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#1323204 - 05/11/09 07:16 AM 2009 Harvest Totals
captain hook
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2009:
Total harvest: 29,990
Mature Birds: 23,841
Jakes: 5,844 or 20% of the total harvest.

2008Total Harvest: 28,954
Mature Birds: 25,130
Jakes: 3,445 or 12% of harvest.

Up this year by 1100 birds, and the increase is the direct result of a doubling of the jake harvest. Mature bird harvest dropped by 1,289 birds and jake harvest increased by 2,399 birds. So in essence harvest really did not increase, and future seasons could be impacted by the massive % of jakes killed statewide.

KY Harvest

2009
28,745 birds

2008
27,073 birds

Up this year in KY by 1,672 birds.

We only killed 1,200 more birds then KY with a much longer season, and a 4 bird limit. Hmmm, wonder why? IMO there are less birds here to kill for our hunters because of the excessively high limits. I still stand by that the 4 bird limit along with the large fall limits has taken a major toll on the population of gobblers statewide. There is nothing else to blame at this point, ever since the new fangled regs were implemented our harvest has dropped considerably, and if it weren't for a massive jake explosion last year the harvest would have been down again this year. Naturally with 20% of the harvest being juvenille birds, the years to come could be negatively impacted.
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#1323242 - 05/11/09 07:37 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
muddyboots
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Registered: 11/06/02
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I agree the 4 bird limit is too high. The hunitng in my area is pitiful too what it was before the limits were raised.
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#1323250 - 05/11/09 07:41 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: muddyboots]
Outdoor Lady
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With all the birds in Montana, they still have a one bird limit. Now, they do have a fall turkey hunt and if you turkey hunt both seasons, one bird has to come out of Region 7. I guess that region has a few more birds in it.
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#1323270 - 05/11/09 07:58 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Outdoor Lady]
captain hook
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Glad they will wait to see what impact this massive rainfall is going to have on the hatch to set next years regs. Oh wait a minute........the seasons are already set without knowing anything about how the population will be impacted.
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#1323276 - 05/11/09 08:03 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
Hillbilly Hunter
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4 is too many. It is tempting to kill 4 but you will be doing yourself a disservice. 2 is plenty.
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#1323291 - 05/11/09 08:10 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Hillbilly Hunter]
Blue5
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4 is too many!
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#1323299 - 05/11/09 08:14 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Blue5]
bigdog7mm
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Hook run those numbers from 2006-2009 and look at the four year trend.
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#1323308 - 05/11/09 08:20 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: bigdog7mm]
CopperHead77
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I agree 4 is too many!
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#1323315 - 05/11/09 08:28 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: bigdog7mm]
captain hook
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 Originally Posted By: bigdog7mm
Hook run those numbers from 2006-2009 and look at the four year trend.


2006: 35,667
2007: 29,805
2008: 28,945
2009: 29,990


The 4 bird limit went into effect I believe in 2006 along with the massive increase to fall seasons. Of course fall seasons have increased every year thereafter as well.

The result, record harvest year 1, and falling harvests of mature birds ever since. Handwriting on the wall...
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#1323335 - 05/11/09 08:50 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Outdoor Lady]
turkeyhunter
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I dont think the limit has that big of impact on the turkey population. Half the turkey population dies each year. In wayne co our numbers are way down. I think the hatch has killed us the past 3 years. If another bad hatch happens this summer,next year will be worse. We also have had an increase in critters that are more of a threat to turkeys than humans.
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#1323343 - 05/11/09 08:55 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: turkeyhunter]
RNDeLoach
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Man that is a large number of jakes. I wonder how many birds were killed and not checked in? I could imagine there are a large number of people out there that kill however many they want and never check them in.
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#1323365 - 05/11/09 09:12 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: turkeyhunter]
bigdog7mm
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 Originally Posted By: turkeyhunter
I dont think the limit has that big of impact on the turkey population. Half the turkey population dies each year.


Half of the hunt-able tom turkey population (year old +) does not die each year. By the time a tom turkey makes it to a year old their chances for survival is pretty good for the next couple years, but from the time they hatch to the first year they have a lower survival rate.

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#1323376 - 05/11/09 09:27 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: bigdog7mm]
REN
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the regs are what they are, if 4 is to many for your place THEN DONT KILL 4 off it. pretty simple to me if you dont agree with the regs.

I hunt 2 main pieces of property. The population on the bigger track has been down the past 2 years for whatever reason so guess what...I didnt kill a single bird off that one the past 2 years. the other piece of property they are like rats so I shot 3 off it the past 2 years and got the 4th on someone elses property.

point being I have killed 1 bird off a 500acre piece of property yet the population still seems to stay low....obviously the limit has nothing to do with that.

I dont agree with a 1 limit but would be fine if they lowered it to 3. I dont hunt them in fall so that doesnt matter to me. As I have said before my personal opinion is way to much blame is being put on the limit rather then natural causes.
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#1323385 - 05/11/09 09:30 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
REN
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just to add another piece of conversation....is the evolution of guns/ammo or technology need to be addressed. I mean a 60yd shot is becoming common due to the ammo being made for turkey hunting. Does anyone think that is an issue or just making hunting better?

just something a buddy and me were talking about the other day
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#1323395 - 05/11/09 09:39 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
Lawrence
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Since 06 the hunting has continued to get worse!
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#1323481 - 05/11/09 10:34 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Lawrence]
VolDoug
TnDeer Old Timer
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How many jakes did they kill in KY?
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#1323520 - 05/11/09 10:59 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: VolDoug]
megalomaniac
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Agree completely, the poor birds need a break for a few years to rebound. While the majority of the blame falls on the weather and poor hatches, the liberal harvest limits have not helped the birds rebound the effects of mother nature.

