If you can shoot accurately consistently at that distance, do it. But, I thought the thrill of hunting was to see how close you get when killing the deer?!? I guess everyone is different.

Years ago I cleanly took a deer at 305 yards with my HK91 (308 Win caliber).

Since then I decided that for me those types of shots are unnecessary and I won't be taking one that far again.

I took the shot just because I had faith in my ability and in my rifle.

However, as time has gone by, I've changed my mind and decided that it wasn't really 'sporting' to take that shot. My only reason for taking the shot was to prove something to myself, and in my opinion that isn't what hunting is about.

Since that shot years ago, the longest shot I've taken on a deer was at 60+/- yards. I drew a line personally that I wouldn't shoot over 100 yards at a whitetail where I hunt. There's just no reason to do so as there are so many deer. I'm a good enough hunter that I can slip in close enough and stealthily enough to take a shot at very close range.

Although I can understand why someone would take a super-long shot, for me it crosses the line I set for myself ethically as a hunter. Not bashing others decisions, but just throwing out my experiences.

For me yes for you probably not.

Hypothetical:
It is the last day you can hunt this season. You have seen very few deer all season and none of them were what you considered a shooter. You are in a shooting house with a good field of view, a rifle you have confidence in and a 130+ buck that is at least 3.5 years old standing still at 300 yards.

Do you take the shot?

,,I can easly set up at 75 yards on this same plot,,,
,,would it be unethical to intentionally set up 500 yards from where you know deer will be just to be able to say you killed a doe at 500 yards??

-----------------------------------------------------------

For me, no. I don't take that shot. I KNOW I can hit the kill zone at that distance. But "hunting" to me now has a different meaning than back when I took that 305 yard shot years ago.

But I can understand folks that don't feel that way, and don't bash them in any way for their choices. Just for me I set a standard and that doesn't include those longer shots when I know I have developed the hunting skill to creep right inside a deers territory, or set up along his travel corridor and make close shots.

BTW, this all relative to the Tennessee geography. If we were hunting antelope out in the midwest on the plains, where longer shots are the norm, then a 300+ yard shot would be in my playbook.
But for the terrain where I hunt in the gentle rolling foothills here in TN, a 300+ yard shot is unnecessary.

But I'm not bashing those that do make those shots. I totally understand, and it's a personal decision on each hunters part.

Just for me I set a standard and that doesn't include those longer shots when I know I have developed the hunting skill to creep right inside a deers territory, or set up along his travel corridor and make close shots.

But, I guess that if you are willing to risk wounding a deer or several deer just to be able to brag that you shot one at 500 yards, then go for it.

Isn't that why you are considering this anyway, to stroke your own ego?

Not being an ars here, just wondering what your motive really is.....

...but know I can nail em out to 300 yrds or so all day long, so that is pretty much MY limit.......

Hypothetical:

It is the last day you can hunt this season. You have seen very few deer all season and none of them were what you considered a shooter. You are in a shooting house with a good field of view, a rifle you have confidence in and a 130+ buck that is at least 3.5 years old standing still at 300 yards.

Do you take the shot?

Ethical as long as its not at a fawn. Aint that right rafi.

Now was this really necessary?? Think about it, did you really need to add this?? was it just to stroke your ego, or maybe wound someones feelings? What exactly is YOUR motive?

I was just responding to how the original post was written.

First off, he can set up on the food plot at 75 yards , which would make the shot alot easier and ,IMO, much more ethical, but instead he is asking "US" if he should move out to 500 yards so that he can (and I'm quoting here) "say that I shot a doe at 500 yards"....or basically BRAG about making a 500 yard shot on a living creature.....

Like I stated before, if you want to make a 500 yard shot, then do so at a TARGET. You can brag just as much about hitting a milk jug at 500 yards and not have to worry about wounding a deer. Deer should not be used for target practice, IMO.

If you have no choice but to take a shot that far and have practiced it enough to be comfortable with it, then take the shot....BUT, if you can get closer and take a better shot but choose not to so that you can boast about making the longer shot, then I find that somewhat wreckless and unnecessary. If you can get closer, then I suggest that you do....JMO and I thought that was what he was asking for, our opinions.

