#1720942 - 01/12/10 07:57 AM
Re: Baiting/ BSK or Bowriter or anyone
[Re: BSK]
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Winchester
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Baiting/feeding is no different than many other subjects in the world of the Whitetail, several different professional opinions can be found. For every study that has positive results there will be a study with negative results. I will have to say that most of the findings I have read and discussed with Biologists have been fairly negative for this area of the Country. First and foremost it just isnt necessary here, we have in most cases an abundant amount of forage for the deer, and more than enough deer to hunt and kill, without the aid of having to bait them. I just dont se the need myself, regardless of whether or not it is truly dangerous to the herd, no reason to take even a small chance IMO!
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#1720943 - 01/12/10 07:57 AM
Re: Baiting/ BSK or Bowriter or anyone
[Re: BSK]
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BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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Registered: 03/11/99
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Deerchaser007,
I'm shocked these researchers would suggest there is little evidence of disease transmission at feeders/bait piles as these locations have been proven to be a cause of the spread of Bovine TB in Michigan. Now without question deer overpopulation exacerbates the problem, but the disease IS being spread by baiting/feeding.
Now Hemorrhagic Disease is not contagious between deer hence is a completely different story. In addition, still little is known about the spread of CWD.
But I'm not worried about the diseases we KNOW ABOUT, as we have few contagious diseases currently in the Southeast. What I'm worried about is the future diseases that will develop. And the primary cause of these new diseases will be inter-species association.
Having spent enormous amounts of time discussing disease evolution with the true experts in this field, most "new" disease occur by benign agents jumping the species barrier to new species where the agent is not benign. AIDS is a perfect example of this. AIDS exists in monkey populations in Africa but does little harm to those species. They have become adapted to it. Humans on the other hand have no immunity, and once the disease jumped the species barrier, the results have been disasterous. Another example is avian flu. When that again jumps the species barrier to humans, the results will again be disasterous as it was in 1918-19, when it killed tens of millions of people.
Diseases jump species barries when the two species are in unnaturally close association. Swine flu and avian flu development in 3rd World countries where people live in one-room shacks with their animals. This type of unnaturally close association is a breeding ground for inter-species disease transmission. And what do we see in trail-camera pictures over corn piles or trough feeders? Deer eating from corn piles covered in other species, such as racoon. Deer eating from corn piles or feeders that other species are urinating, defacting, drool, sneezing over just seconds before is begging for disease transmission.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan
"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James
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#1720950 - 01/12/10 08:03 AM
Re: Baiting/ BSK or Bowriter or anyone
[Re: Double-D-Team]
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BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
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BSK, or Bowriter,
Why is QDM so much recommend if its doing the wrong things?
I just want to know and no I'm not trying to start something...
I'm not sure what you mean. Baiting and/or feeding is NOT recommended in QDM.
On the other hand, ANY manipulation used to "improve" conditions for a species has risks. Improvements in habitat for deer has several potential risks, with the biggest being getting what you asked for--more deer. Unfortunately, most people will be oblivious to the signs of over-population until the problem is truly severe.
And that's one of the things I stress heavily to clients--that by "building it, they will come." If you improve the habiat for deer, you will get more deer, either through attraction from surrounding properties or increased reproduction. Habitat manipulators must be highly attuned to herd conditions and be quick to notice and address excessive increases in population.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan
"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James
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#1721077 - 01/12/10 09:35 AM
Re: Baiting/ BSK or Bowriter or anyone
[Re: TC4ever]
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wskp11
6 Point
Registered: 10/24/09
Posts: 505
Loc: mid Tn
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Gator-n-Buck how do you pick a cam placement on that little of a corn pile? But seriously do any of these disease problems stem from people over doing qdm. By that I mean only taking the older bucks and no other deer from thier heard, leaving to many does and inferior bucks.
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#1721099 - 01/12/10 09:48 AM
Re: Baiting/ BSK or Bowriter or anyone
[Re: wskp11]
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Winchester
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Registered: 12/05/03
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Gator-n-Buck how do you pick a cam placement on that little of a corn pile? But seriously do any of these disease problems stem from people over doing qdm. By that I mean only taking the older bucks and no other deer from thier heard, leaving to many does and inferior bucks.
While QDM does call for letting the young bucks walk, it also calls for the killing of does to keep the herd in check.
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#1721250 - 01/12/10 11:39 AM
Re: Baiting/ BSK or Bowriter or anyone
[Re: wskp11]
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BSK
Jerkasourous of the non-typical kind
Non-Typical
Registered: 03/11/99
Posts: 59548
Loc: Nashville, TN
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But seriously do any of these disease problems stem from people over doing qdm. By that I mean only taking the older bucks and no other deer from thier heard, leaving to many does and inferior bucks.
That would not be QDM. Two of the three primary principles of QDM involve shooting more does.
_________________________
"Know where you stand, and stand there" --Jesuit Father Daniel Berrigan
"There is no reasoning someone out of a position he has not reasoned himself into." --Clive James
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#1721280 - 01/12/10 12:10 PM
Re: Baiting/ BSK or Bowriter or anyone
[Re: BSK]
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wskp11
6 Point
Registered: 10/24/09
Posts: 505
Loc: mid Tn
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I understand that but so many groups that I have talked to only allow large mature bucks and no other animals. I think that it is more previlent than we think. Land we have in NFl. is next such a club that its over run with does and inferior bucks. We have basically gone to the if its brown its down the past couple of years and still have them everywhere.
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#1721322 - 01/12/10 12:39 PM
Re: Baiting/ BSK or Bowriter or anyone
[Re: BSK]
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Double-D-Team
10 Point
Registered: 12/18/02
Posts: 3483
Loc: God's Country
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BSK, or Bowriter,
Why is QDM so much recommend if its doing the wrong things?
I just want to know and no I'm not trying to start something... I'm not sure what you mean. Baiting and/or feeding is NOT recommended in QDM. On the other hand, ANY manipulation used to "improve" conditions for a species has risks. Improvements in habitat for deer has several potential risks, with the biggest being getting what you asked for--more deer. Unfortunately, most people will be oblivious to the signs of over-population until the problem is truly severe. And that's one of the things I stress heavily to clients--that by "building it, they will come." If you improve the habiat for deer, you will get more deer, either through attraction from surrounding properties or increased reproduction. Habitat manipulators must be highly attuned to herd conditions and be quick to notice and address excessive increases in population.
BSK, I hear what your saying but read this:
Habitat Management
Whitetail Nutritional Needs
Improving the nutrition available to a deer herd is another important component of QDM. The diet of a healthy herd should contain 12-18 percent protein and adequate levels of calcium, phosphorous, and other important nutrients. Although whitetails can maintain themselves on lower quality diets, antler development, body growth, and reproductive success suffer. Fortunately, several techniques are available to increase nutrition to desirable levels. Three common practices include natural vegetation management, food plots, and supplemental feeding.
Now this is copied from the QDM homepage. But you are telling me not to grow food plots or supplemental feed? Help me to understand? 
_________________________
Don and Dee (DOUBLE-D-TEAM)
THE RICHEST VALUES OF WILDERNESS LIE NOT IN THE DAYS OF DANIEL BOONE NOR EVEN IN THE PRESENT. BUT IN THE FUTURE--LEOPOLD
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#1721335 - 01/12/10 12:51 PM
Re: Baiting/ BSK or Bowriter or anyone
[Re: TC4ever]
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JohnnyBond
Cat Man
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Registered: 01/16/08
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doe management
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