#2038165 - 08/20/10 08:25 AM
Re: Why shouldnt we ask ?s
[Re: BSK]
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Football Hunter
18 Point
Registered: 10/22/07
Posts: 24550
Loc: Wilson Co/Perry Co
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Since when has anyone ever said "Thou shalt not question the TWRA ?"
Dude, you can do better than that if you want to stir the pot. If Ive seen it once,Ive seen it a thousand times,"Ill just hunt,and let TWRA worry about that." Not trying to stir any pot... Please... I don't see anyone saying "Thou shalt Not Question the TWRA." However, what I do see is the same group of people beating the same dead horse over and over and over again, even when it has been shown over and over again why their ideas don't hold water and why the TWRA does the things they do (seasons, bag limits, etc.). Wildlife Management is a science, and science is based on data. I see no data from the dead-horse-beaters. All I see is personal opinion-driven dead-horse-beating, and when that doesn't work, silly attacks on the data that generally come down to "But I've never received a survey," or "I've never had a deer checked by a biologist at a check station." No one is saying not to question the TWRA, but MANY are saying GIVE IT A REST. THE HORSE REALLY IS DEAD. Please....what is the "science" for extending gun,and all three deer units having the same limit?
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The best day to plant a tree,IS TODAY!
You wont know,if you dont go!
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#2038195 - 08/20/10 08:44 AM
Re: Why shouldnt we ask ?s
[Re: Football Hunter]
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Outdoor Enthusiast
6 Point
Registered: 12/04/07
Posts: 840
Loc: Nashville, TN
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If Ive seen it once,Ive seen it a thousand times,"Ill just hunt,and let TWRA worry about that."
Not trying to stir any pot... Please... I don't see anyone saying "Thou shalt Not Question the TWRA." However, what I do see is the same group of people beating the same dead horse over and over and over again, even when it has been shown over and over again why their ideas don't hold water and why the TWRA does the things they do (seasons, bag limits, etc.). Wildlife Management is a science, and science is based on data. I see no data from the dead-horse-beaters. All I see is personal opinion-driven dead-horse-beating, and when that doesn't work, silly attacks on the data that generally come down to "But I've never received a survey," or "I've never had a deer checked by a biologist at a check station." No one is saying not to question the TWRA, but MANY are saying GIVE IT A REST. THE HORSE REALLY IS DEAD. Please....what is the "science" for extending gun,and all three deer units having the same limit?
Hmm..
Edited by Outdoor Enthusiast (08/20/10 01:29 PM)
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#2038283 - 08/20/10 09:59 AM
Re: Why shouldnt we ask ?s
[Re: Outdoor Enthusiast]
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Hangnail
12 Point
Registered: 11/30/00
Posts: 6021
Loc: Murfreesboro, TN
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Without thinking about it much, I'd say TWRA would like for there to be a higher harvest of does AND bucks. More time in the woods for those that will utilized it might just increase the kill. The three buck limit statewide, from what I remember, isn't really taken advantage of by that many hunters.
I like the way TWRA gets its funding as it keeps politicians that get their exposure to wildlife from TV or through the window of their car out of the process. We don't need urbanites making decisions concerning wildlife. They can't even get people to do what they should and, unlike wildlife, most people can read at least a little. Deer, turkey, etc,, not so much. Now, as smart as some people think dolphins are, even going as far as comparing them to people, the next shopping center built by dolphins will be the first. That right there is some science.
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#2038315 - 08/20/10 10:13 AM
Re: Why shouldnt we ask ?s
[Re: Hangnail]
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Winchester
Non-Typical
Registered: 12/05/03
Posts: 25238
Loc: TN
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I agree hang, but a handful of hunters, can go to 1 single meeting, for a few hours 1 single day, and lobby for changes, whether good or bad, and get changes made, right there on the spot, affecting sometimes the entire states hunters. This is currently how our season setting/bag limit process is being handled. I sure dont think this is a foolproof method of doing things on a statewide level either! I dont blame TWRA, as I understand that its TWRC that allows such nonsense to go on, but its definitely a flawed system at best!
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#2038451 - 08/20/10 11:48 AM
Re: Why shouldnt we ask ?s
[Re: Winchester]
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Hangnail
12 Point
Registered: 11/30/00
Posts: 6021
Loc: Murfreesboro, TN
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I'm not saying the system we have is perfect, but its a lot better than many other states. Chances are pretty good that whatever damage can be done for a select few can be reversed once their idea is proven wrong. Some people jsut have to be shown everything.