I will never see the reasoning behind taking a harder shot when a much easier shot is available. There are just too many variables with a shot of that length.

In a very similar situation, if I was bow hunting, I would never let a deer walk out to 50 yards when I had it at 10 yards , just to say I made the 50 yard shot.

Too many hunters think that the hunt is all about them, but IMO it's about much more. Respect the prey and you respect the tradition and the honor it is to be able to hunt.

sorry if I offended anyone.

Depends on your motivation. If you are doing only to say you shot a deer at that range and to stroke an ego- It is unethical IMO. If it is to test the effectiveness of a load at long range- unethical.

For me, personally, it's a 'yes and no'...
It is more than ethical to take the 500 yard shot provided you've done your homework on the range and are absolutely confident that 95% of ALL shots taken at that distance will result in a killing shot. Also provided you know your limitations as well and are willing to pass up game at that distance (ie, 15 mph wind, and you haven't shot regularly in those wind conditions; moving game, less than broadside shots, etc.)


I also agree with this as well. Shooting game at long range just to say you did it and stroke your ego would be unethical for me as well.

But there are lots of reasons to shoot at long range (beyond 500 yards). For me personally, my long range shots are never chosen strictly with the intention of shooting deer beyond 500 yards. Of all the deer I've killed beyond 500 yards, I was set up in places where I was just as likely to have a deer come out at 100 yards as I was at 700 yards. I like to hunt from the best spot first, then range becomes secondary. If the deer happens to be 650 yards away, then so be it.. it's dead if I decide to shoot. I do gain a significant advantage by being able to hunt some locations from distance without ever leaving human scent for future hunts (until I pull the trigger and have to venture into the spot to retrieve the deer).

But honestly, on a foodplot, I DO think you're much better off hunting it from a distance to minimize deer seeing you move into hunting position as well as minimizing the liklihood of human scent drifting into the food plot and surrounding bedding areas.

It works both ways guys. Im also one that loves to bowhunt and nothing makes me happier than to have done my job right, and have a big mature buck withing bow range and when I deflate him he never knew I was ever there, simply awesome. Now at the same time, there are many gun enthusiasts that like nothing better than spending their hours at a reloading bench, and then a shooting bench. Trying to see how far they can effectively kill their prey! Practicing and becoming efficient at 5 or 6 or 7 hundred yards, and then passing the ultimate test of cleanly killing a deer at your practiced distances, would also be a great success for many. I think labeling it as 'stroking your ego' may fall under the jealousy department. If you have no interest in learning how to do it this way thats fine, but dont condemn someone else for having a different goal of success. Some hunters would tell you that there is simply no challenge at all in killing a deer at 75 yards with a gun, so therefore they do their homework on long range shooting! Its all good, lets support each other on our wins!

It works both ways guys. Im also one that loves to bowhunt and nothing makes me happier than to have done my job right, and have a big mature buck withing bow range and when I deflate him he never knew I was ever there, simply awesome. Now at the same time, there are many gun enthusiasts that like nothing better than spending their hours at a reloading bench, and then a shooting bench. Trying to see how far they can effectively kill their prey! Practicing and becoming efficient at 5 or 6 or 7 hundred yards, and then passing the ultimate test of cleanly killing a deer at your practiced distances, would also be a great success for many. I think labeling it as 'stroking your ego' may fall under the jealousy department. If you have no interest in learning how to do it this way thats fine, but dont condemn someone else for having a different goal of success. Some hunters would tell you that there is simply no challenge at all in killing a deer at 75 yards with a gun, so therefore they do their homework on long range shooting! Its all good, lets support each other on our wins!

It works both ways guys. Im also one that loves to bowhunt and nothing makes me happier than to have done my job right, and have a big mature buck withing bow range and when I deflate him he never knew I was ever there, simply awesome. Now at the same time, there are many gun enthusiasts that like nothing better than spending their hours at a reloading bench, and then a shooting bench. Trying to see how far they can effectively kill their prey! Practicing and becoming efficient at 5 or 6 or 7 hundred yards, and then passing the ultimate test of cleanly killing a deer at your practiced distances, would also be a great success for many. I think labeling it as 'stroking your ego' may fall under the jealousy department. If you have no interest in learning how to do it this way thats fine, but dont condemn someone else for having a different goal of success. Some hunters would tell you that there is simply no challenge at all in killing a deer at 75 yards with a gun, so therefore they do their homework on long range shooting! Its all good, lets support each other on our wins!

we choose to see things differently and that's just fine. I'm not a shooter, I'm a hunter. I see a 500 yard shot as not such a big thing, especially with today's technology. Getting to within ten yards of a mature deer without detection, now that's a true test of a hunter.

