#2001463 - 07/20/10 10:30 PM
Re: Open for debate..selective harvest..
[Re: Camp]
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RKenney
10 Point
Registered: 03/15/08
Posts: 3633
Loc: Maury Co.
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If a 1.5 year old buck, that has super antler growing genes,
happens to impregnate a doe, will it be the same result as if
the same buck breed that doe when he was 5.5?
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#2001480 - 07/20/10 10:38 PM
Re: Open for debate..selective harvest..
[Re: RKenney]
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Setterman
8 Point
Registered: 12/31/09
Posts: 1783
Loc: Knoxville, TN
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If a 1.5 year old buck, that has super antler growing genes,
happens to impregnate a doe, will it be the same result as if
the same buck breed that doe when he was 5.5?
Of course
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#2001503 - 07/20/10 11:15 PM
Re: Open for debate..selective harvest..
[Re: Wes Parrish]
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Daff
Spike
Registered: 01/09/08
Posts: 50
Loc: TN
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Culling of inferior 140 class 8pts is common on high fence and huge ranches(texas primarily). The reason for this practice is that The target animals for those trophy hunts is 150 class and up 10+ point bucks. They make big money on those hunts but can't get the same price for the "cull" bucks so they have management hunts to capitalise on the mature bucks that won't bring in $8500 each. the objective is to make money! The flaw with trying to manipulate through culling in a free range herd is the genetics come from both the doe and the buck... so how do you know which does might be carrying undesirable trait?
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#2001589 - 07/21/10 05:56 AM
Re: Open for debate..selective harvest..
[Re: Double-D-Team]
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Bottom Hunter
16 Point
Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 15488
Loc: Hatchie Bottoms
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I guess we are different here in NE TN or on our farm we hunt. Seems to us the same old bucks but just one year older. Now we get some new comers now and then but we seem to keep our bucks around. We also leave the camera's up year round. I know I've got this one buck who is 6 years old, he has a special mark on him...Smart deer too...at least smarter than me....
The bucks that you are seeing every year are the ones that came to your area at a very early age.....once a buck puts down roots, he likely will remain there through his entire life.
the dispersal process takes place early in a deer's life......IMO, they never are a part of the breeding pool in their birth place. maybe nature's way of preventing inbreeding...?
the dispersed bucks show up and make your area their home well before they have grown to "respectable" size and before they have aged to dominance status.....
I have changed the way I think about buck harvest over the years.....the main reason that I won't shoot a smaller buck is simply because I don't care to and not for any "biological" reason.
Basically, IMO, if you want a balanced age structure in your area, then some smaller bucks must replace the 2.5 or older bucks on the meat pole.
IMO, I'd rather take the chance that a 1.5 year old buck does not have what it takes to be a 150 inch deer , than to shoot a very nice 120 inch 2.5 year old that maybe can be that deer that gets to 150 plus. If a buck shows promise at 2.5 years of age, then maybe it's best to NOT take him out even though he is the biggest buck you've seen. Maybe letting the 2,5 120 walk and taking a sub-100 inch buck ( to satisfy your bloodlust, lol)is the thing to do. That is if you care about the age structure of your deer and care about what size deer that you kill in the future.
Selective harvest may indeed work if your goal is proper age structure and not simply better genetics....again, having older deer in your herd is simply what proper age structure is about.....it's how nature intended it....so, if you are seeing tons of 1.5 year old bucks in your area and far less older deer, then maybe it would be best to take out a few of those younger deer.
sorry for the rambling.....again, did I make any sense at all?
LOL
_________________________
There are some people who always seem angry and continuously look for conflict.
Walk away; the battle they are fighting is not with you, but with themselves.
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#2001654 - 07/21/10 07:09 AM
Re: Open for debate..selective harvest..
[Re: turkeyhunter64]
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Double-D-Team
10 Point
Registered: 12/18/02
Posts: 3483
Loc: God's Country
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BSK schooled me on this subject a ways back and he was right. Here is my take on it...There no reason to cull in open range hunting. If you see a buck and want the buck then shoot the buck..its your tag.I'm selective on does as well..example if there are young one's with a doe then I pass. If it is a young buck then I pass.So yes I am selective in my harvest. And the bottom line is the hunting regs. force you to be selective if you think about it.
_________________________
Don and Dee (DOUBLE-D-TEAM)
THE RICHEST VALUES OF WILDERNESS LIE NOT IN THE DAYS OF DANIEL BOONE NOR EVEN IN THE PRESENT. BUT IN THE FUTURE--LEOPOLD
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#2001676 - 07/21/10 07:33 AM
Re: Open for debate..selective harvest..
[Re: Double-D-Team]
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Wes Parrish
16 Point
Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 16987
Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN
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There no reason to cull in open range hunting. If you see a buck and want the buck then shoot the buck . . its your tag. I'm selective . . . . .
Do you think hunters are generally LESS selective (on bucks, i.e., more likely to shoot ANY particular buck) when they have multiple buck tags, say two (2) vs. one (1)?
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#2001754 - 07/21/10 08:36 AM
Re: Open for debate..selective harvest..
[Re: RKenney]
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BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical
Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 59548
Loc: Nashville, TN
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If a 1.5 year old buck, that has super antler growing genes,
happens to impregnate a doe, will it be the same result as if
the same buck breed that doe when he was 5.5?
An animal's genetics don't change (other than the odd mutation) over their lifespan.
However, the really important question is, if a 1 1/2 year-old buck with super antler growing genes happens to impregnate a doe, has he passed any of those antler genes on to his offspring? To date, the best research suggests the answer is, "No."
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan
"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James
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#2001813 - 07/21/10 09:07 AM
Re: Open for debate..selective harvest..
[Re: Wes Parrish]
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Double-D-Team
10 Point
Registered: 12/18/02
Posts: 3483
Loc: God's Country
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There no reason to cull in open range hunting. If you see a buck and want the buck then shoot the buck . . its your tag. I'm selective . . . . . Do you think hunters are generally LESS selective (on bucks, i.e., more likely to shoot ANY particular buck) when they have multiple buck tags, say two (2) vs. one (1)?
I can't speak for other hunters but in my case if I only had one tag I still would be selective and if I had 3 tags I'm still selective. I only take what I feel is the right buck to take.
Now with the change in the upcoming reg for my area I can take 7 doe's and 3 Bucks. I said this the other day I might not take any bucks this season..only if a nice one shows. I have doe's for the freezer now...
_________________________
Don and Dee (DOUBLE-D-TEAM)
THE RICHEST VALUES OF WILDERNESS LIE NOT IN THE DAYS OF DANIEL BOONE NOR EVEN IN THE PRESENT. BUT IN THE FUTURE--LEOPOLD
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