#1939122 - 05/26/10 08:10 AM
Re: BSK
[Re: BSK]
|
Hawk
TnDeer Old Timer
12 Point
Registered: 09/03/99
Posts: 6141
Loc: west tenn.
|
Offline
|
|
Bigger is better.
What happens to the antlers of a buck that has been castrated?
_________________________
"A surplus of virture is more dangerous than a surplus of vice"
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1939203 - 05/26/10 09:32 AM
Re: BSK
[Re: Hawk]
|
BigGameGuy
TWRA Biologist
12 Point
Registered: 05/14/04
Posts: 6353
Loc: Nashville
|
|
Offline
|
|
Believe it or not Hawk, that is a myth. (And I also know that you probably don't think that but I'm going to use your statement as a teaching lesson since many folks really do think that...  )
When it comes to natural selection, fitness (being "better") is actually a product of whatever gene allows the animal to survive and produce the most viable offspring. In the case of bigger antlers, we are finding out that bigger is definitely not always better, especially if it leads to you getting shot faster (high grading). In fact, there is even a small population of slickhead bucks on the coast of North Carolina (I'm faily certain of the state) that is doing quite well because no one wants to shoot them. Because of this, their fitness has increased causing them to become "better" (if that makes any sense). Another good example of this is the extremely aggressive buck. Though he may have a smaller set of antlers, he can drive away more timid, larger antlered deer and do more of the breeding. In that case, the superior gene is the aggressiveness.
Anyhow, when I hear folks talk about superior genes, it's most often in reference to penned animals where they are trying to produce a specific characteristic. In nature, it's quite difficult to determine superior genes. That is of course unless you wait a few thousand years to see what comes of things. 
_________________________
If given the choice between education and regulation, I'll choose education every time.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1939221 - 05/26/10 09:48 AM
Re: BSK
[Re: BSK]
|
Football Hunter
18 Point
Registered: 10/22/07
Posts: 24550
Loc: Wilson Co/Perry Co
|
|
Offline
|
|
How could it be, that a big buck could grow
that much antler in just a few months? It is pretty crazy that an animal can grow that much bone so quickly. It seems like such an incredible waste of energy; to put so many invaluable body resources into something that will just be lost and have to be replaced the following year. Of course, if they didn't fall off, bucks wouldn't have the opportunity to grow larger antlers as they get older. Obviously, having larger antlers with age is important to the Natural Selection process. The question is, how larger is large enough for Natural Selection to function properly?
_________________________
The best day to plant a tree,IS TODAY!
You wont know,if you dont go!
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1939594 - 05/26/10 03:54 PM
Re: BSK
[Re: Football Hunter]
|
BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical
Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 59548
Loc: Nashville, TN
|
|
Offline
|
|
How could it be, that a big buck could grow
that much antler in just a few months? It is pretty crazy that an animal can grow that much bone so quickly. It seems like such an incredible waste of energy; to put so many invaluable body resources into something that will just be lost and have to be replaced the following year. Of course, if they didn't fall off, bucks wouldn't have the opportunity to grow larger antlers as they get older. Obviously, having larger antlers with age is important to the Natural Selection process. The question is, how larger is large enough for Natural Selection to function properly? Wonder why deer have "antlers" that fall off,and antelope have "horns"that dont and keep growing.?
Antlers and horns are two completely different features. Horns are actually made out of hair, while antlers are true bone.
But why Nature developed the two completely different features is a good question.
Interestingly, the ancestors to white-tailed deer did not have antlers. They had big canine fangs (as some deer species still do). On rare occassion, the genetic trigger for this ancestral genetic trait accidentally becomes active and the deer grows canine fangs.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan
"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1939814 - 05/26/10 06:24 PM
Re: BSK
[Re: Football Hunter]
|
Diehard Hunter
12 Point
Registered: 08/01/08
Posts: 5222
Loc: East Tennessee
|
Online
|
|
How could it be, that a big buck could grow
that much antler in just a few months? It is pretty crazy that an animal can grow that much bone so quickly. It seems like such an incredible waste of energy; to put so many invaluable body resources into something that will just be lost and have to be replaced the following year. Of course, if they didn't fall off, bucks wouldn't have the opportunity to grow larger antlers as they get older. Obviously, having larger antlers with age is important to the Natural Selection process. The question is, how larger is large enough for Natural Selection to function properly? Wonder why deer have "antlers" that fall off,and antelope have "horns"that dont and keep growing.?
Actually Pronghorns shed their sheaths every year, retaining the boney core.
_________________________
One of the penalties of an ecological education is that one lives alone in a world of wounds. Aldo Leopold
Don't argue with an idiot He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1941519 - 05/27/10 09:37 PM
Re: BSK
[Re: mr.big]
|
MRUTVOL
6 Point
Registered: 12/16/02
Posts: 868
Loc: Goodlettsville,Tennessee,USA
|
|
Offline
|
|
bmp
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#1941533 - 05/27/10 09:42 PM
Re: BSK
[Re: MRUTVOL]
|
Beekeeper
Good ol' Boys "Team Buckcreek"
16 Point
Registered: 08/26/09
Posts: 10946
Loc: McMinn Co. Tennessee
|
|
Offline
|
|
I know this thread started as a joke kinda but now that the intrest has started let me just say that no they do not all drop their antlers! I killed a 10 pointer about 10 years ago in late November that was in full soft velvet. He was a 4 1/2 year old. He had no male parts to be seen. I have seen not one but 2 already this year on the same farm . I first seen one in January while I was coyote hunting. He had a big typical 9 point rack and a large body so I would say he is an older deer. His rack was actually bleeding on one side for some reason. So I assume he was still in soft velvet also. Then the second one I saw was the opening weekend of turkey season in April. He had a massive velvet rack with the right side having 4 full typical points and the left side had a browtine close to 6 inches long or more along with a main beam but no noticable points on it and he was in full velvet also. Now question I have is it possible that somehow there is a gene being passed in this particular area that could be causing this freak of nature to occur or just a very bad run of luck and these 2 bucks lost their genitals in some manner. I hate to waste a tag but if I see them this fall I will probably take them out of the herd. They never lose these racks due to their problems but the racks do appear to grow larger with time. BSK what say you?? 
_________________________
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.
Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
Moderator: RUGER, Tennessee Todd, Unicam, Cuttin Caller, CBU93, stretch, Bobby G, Outdoor Lady, TurkeyBurd
|
12104 Members
38 Forums
115708 Topics
1409725 Posts
Max Online: 756 @ 11/20/12 09:10 AM
|
|
|
The TnDeer.Com Deer Talk Forum is for Tennessee Deer Hunters by Tennessee Deer Hunters. If you enjoy using our Talk Forum and would like to contribute to help in it's up-keep. Just submit your contribution by clicking on the DONATE button below and paying with PayPal or a major credit card. Any amount is much appreciated. Thanks for your support!
|
|
|