As for being jealous of someone that can kill a deer at 500 yards, well, I prefer to be jealous of people that know more about deer hunting than I do.....IMO, with today's technology, laying a gun on a stationary rest and touching the trigger and hitting a target at 500 yards is far less a feat than by the shooter, but more of a true testimony of what technology has done in the recent past. Now, if you were to be Quigley Down Under and pull off a shot like he did, THEN, I might be jealous or at least impressed....lol!

Simply put, there are shooters that deer hunt and deer hunters. I know both kind and most deer hunters prefer the easiest shot because once the shot is presented, they have won. Most shooters will go into great detail about the shot and little about what it took to get in position to take the shot. There IS a huge difference in that way of thinking, IMO. While listening to deer hunting stories, I can quickly tell what kind of person I am listening to, by the details. strategy and planning is always a major part of a hunter's description while THE SHOT is always the biggest part of shooter's tale.....

here's a final thought......if anyone out there finds it too easy to kill a deer at 75 yards with a gun, then why not limit your shots to nothing over 20 yards. Simply plan your strategy to place yourself within 20 yards of your target and never take a shot past that distance. Maybe then, you'll understand why some of us truly love to deer hunt, not simply shoot at deer.

thanks for healthy debate.....

Anyone can make a 500 yard shot with the right gun and practice and a sold rest. It takes good judgement to keep ourselves out of situations that we need to prove it on a living breathing being.

What range was your 140 at?

Just wondering?

FH

So many threads would be enjoyable to read on this board without Bottom Hunter's "holier than thou" attitude.

So many threads would be enjoyable to read on this board without Bottom Hunter's "holier than thou" attitude.

So many threads would be enjoyable to read on this board without Bottom Hunter's "holier than thou" attitude.

Sorry that my attitude does not suit you. Sorry that you felt the need to label my attitude as "holier than thou".

I sure am glad that others don't always feel that way...lol.

As far as my attitude goes, I never try to push my way of thinking on anyone else. In order to get my point across, I find it necessary to explain my way of thinking in terms of "how i feel', and be honest about it.

I am a passionate person and most times , some things get me going. Ethical deer hunting pushes my buttons.

To better understand a man's way of thinking, you must first better understand the man.......this and only this is my intention.

Again, sorry that you feel that way about my posts. Just stop reading them....okay.

Feel free to skip over any and all of my posts from now on, I'm sure that you won't be alone. Also, bash me when the time feels right for you. Anything to make your day go better............
Oh and one last thing, if you ask for people's opinions, don't complain about the answers.

Thanks for another reason to post....

Thanks for proving my point........

And another thing the direction of the thread many times changes with your polarizing views which, in turn, requires some reading of your garbage. You come across as an arrogant, all-knowing, narcissistic jerk. I would imagine that you would argue about anything. I would say the silent majority of us "lurkers" agree. I normally ignore your posts but I guess I've had a "gut-full" lately.

I have an awesome food plot,with a salt lick at 519 yards from my shooting bench,,I can easly set up at 75 yards on this same plot,,the farthest I ever killed a deer is 485 yards,,I know I can make the 500 yard shot on an unspooked deer,,,would it be unethical to intentionally set up 500 yards from where you know deer will be just to be able to say you killed a doe at 500 yards??

starting the middle of august I will fire 4-5 shots at that range every single day,,rifle will hold 3 to 3 1/2 inch groups at the range

. . . . if you ask for people's opinions, don't complain about the answers.

That is a point well taken.

And we should note that no where above has the guy who originally asked the question complained about anyone's opinions.
Believe he wanted to hear all of them.

That is a point well taken.

