will always find a way. Try enforcing a shooting hour violation of less than 5 minutes. DA won't touch it no matter what. EVIDENCE is hard to come by.
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#2899408 - 08/07/12 07:08 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Donk]
Grizzly Johnson
Team Grizzly
16 Point


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 15147
Loc: Tennessee

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I think they should go back to the computer draw system.....
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#2899460 - 08/07/12 08:07 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
scn
14 Point


Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 9809
Loc: Brentwood, TN US

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 Originally Posted By: Grizzly Johnson
I think they should go back to the computer draw system.....


x2

But, it likely would not help the buying/selling issue very much.
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#2899550 - 08/07/12 09:04 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: scn]
Grizzly Johnson
Team Grizzly
16 Point


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 15147
Loc: Tennessee

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It would make the buyers have to put forth a little more effort than just walking up to a guy at the draw with a wad of cash.....
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But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

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#2899571 - 08/07/12 09:21 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
Main Beam
4 Point


Registered: 10/20/07
Posts: 273
Loc: Gibson Co

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Pardon me but the guy said TWRA officers watched money being exchanged! cmon man! Something dont sound right
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#2899587 - 08/07/12 09:30 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
scn
14 Point


Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 9809
Loc: Brentwood, TN US

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 Originally Posted By: Grizzly Johnson
It would make the buyers have to put forth a little more effort than just walking up to a guy at the draw with a wad of cash.....


Or, it would give them the opportunity to do all of their dirty work behind the scenes and out of public view.

IMO, it is worth a try and could cut down on a lot of wasted gas going to the draws.

But, beware. The last time the Commission even discussed a computer draw a lot of duck hunters quickly mobilized a lot of political pressure.

There are issues with it as well. My guess is that you would have a lot of hunters that live well outside the area put in for the blinds. It remains to be seen if they would drive 200+ miles to build and brush blinds. But, after seeing and hearing of some of the things that are going on at the drawings, I'm ready to try something else.
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#2899590 - 08/07/12 09:32 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Main Beam]
scn
14 Point


Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 9809
Loc: Brentwood, TN US

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 Originally Posted By: Main Beam
Pardon me but the guy said TWRA officers watched money being exchanged! cmon man! Something dont sound right


I was in a meeting with our Region I guys today on some other matters. That did not take place in our view. I think they saw hand signals, may have heard numbers discussed, but they did not see money change hands.
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#2899644 - 08/07/12 09:56 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: scn]
Grizzly Johnson
Team Grizzly
16 Point


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 15147
Loc: Tennessee

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I quit going to the Big Sandy drawing because of the foolishness going on.... too many out of towners drawing blinds and the locals were SOL.... I know of people from Chattanooga going to the Big Sandy draw....

The ones causing a fuss are probably the ones making deals... they cause a fuss because their "plan" is being threatened.

Doesn't make much difference to me.... I either have to hunt public or a private property... The draw blinds, specifically the Camden Bottoms got to be too much drama cause by immature adults with big egos.
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But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

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#2899853 - 08/08/12 07:22 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
Tennessee Todd
Communicates like Rad
16 Point


Registered: 03/12/99
Posts: 12685
Loc: TuTu City, Tn

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Wow, almost makes me glad I don't duck hunt....
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#2899961 - 08/08/12 08:53 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Tennessee Todd]
feisty red head
Mature Red Doe
12 Point


Registered: 05/04/99
Posts: 7141
Loc: Cumberland Plateau

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 Originally Posted By: Tennessee Todd
Wow, almost makes me glad I don't duck hunt....

You could not hit a duck or goose if it was tied to a barn anyway \:D


Edited by feisty red head (08/08/12 08:53 AM)
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#2900008 - 08/08/12 09:35 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: feisty red head]
Tennessee Todd
Communicates like Rad
16 Point


Registered: 03/12/99
Posts: 12685
Loc: TuTu City, Tn

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 Originally Posted By: feisty red head
 Originally Posted By: Tennessee Todd
Wow, almost makes me glad I don't duck hunt....

