#2021267 - 08/07/10 08:30 PM
Re: "Trophy" Bucks and Recogniton
[Re: gator-n-buck]
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Tomahawk
6 Point
Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 762
Loc: east & west tn
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fulfill your REALISTIC expectations.
102 This is the one line I think a lot of hunters have a problem with... Don't get me wrong, theres nothing wrong with having goals but if you are fishing in a pond only full of minnows. Theres a pretty good chance your probably not going to catch a 10 lb bass. I don't know if its this new generation of hunters or all these hunting shows that might of clouded up the waters a little... All I can say is just hunt, have fun, and enjoy the outdoors.... Good post 102...
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#2021282 - 08/07/10 08:42 PM
Re: "Trophy" Bucks and Recogniton
[Re: BSK]
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Poser
14 Point
Registered: 07/28/10
Posts: 8110
Loc: Tennessee
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I'm not sure if I like nor agree with this post. I am not a trophy hunter. I think hunting shows are unrealistic, mostly rigged, and generally filmed on private QDMA ranches and/ or over bait piles and feeders, whether the viewer sees them or not.
BUT, there are hunters, particularly bowhunters who hunt in TN and in states with higher pressure than TN, who hunt almost entirely on public lands and are CONSISTENTLY successful at taking trophy bucks. Are these bucks out of the capabilities of 99% of hunters? Yes. Simply because 99% of hunters lack the motivation are are quite frankly too lazy to be consistently successful. That being said, I do agree with your focus on age. My personal goals for this Fall have much more to do with age rather than score.
That also being said, most hunters are average hunters who have average motivations, display average tactics and therefore produce average results. I don't claim myself to be above the average hunter, but your post seems to bear apologies for average skill sets and motivation. After all, why should the average hunter putting in average effort expect anything short of average results unless he happens to get struck by lightening?
Two bowhunters, both with day jobs, who hunt mostly, if not entirely public lands ,often areas deemed "hunted out" and consistently take trophy bucks:
John Eberhart: http://www.deerjohn.net/ who hunts in MI where bowhunters number 20 hunters per square mile, far greater than the most highly pressured areas of TN.
and TN native Bobby Worthington: http://bobbyworthington.com/ who consistently targets bucks that are 5.5 years and older. From the forward of his book:
"Phantoms of the forest – the object of our quest. What are phantoms of the forest? Well, I’ll tell you. In the context of this book it’s those very rare bucks which have been hunted by the human predator and survived to reach the age of 5 ½ years old and older. The 3 ½ and 4 ½ year old bucks are tough to get. This age class is plenty tough enough to challenge any hunter. They are mostly nocturnal; they have learned to work the wind and have finely honed survival instincts. But, I’m telling you -- once a buck makes it to 5 ½ he is sure enough a remarkable animal. It takes a buck with superior intelligence and cunning to reach this age class. Unlike a 4 ½ year old and younger bucks, you can not pattern a 5 ½ year old at all; because there is no pattern to their movement. They do not move a lot compared to the movement of 3 ½ and 4 ½ year olds and when they do move they are wide ranging, reclusive nomads. A high percentage of this age group will die of old age. They are 98 percent nocturnal; and they know how to play the game of survival and win against all odds. They have won the game of life by living long enough to become THE PHANTOMS OF THE FOREST."
The introduction to his upcoming book is posted on his site. While he goes a bit off the deep end on religion, I believe his hunting knowledge and motives are pure.
What makes these two guys different? They have blue collar day jobs, are married, hunt public land, don't bait, deal with pressure.... yet they are consistently successful. Would you deduce that their goals are "unrealistic"? What is the difference between these two guys (and a few other non-authors) than virtually anybody else on this board?
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#2021357 - 08/07/10 09:09 PM
Re: "Trophy" Bucks and Recogniton
[Re: Poser]
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RKenney
10 Point
Registered: 03/15/08
Posts: 3633
Loc: Maury Co.
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Bobby Worthington has alot of respect from me. He will probably
never have a commercial TV show....because he is REAL. I have
read several of his articles and they are amazing.
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#2021365 - 08/07/10 09:15 PM
Re: "Trophy" Bucks and Recogniton
[Re: BSK]
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Setterman
8 Point
Registered: 12/31/09
Posts: 1783
Loc: Knoxville, TN
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I guess 51 ptr did just that,just saying Yup, and he hunts the top big buck area of the state. Big difference between the Nashville Basin and places like high in the eastern mountains or in the endless ridge-and-hollow hardwoods.
BSK you are partially wrong IMO about the eastern mountains. Sure the Smokies lack the quality bucks which others areas do, but keep in mind there are more mountain chains in East Tennessee then the smokies. There are plentiful deer which would be viewed as trophies in anyones book. I disagree that there is a difference in quality of deer, maybe the skill needed to harvest said deer, but there are plenty of deer here which rival anything in the country.