And we should note that no where above has the guy who originally asked the question complained about anyone's opinions.
Believe he wanted to hear all of them.

to legally and ethicly kill a deer!

That is a point well taken.

And we should note that no where above has the guy who originally asked the question complained about anyone's opinions.
Believe he wanted to hear all of them.

the problem is that legality and ethics don't go hand in hand...
legality, it either is or it isn't in any given situation...that decision is made for us....
ethics are made by us, individually based on our own experiances and background...
unfourtunatly to many folks often always try to judge other folks by their own capabilities or points of veiw....

***** Two deer on my wall were taken legally but not ethically. I live with that fact each day and I know I should have made a better decisions. So I AM the pot calling the kettle black on this issue. I do believe I have learned from these mistakes, I certainly hope. Both of the forementioned examples came out with me killing great deer, but showing poor judgement.

I can not believe some of the BS that I am reading in this thread. First let me just ask what was so unethical about you killing those 2 deer? Did you club them to death with a stick or rock? God surely you have more things to worry about each day than how you killed those deer!
The purpose of the hunt was to kill the deer and that was the end result,right? Some of you guys are really to emotionally weak to even be hunting. IMO
If the shot can be made and you have faith in your ability to make it by all means take it. Heck I learned yars ago if you do not pull the trigger then your chances of killing him are zero! I let one of the biggest deer I have seen walk away because I felt he was out of my range at close to 500 yards and thought I would get another crack at him. Well I never seen him again and fact is most big mature bucks will not show themselves very often so I suggest practicing for the ultimate opportunity so whether it be 50 or 500 yards you feel you have a good chance at making it. Ethics has nothing to do with it IMO . I do not hesitate from 500 in. As a matter of fact I sit as far away as I possibly can and still make the shot. I have killed more big bucks that way than trying to get close enough to, as somebody said,SMELL THEM

I have so much to say here, but will refrain as to show respect for this forum........

*****************************************************************

Why ...let it loose,never stopped you before! I believe you were the one who jumped me about not having pity on killing coyotes. I am in the mood to hear your ethical logic...lets hear it!

Thought being opinionated was alright BH. LMBO Think a few of you guys might be happier knitting an afghan with
a buck on it rather than shooting one. JMO

Also, respect for the game animal does not make you weak or suggest that you should sit on the porch and knit ......it simply means that you are a responsible hunter.....

Thanks for the discussion.

Uh Huh.
There is a lot more involved to being a responsible hunter than worrying about how far the shot is. That is only a small part of the equation...IMO, but that is for another day.

Uh Huh.
There is a lot more involved to being a responsible hunter than worrying about how far the shot is. That is only a small part of the equation...IMO, but that is for another day.

EXACTLY, if we as hunters have nothing else to do but bash other fellow hunters for the distance of a shot, somebody needs to get a life. Dead is dead and wounded is wounded, and both happen from every distance and situation imagineable. We could pick every single person on this board apart and find something wrong with the way they hunt and call them unethical, foolishness is what it is and its exactly what will be the end all for hunters, fighting amongst ourselves is much more dangerous than the non hunters fighting us. This one is used, time to quit wasting time and move on.

Way less than 1 percent (some decimal number I can't remember) of american citizens consider themselves "serious hunters" . . . . . That is why it is o important for everyone, including myself, to be as ethical and discriminating as possible and uphold a responsible hunter image.

I am sure all of us have made hunting decisions we have regretted and an animal has suffered . . . . . room for improvement by everyone.

Dead is dead and wounded is wounded, and both happen from every distance and situation imagineable . . . . .

There is a lot more involved to being a responsible hunter than worrying about how far the shot is. That is only a small part of the equation . . .

. . . . . fighting amongst ourselves is much more dangerous than the non hunters fighting us.

I get upset over losing a squirrel. I lost one of the coyotes I called this winter and thought I would need therapy.