You could not hit a duck or goose if it was tied to a barn anyway \:D


Will you shut up and get back to riding that broom.....
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This Country might survive Obama but what we won't survive is the mindset that elected him.

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#2900045 - 08/08/12 10:05 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Tennessee Todd]
feisty red head
Mature Red Doe
12 Point


Registered: 05/04/99
Posts: 7141
Loc: Cumberland Plateau

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LOL watch outI may put a spell on you
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#2900393 - 08/08/12 02:02 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: scn]
catm1
Spike


Registered: 01/02/10
Posts: 45
Loc: Tn

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Forget it guys, nothing is going to be done as long as Big Sandy, Benton and Henry counties are profiting from the festivities and carnival atmosphere that take place at these auctions, I mean drawings. The politicos in the area will see that nothing changes. This has gone from what is best for the hunting citizens of Tennessee to what benefits a very few local guides that make money off the blinds they buy. TWRA has tried, but it is just too ingrained in politics. Why take someone to court just to have it kicked out and in some cases having the 'offending' officers chastised in court because they brought in the "wrong" person?

It's time for the feds to begin their own investigation into Lacy Act and possible RICO Act violations that take place here.

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#2900442 - 08/08/12 02:44 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: catm1]
fredfred
8 Point


Registered: 06/24/12
Posts: 1762
Loc: crossville, tn

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Duck hunting is a big money sport, if you want the best spots that is. Now we just need all those duck hunters to start hog hunting
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#2901673 - 08/09/12 01:11 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Tennessee Todd]
farmin68
16 Point


Registered: 11/08/03
Posts: 13417
Loc: In a tree clinging to my guns ...

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 Originally Posted By: Tennessee Todd
Wow, almost makes me glad I don't duck hunt....


I grew up on KY Lake not three miles from Camden Bottoms. Duck hunted hard when I was in high school. Some of those egos mentioned are the very reason I don't hunt duck hunt there.

Now, If I want to duck hunt, I find the ducks in some timber and wait on them to come in. No boats, no blinds, etc. It is much more enjoyable.
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#2901825 - 08/09/12 03:32 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: farmin68]
ruger7mag
6 Point


Registered: 12/21/08
Posts: 811
Loc: tn

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TWRA makes a pile of money off of this situation. A large number of people buy the licenses required to draw, then go to the drawing with only one thing on their mind, to sell. Mentioned before, a computer draw would make things worse. People that don't want to go sit in the heat, could then put into the draw. Also all the people from all across TN would put in for it. I don't think anyone guides there anymore.

Edited by ruger7mag (08/09/12 03:40 PM)
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#2901972 - 08/09/12 06:06 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: ruger7mag]
duckman1
Button


Registered: 08/07/12
Posts: 1
Loc: Rutherford County

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There's a few still guiding sporadically. Between the politics and big $ it's going to be difficult to fix.
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#2902009 - 08/09/12 06:40 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Donk]
bigquacks
4 Point


Registered: 10/25/00
Posts: 462
Loc: bristol tn

Offline
my solution is that when you put in for the draw you list everyone that will hunt the blind. You 'reserve' a spot in the draw by putting in your credit card info and be assigned a number. If your number is drawn your card is then charged a fee. If you are not on the list when drawn you don't hunt, and you can only be in 1 group. If you are caught in a blind you were not drawn for you get fined and all people listed for the blind lose their privileges and all involved are not allowed to be involved in the next several years hunt.
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#2902035 - 08/09/12 07:17 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: bigquacks]
ruger7mag
6 Point


Registered: 12/21/08
Posts: 811
Loc: tn

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 Originally Posted By: bigquacks
my solution is that when you put in for the draw you list everyone that will hunt the blind. You 'reserve' a spot in the draw by putting in your credit card info and be assigned a number. If your number is drawn your card is then charged a fee. If you are not on the list when drawn you don't hunt, and you can only be in 1 group. If you are caught in a blind you were not drawn for you get fined and all people listed for the blind lose their privileges and all involved are not allowed to be involved in the next several years hunt.