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#2021366 - 08/07/10 09:17 PM
Re: "Trophy" Bucks and Recogniton
[Re: 102]
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Boone 58
16 Point
Registered: 06/23/04
Posts: 13530
Loc: Food Plot
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Great post! I have different standards for bow hunting than from gun. I will shoot almost any borderline 8 pt with a bow if i get the chance but seldom shoot really small ones since i can restrain myself. I have never killed a nice buck with my bow though i have over 50 bow kills. I find it difficult to even see a trophy buck at all during bow season.
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#2021388 - 08/07/10 09:35 PM
Re: "Trophy" Bucks and Recogniton
[Re: elauwit]
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RAFI
10 Point
Registered: 12/20/09
Posts: 2552
Loc: Tn
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I guess 51 ptr did just that,just saying Yup, and he hunts the top big buck area of the state. Big difference between the Nashville Basin and places like high in the eastern mountains or in the endless ridge-and-hollow hardwoods. very true.
Yep.Still nice bucks 51 has taken but it's a lot easier when they are there.most of us don't hunt land like that and don't have bucks like that to shoot but it doesn't make other hunters better or worse.despite what some bandwagon jumpers say.
Edited by RAFI (08/07/10 09:35 PM)
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#2021396 - 08/07/10 09:43 PM
Re: "Trophy" Bucks and Recogniton
[Re: RAFI]
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LIL JOKER
14 Point
Registered: 01/11/08
Posts: 9106
Loc: tennessee
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a hunter who kills big deer yr after yr on public land is indeed a better hunter imo..the ones who can pull out maps and pinpoint spots ,that take the time to scout and put in there time..
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#2021530 - 08/08/10 12:33 AM
Re: "Trophy" Bucks and Recogniton
[Re: RKenney]
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stik
TnDeer Old Timer
16 Point
Registered: 03/12/99
Posts: 18407
Loc: lenoir city,tn
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Bobby Worthington has alot of respect from me. He will probably
never have a commercial TV show....because he is REAL. I have
read several of his articles and they are amazing.
i have met bobby worthington. he is a very humble man and a class act all the way around.
_________________________
experienced hunters know its not just a bushy white tail, its a big middle finger.
nothing makes a fish bigger than almost being caught
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#2021563 - 08/08/10 06:06 AM
Re: "Trophy" Bucks and Recogniton
[Re: stik]
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102
10 Point
Registered: 08/01/02
Posts: 3650
Loc: Tennessee
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Poser,
Bobby Worthingington has been around for a WHILE. I first heard of him years ago when his name was mentioned on a video I was watching (not sure, but I think it was by ALan Altizer).
I agree with a lot of his ideas on hunting mature deer. But I DO NOT agree with ALL of his "theories". And the quote you just wrote is one. Some big bucks, 5.5 and older ARE patternable for brief periods of time, usually in late summer/early fall and USUALLY in farmland where they are much more visible from a DISTANCE. Big woods are probably different IMO because it probably takes a more invasive approach to actually SEE these older deer. THis causes intrusion, scent, disturbance, and danger recognition in an otherwise (humanly) un-disturbed area. ANd for this reason, I do almost ALL of my mature deer scouting in JANUARY of the season before (for big woods deer).
Your post seems to support mine. That average hunters need to set realistic goals. And that it IS possible to kill MATURE deer ANYWHERE in Tennessee. And, reading between the lines that Bobby writes, it is possible to kill a 5.5 year old buck, ESPECIALLY with a little luck and some dedication.
Obviously we all know that the harder and smarter one works at just about ANYTHING in life, the better the odds. Killing big antlered, MATURE bucks is no exception. But then, those who really work harder and smarter at ANYTHING in life, are usualy NOT average.
I don't have a clue about this 51 pointer guy. Don't know him, never met him. He may be the greatest bowhunter in the world. That and a couple dollars will buy him a cup of coffee. About the only fact I can be sure of is that I know there are a whole lot of hunters all over this State who can and do consistently arrow deer, on public, high pressure land every year, some of them OLD deer, some not. But because these guys don't put bucks in the book, or on the web, the recognition is not there. But, for them, that is JUST FINE. Because they do it for the love of the game and to meet their own personal goals.
I started this post to suggest that hunters, ESPECIALLY young hunters who so often see these threads and also TV shows, might get a better understanding of just what it takes to be successful. And that success does NOT necessarily equate to killing a 120 inch or better 4.5 year old PLUS buck.
Success to me is setting realistic goals, and achieving that goal.
102
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God, Family, Job, Bowhunting
Luck is where Opportunity and Preparation MEET!
When in doubt...back out!
SCAPAS.stay calm and pick a spot.
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