My point. I don't care to change up what I enjoy
just to TRY and appease a group that would never
accept me anyway. PC is out off control nowadays IMO

I have an awesome food plot,with a salt lick at 519 yards from my shooting bench,,I can easly set up at 75 yards on this same plot,,the farthest I ever killed a deer is 485 yards,,I know I can make the 500 yard shot on an unspooked deer,,,would it be unethical to intentionally set up 500 yards from where you know deer will be just to be able to say you killed a doe at 500 yards??

starting the middle of august I will fire 4-5 shots at that range every single day,,rifle will hold 3 to 3 1/2 inch groups at the range

Nope

I hunt because of the challenge that it gives me
Now if that means I stop using a compound and start
a using a re curve without sights or want to make long
long range shots that is what I will do..
A Long stretch to clubbing a baby seals.

All the politically correct BS doesn't interest
me. Honestly IMO does more to damage the tradition.

Guess I am a redneck and I will keep on killing animals,
eating them and decorating my house with their heads not
For a second pretending to care if I stepped on a
bug or broke a branch in the process no matter who
it may offend.

Most people are a product of where they are born,or live,500 yard shots are taken ,and made with regularity in the western US.

I can't see the challenge of the "hunt" when you shoot at excessive distances. The deer has little advantage at that distance. They can't really see , hear or smell you at that distance or even if they did, they wouldn't be too concerned, IMO.

Since it takes very little hunting skills to take a deer at excessive distances, then the challenge must be the shot. Right?

So, would it be safe to say that hitting a living animal at 500 yards is more difficult than a paper target or milk jug? Actually, in most cases a target (jug) would be somewhat smaller than a live deer, so IMO the jug would be more difficult to hit. Maybe it's because the animal can move, but surely no one would dare shoot at a deer at 500 yards while it was moving.....would they? Surely not.

So, since the "shot" has nothing to do with hunting and it's more about making a great shot, then why not just shoot something that won't suffer if you don't make a clean hit.....?

Plus, someone else mentioned the fact that at that distance you can not be sure what is behind your target or even what obstructions there might be that you just simply can not see. I have trouble making out tree limbs and sage grass at closer distances through a scope, much less at 500 yards.

What a hunter should always do before taking a shot is clearly identify the target and make sure that there is nothing behind or in front of the target. Even at close distances, hitting a limb can send a bullet off in to all sorts of directions. At that distance, once you touch off that trigger, the bullet has a long way to go before reaching the target. Bullets have no eyes and no conscience....Clearly seeing the target and knowing what's in the area (in front and behind) is the responsible thing to do and I just can't see that being the case at 500 yards.....

again, thanks for the civil discussion (for the most part,lol)

BH I used to work with a guy who had similar thoughts as you and he lost his taste for hunting and took another avenue...

I was going to leave this "out of hand dicussion" alone but BH you are way off base on this one. I can only assume that you have never tried to make a shot at those distances because it is quiet apparent that yo have no idea what your talking about. You are making way to many assumptions about conditions of the shot that may not even exist. I can kill a deer just as dead at 500 yds. as I can 50yds. The conditions of where I hunt regulary present the opportunity for me to have to make long shots. Without going into great detail as to why I have to take those long shots let me just say that years ago I decided after passing up opportunity after opportunity at big bucks because I felt the range was to far I decided to learn to make shots at those ranges and praticed and praticed and the one thing I learned there is a lot more to it than just putting the crosshairs on a spot and pulling the trigger. There are multiple varibles. There is a big difference in target shooting and shooting under hunting conditions. I would venture to say that the average hunter can not regulary even make a one shot kill at 300 yds let alone 500. Some even at less distance than that. They do not understand the ballistics of their weapon or bullets or conditions. Long range shooting is an art and much more of a challenge than you give it credit. Most people such as you that bash it do so simply because they can not or have not made a long shot. Personally I have set my limit at 500 yds because that is my comfort zone of feeling that I can make a clean kill if needed. Most come well within that range but if I have to I can. I do not recomend it for anyone who does not practice it. The way you describe it it is a piece of cake with no challenge and your dead wrong...IMO. Killing big deer is the real challenge not just a deer and being able to put the ability to make that long shot has made my success quality skyrocket.

BH I used to work with a guy who had similar thoughts as you and he lost his taste for hunting and took another avenue you may want to try. He sold his guns and bought himself a high dollar camera and would go to the woods and set up in stands with orange vest and all ,just like he was deer hunting, but he shot his deer with a camera. He had some great pics and satisfied his outdoors thrist and at the same time kept his soft heart happy !