Seriously? So if a friend ask you to hunt his blind with him, and if you then hunt their blind, you are breaking the law?! What about all the guys that blind hop, I guess they are screwed?
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#2903776 - 08/11/12 02:50 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: scn]
Main Beam
4 Point


Registered: 10/20/07
Posts: 273
Loc: Gibson Co

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Prostitutes are approached by law enforcement and when money is exchanged they are arrested, this would work for a while at the drawings! Then the criminal so called sportsman would find a different approach!
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#2905143 - 08/13/12 01:08 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Main Beam]
NoNtYpiCaL1
6 Point


Registered: 11/04/08
Posts: 577
Loc: McKenzie, TN

Offline
I say abolish the 8 man rule. Make it a computer sign up that would allow all your sign on's be submitted as a group and no changes can be made after the cut off date. The computer would then generate the cards that you would pick up the morning of the drawing at your selected draw site, each person would receive their ticket to drop in the barrel but it would be the group number or name assigned to your group of sign on. This would still keep your odds the same as each person would drop a number in the barrel, but once that group number is drawn then none of the other of that group in the barrel would be valid. Put the big sandy, gin creek and harmons creek draw together and the camden on its own. Charge a sign up fee $10-20 to cover the expense of the draw and the rest of the money be spent on the wma it was submitted for. This would allow for TWRA to plan on how many people are gonna attend each draw and the amount of personnel need for that draw site, no on site documentation to fill out other than the blind number put on the card, no decisions on who can sign on (help eliminate buy/sell). Also have the drawing in march-april to allow more time for construction or crop work if need be.
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#2905215 - 08/13/12 07:13 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: NoNtYpiCaL1]
Grizzly Johnson
Team Grizzly
16 Point


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 15147
Loc: Tennessee

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 Originally Posted By: NoNtYpiCaL1
I say abolish the 8 man rule. Make it a computer sign up that would allow all your sign on's be submitted as a group and no changes can be made after the cut off date. The computer would then generate the cards that you would pick up the morning of the drawing at your selected draw site, each person would receive their ticket to drop in the barrel but it would be the group number or name assigned to your group of sign on. This would still keep your odds the same as each person would drop a number in the barrel, but once that group number is drawn then none of the other of that group in the barrel would be valid. Put the big sandy, gin creek and harmons creek draw together and the camden on its own. Charge a sign up fee $10-20 to cover the expense of the draw and the rest of the money be spent on the wma it was submitted for. This would allow for TWRA to plan on how many people are gonna attend each draw and the amount of personnel need for that draw site, no on site documentation to fill out other than the blind number put on the card, no decisions on who can sign on (help eliminate buy/sell). Also have the drawing in march-april to allow more time for construction or crop work if need be.


Later in the summer or end of April, March-April is during turkey season....
_________________________
But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

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#2905502 - 08/13/12 11:31 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
Donk
4 Point


Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 142
Loc: Tn,USA

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There are some good ideas being brought up.Lets keep the ideas coming and give the TWRA some things to think about.
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#2906399 - 08/14/12 04:36 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Donk]
Waterfowler22
4 Point


Registered: 11/22/11
Posts: 190
Loc: The Duck Blind

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They won't ever do anything about it cause they are make to much money off of ppl buyin the license to even draw for a blind.
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#2908343 - 08/15/12 12:36 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Waterfowler22]
scn
14 Point


Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 9809
Loc: Brentwood, TN US

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 Originally Posted By: Waterfowler22
They won't ever do anything about it cause they are make to much money off of ppl buyin the license to even draw for a blind.


100% incorrect.

The licenses sold to the folks trying to "hit the lottery" aren't even in any discussion on the issues.

My hope is there will some changes in procedures before next year. What they might be is currently under discussion within our agency.


