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#1999192 - 07/19/10 09:09 AM Re: Honest choice? [Re: Wes Parrish]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 59670
Loc: Nashville, TN

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 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish

There is also an antler trait that usually correlates well with a buck's age: It's "mass" in terms of circumference or diamter of the antlers, which may have little bearing on either B&C score or how many points over an inch that buck grows, i.e. 6-pointer or 10-pointer, etc.

Note that on the above mature bucks, despite their relatively low B&C scores, it is "mass" that dominates what you see at a glance.

Just me, but I get more excited about seeing lots of "mass" on a buck than a "thin" rack that "scores" higher.


Mass goes with age? Yes, it does!

_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#1999199 - 07/19/10 09:15 AM Re: Honest choice? [Re: BSK]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 17068
Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN

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 Originally Posted By: BSK
Mass goes with age? Yes, it does!
ALMOST ALWAYS!!!
I believed this one to be 7 1/2 (although teeth were officially aged by several experts as being either 5 1/2 or 6 1/2-plus.)


By comparison, here is a "top-end" younger buck that net scored over 133. Note the difference in "mass", and the relatively long tines.



Finally, below is a 160's-class 3 1/2-yr-old buck that I did, as a matter of fact, pass, more than once. That's my best friend who killed it. And I couldn't have been any "prouder" for him. But I should add, I passed that buck up a year earlier when he was a 120-class 2 1/2, and I would have taken this buck as a 3 1/2, had I seen him before my friend did. \:\)
Based on tooth wear, several TWRA biologists aged this buck at 3 1/2 when killed. However, I suspect this buck was "late born" (what some call a "tweener"), and may have in fact been closer to a 4 1/2 in age.

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#1999216 - 07/19/10 09:37 AM Re: Honest choice? [Re: Wes Parrish]
MUP
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Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 36560
Loc: Just North of Chatt-town

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Yet on the other hand, here is a 3-1/2 yr old buck(aged at the checking station by the GW), that has exceptional mass for a younger deer. I told the GW that I had estimated him to be min 4-1/2 yrs old, but when he checked the jaw teeth, wrote him up as 3-1/2.

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#1999219 - 07/19/10 09:41 AM Re: Honest choice? [Re: MUP]
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical


Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 59670
Loc: Nashville, TN

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Mass is by no means a perfect measure of age. But ON AVERAGE bucks add mass with age.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan

"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James

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#1999237 - 07/19/10 09:51 AM Re: Honest choice? [Re: 102]
Tomahawk
6 Point


Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 762
Loc: east & west tn

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 Originally Posted By: 102
Here is some good hunting advice.

All too often, hunters forget one of the most important aspects of successful deer hunting.
THE WIND!

I've seen hunters who look forward to their trip and have their minds made up long before heading to their stand that this is where they are going to hunt. NO MATTER WHAT. And MOST often is is because they have put so much time/effort/thought into that tree stand that they'll simply forget the wind and hunt.

I don't care how much you paid for your scent control suit, it won't help if the wind is wrong.

ALWAYS scout your spots with ACCESS and EGRESS routes in mind and hunt with the wind IN YOU FACE. Or cross if necessary. BUT NEVER AT YOUR BACK!!!

Also...another often overlooked aspect of the hunt VERY under-rated is human NOISE.

These deer have been relatively undisdurbed for months and now some yahoo comes riding up on a 4-wheeler or slamming a truck door and guess who is listening.

While young deer may not care, OLD deer DO. And they learn QUICK to relate ANY human noise with danger. EVEN if a LONG walk is involved.

102
Excellent point 102. I know some people may think thats just common sense but its amazing how many forget that at the zero hour.

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#1999240 - 07/19/10 09:53 AM Re: Honest choice? [Re: MUP]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 17068
Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN

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 Originally Posted By: MUP
I told the GW that I had estimated him to be min 4-1/2 yrs old, but when he checked the jaw teeth, wrote him up as 3-1/2.

Aging deer is part "art", part "science".
Lots of honest mistakes get made.
It is particularly easy to underage a deer by one year.
Really high chance your buck was in fact 4 1/2.

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#1999330 - 07/19/10 10:36 AM Re: Honest choice? [Re: Wes Parrish]
Tomahawk
6 Point


Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 762
Loc: east & west tn

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 Originally Posted By: Wes Parrish
 Originally Posted By: MUP
I told the GW that I had estimated him to be min 4-1/2 yrs old, but when he checked the jaw teeth, wrote him up as 3-1/2.

Aging deer is part "art", part "science".
Lots of honest mistakes get made.
It is particularly easy to underage a deer by one year.
Really high chance your buck was in fact 4 1/2.
Well said Wes, that is right on the money.

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#1999356 - 07/19/10 10:55 AM Re: Honest choice? [Re: ghosthunter]
Winchester
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Registered: 12/05/03
Posts: 25335
Loc: TN

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No question the 165 hands down. While I like to kill fully mature bucks, bottom line is if they have enough Antler at any age they are a target! Now if I owned my own large piece of property I might feel differently, but I dont so I deal with it accordingly! I would likely pass the 6.5 yr old buck even if he was by himself, if he had a really small rack. He's not hurting a thing being there, and once he walks in front of me and I know myself that I could kill him if I wanted, theres no reason to shoot him if he doesnt have what im looking for!
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#1999976 - 07/19/10 08:46 PM Re: Honest choice? [Re: RKenney]
Boone 58
16 Point


Registered: 06/23/04
Posts: 13564
Loc: Food Plot

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The bigger rack of course..........
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#2000243 - 07/19/10 10:49 PM Re: Honest choice? [Re: RKenney]
buckhorn40
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Registered: 07/03/06
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Loc: Crossville

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165!!
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