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#2038539 - 08/20/10 12:51 PM
Re: Why shouldnt we ask ?s
[Re: Football Hunter]
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BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical
Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 59548
Loc: Nashville, TN
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Please....what is the "science" for extending gun,and all three deer units having the same limit?
No one ever said these changes were intended to change the deer herd or benefit the deer herd. They were done to please hunters and make regulations more even across the state.
Most importantly, after the first year of these changes, no harm appears to have been done. In fact, harvested buck age structure climbed to an all-time high, and harvest of yearling bucks fell to a decade low. Doe harvests continue to be adequate.
If you can provide more hunting and harvest opportunity without doing harm to the herd, why wouldn't you?
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan
"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James
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#2038900 - 08/20/10 07:03 PM
Re: Why shouldnt we ask ?s
[Re: BSK]
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Football Hunter
18 Point
Registered: 10/22/07
Posts: 24550
Loc: Wilson Co/Perry Co
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Please....what is the "science" for extending gun,and all three deer units having the same limit? No one ever said these changes were intended to change the deer herd or benefit the deer herd. They were done to please hunters and make regulations more even across the state. Most importantly, after the first year of these changes, no harm appears to have been done. In fact, harvested buck age structure climbed to an all-time high, and harvest of yearling bucks fell to a decade low. Doe harvests continue to be adequate. If you can provide more hunting and harvest opportunity without doing harm to the herd, why wouldn't you? Come on BSK,if me or Wes suggest something,we are asked "Where is your data to support this?"
You just said,"No harm appears to have been done."
I dont have the same education as you,but I do have one,and that seems like a double standard to me.Which might be fair,but where was the data ?
_________________________
The best day to plant a tree,IS TODAY!
You wont know,if you dont go!
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#2038910 - 08/20/10 07:13 PM
Re: Why shouldnt we ask ?s
[Re: Football Hunter]
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scn
12 Point
Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 6975
Loc: Brentwood, TN US
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The data that was there suggested that the regulations could be liberalized with no harm to the herd. There had been consistent recommendations from Unit B hunters to expand their season to equal the rest of the state at least in days of hunting. Traditonally TWRA has attempted to provide as much hunter oportunity as the resource will allow. In this regulation change the data from year one shows the agency very likely made the right choice. If the data begins to show otherwise at some point, then changes can be made.
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#2038954 - 08/20/10 07:56 PM
Re: Why shouldnt we ask ?s
[Re: scn]
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Football Hunter
18 Point
Registered: 10/22/07
Posts: 24550
Loc: Wilson Co/Perry Co
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The data that was there suggested that the regulations could be liberalized with no harm to the herd. There had been consistent recommendations from Unit B hunters to expand their season to equal the rest of the state at least in days of hunting. Traditonally TWRA has attempted to provide as much hunter oportunity as the resource will allow. In this regulation change the data from year one shows the agency very likely made the right choice. If the data begins to show otherwise at some point, then changes can be made. scn,no offense meant,but "hunter reccomendation"?We are constantly told on here to show the data,the science,once again I ask,how can Cocke,and Haywood have the same buck regs?
Im not mad about it,just doesnt make sense to me.
_________________________
The best day to plant a tree,IS TODAY!
You wont know,if you dont go!
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#2038966 - 08/20/10 08:02 PM
Re: Why shouldnt we ask ?s
[Re: Football Hunter]
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gator-n-buck
16 Point
Registered: 10/22/08
Posts: 14908
Loc: Knox, TN / Palatka, FL
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The data that was there suggested that the regulations could be liberalized with no harm to the herd. There had been consistent recommendations from Unit B hunters to expand their season to equal the rest of the state at least in days of hunting. Traditonally TWRA has attempted to provide as much hunter oportunity as the resource will allow. In this regulation change the data from year one shows the agency very likely made the right choice. If the data begins to show otherwise at some point, then changes can be made. scn,no offense meant,but "hunter reccomendation"?We are constantly told on here to show the data,the science,once again I ask,how can Cocke,and Haywood have the same buck regs? Im not mad about it,just doesnt make sense to me.
They might have the same buck regs.... but I guarantee both counties don't have the same doe regs..... You need does to have bucks and I don't need data to prove that..... Unit B is still all about protecting the does to help the deer herd.... Sometimes we get to hung up on buck regs.....
Edited by gator-n-buck (08/20/10 08:04 PM)
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