Edited by scn (08/15/12 12:39 PM)
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#2908897 - 08/15/12 08:17 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: scn]
ClubHead
6 Point


Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 780
Loc: Benton Co.Ky Lake,Tn

Offline
Just face it guys,really no way to fix it.If you go to daily draws,they would sell for 100 bucks first pick.No matter what you do they will be bought and sold,Card or not.I dont buy or sell,Just heard this for years on these forums and know that money talks.Anybody else out there that thinks otherwise,give me your way to fix and I give a way out for the buyers!!!!!!!!!!

Edited by ClubHead (08/15/12 08:22 PM)

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#2909444 - 08/16/12 08:47 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: ClubHead]
Wolfpack Alpha
Button


Registered: 05/01/12
Posts: 20
Loc: TN

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My idea would help cut down on the people that are showing up just for the Lottery. It might help cut down on a lot of the buying and selling of the blinds too because only the serious duck hunters would be there. On top of all the licences that you need to duck hunt, they should charge an extra $100.00 to enter the draw with all the proceeds going to that WMA for upkeep. I think you would cut out about 1200 to 1500 people at the Big Sandy drawing alone. This would help insure that the people actually entering in the drawing are serious duck hunters that are wanting a place to hunt. They would be less likely to sell.
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#2909461 - 08/16/12 08:56 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Wolfpack Alpha]
Grizzly Johnson
Team Grizzly
16 Point


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 15147
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
Well for the Big Sandy & Camden units, the "fee" for WMA upkeep might be ok.... because of the crops, access roads for blind construction, and whatever.... might be one thing.... But would you pay an extra $100 to enter the draw and just basically lose it if you didn't get drawn?

And in my area, the habitat, terrain, and land doesn't offer the same crop draw as the bottoms.... so the extra "fee" to the WMA from the waterfowl hunters wouldn't benefit us the same....
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#2909844 - 08/16/12 01:22 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
waynesworld
8 Point


Registered: 05/13/12
Posts: 1471
Loc: Mboro, Tennessee

Offline
I would suggest if you want to stop the buying in after they get drawn then you just make all the names be put on the initial paper that gets drawn. As far as stopping some one from getting a lisc for his friends just to up his chance. So what as long as it is a legal resident he has the right for a chance it is not like a election that they are having dead people vote \:\)
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#2910022 - 08/16/12 02:50 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: waynesworld]
Grizzly Johnson
Team Grizzly
16 Point


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 15147
Loc: Tennessee

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Yep.... because all those friends helping a guy up his chances, are buying a license just the same which is helping fund the TWRA at the same time....
_________________________
But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

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#2910192 - 08/16/12 04:47 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
TN_Greenhead
Spike


Registered: 09/15/09
Posts: 87
Loc: Middle TN

Offline
I say drop the draws at every wma...Cant leave the ramps or be at the wma till 4am...First on to the spot wins.
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#2910398 - 08/16/12 08:12 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: TN_Greenhead]
Grizzly Johnson
Team Grizzly
16 Point


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 15147
Loc: Tennessee

Offline
 Originally Posted By: TN_Greenhead
I say drop the draws at every wma...Cant leave the ramps or be at the wma till 4am...First on to the spot wins.


There isn't enough boat ramp for that kind of launch..... \:D
_________________________
But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

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#2913422 - 08/19/12 09:16 PM Re: Blind Buying [Re: Grizzly Johnson]
tickweed
10 Point


Registered: 11/25/09
Posts: 4764
Loc: medon,Tn.

Offline
I would bet its not going to continue muck longer. TWRA is not happy, and I dont believe for a minute they are letting it go because of generated income. I would say its because they know it would be hard to make it stand in court. I wish it was like the good ole days back when it was at the workshop. crowds of about 6-700. Real duck hunters, not lottery players. Got a feeling things are about to change.
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#2913597 - 08/20/12 05:46 AM Re: Blind Buying [Re: tickweed]
Hawk
TnDeer Old Timer
12 Point


Registered: 09/03/99
Posts: 6611
Loc: west tenn.

Offline
I doubt nothing will be done until all the life estates on the grandfathered private blinds at Reelfoot Lake expire.
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