According to TWRA estimates back in 2006, this was the year we were supposed to take between 45,000- 50,000 birds!!!! So we are at a little over half of their projection. Still can't believe the turkey biologist has a job.

Now, sure, some counties are just fine, and doing better and better every year. But many counties have seen the population decimated due to overhunting. Unfortunately REN, you just can't leave it up to the general public to do the right thing and restrict harvest themselves. I'm a rare bird, in that I already do that... but the neighbors killed all thier longbeards last year, so they've just taken it out on the jakes this year. Can't see the forest through the trees \:\(

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#1323533 - 05/11/09 11:07 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: turkeyhunter]
captain hook
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 Originally Posted By: turkeyhunter
I dont think the limit has that big of impact on the turkey population. Half the turkey population dies each year. In wayne co our numbers are way down. I think the hatch has killed us the past 3 years. If another bad hatch happens this summer,next year will be worse. We also have had an increase in critters that are more of a threat to turkeys than humans.


Explain how the trend turns down immediately following a liberalization of limits both fall and spring?

If half the population dies each year, which is false BTW but let's say its true, then why raise limits and leave them high even on years following poor hatches?

Predators were around for the years of record harvests back to back to back, the only variable which changed is the limit.

Too many birds are being removed each year IMO, and this year the jake killing doubled from last year. Not good for the future.
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#1323540 - 05/11/09 11:10 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
captain hook
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 Originally Posted By: REN
just to add another piece of conversation....is the evolution of guns/ammo or technology need to be addressed. I mean a 60yd shot is becoming common due to the ammo being made for turkey hunting. Does anyone think that is an issue or just making hunting better?

just something a buddy and me were talking about the other day


Absolutely, if B-mobile and crew wasn't invented and most folks using it with success I bet the harvest would be down another 30% then what it is now. Fact is that with strutting decoys turkeys are dieing that would have usually survived, and hunters who do not have the skill or know how to kill turkeys are killing more and more birds.

Ammo, is ammo, I shoot plain old lead and have for almost 20 years of turkey killing. I can shoot and kill to 60 yards if I chose, but I play the game to have it up close and personal. Turkey hunting is not about sniping them from long distances, but that is somewhat of a personal preference.
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#1323544 - 05/11/09 11:12 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: megalomaniac]
captain hook
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 Originally Posted By: megalomaniac
Agree completely, the poor birds need a break for a few years to rebound. While the majority of the blame falls on the weather and poor hatches, the liberal harvest limits have not helped the birds rebound the effects of mother nature.

According to TWRA estimates back in 2006, this was the year we were supposed to take between 45,000- 50,000 birds!!!! So we are at a little over half of their projection. Still can't believe the turkey biologist has a job.

Now, sure, some counties are just fine, and doing better and better every year. But many counties have seen the population decimated due to overhunting. Unfortunately REN, you just can't leave it up to the general public to do the right thing and restrict harvest themselves. I'm a rare bird, in that I already do that... but the neighbors killed all thier longbeards last year, so they've just taken it out on the jakes this year. Can't see the forest through the trees \:\(


I agree, and the biologist of the past was gone last year, I think, and we got a new one. Guess what? Same old same old, set regs before harvest totals or hatch info, and nothing changed with the limits.

There will always be pockets that are doing well, but if you look at statewide totals it tells the story. Too bad the people who get paid to do this can't understand what is going on.
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#1323562 - 05/11/09 11:28 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
Lawrence
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Registered: 10/03/07
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Good point Hook!
You cant continue to set seasons before the harvest totals and hatch info has been processed.
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#1323569 - 05/11/09 11:42 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: turkeyhunter]
DaltonsDad
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4 is 2 many and that doesnt even count the number of poached birds that dont get checked in. 2 is a good number besides thiers bonus birds to be had.
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#1323592 - 05/11/09 12:07 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: DaltonsDad]
Donk
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I personally dont believe the 4 bird limit has a impact on the overall harvest,alot of you guys wont agree with this.But I'm thinking the birds are getting more pressure on them and in turn getting wiser.Little to no gobbling,differnt times of the day.Get out of your ole tactics and you'll see.I had a friend who was complaing about how his places was'nt doing the same as a few years back,I made a few suggestions.He could'nt believe it.I know that they are just a bird,if they could smell like a deer it would real tough.They can and do learn somewhat.Funny how some county's produce yr after yr.They have already adapted to the wiser birds that already have had pressure on them for several yrs.Think about it and you'll see what I'm talking about.
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#1323597 - 05/11/09 12:10 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
spitndrum
Team TLBB Woodpile Boys
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I never limit so I dont have any say in it???
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#1323602 - 05/11/09 12:13 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Donk]
captain hook
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Registered: 11/20/07
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Loc: Knoxville

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Not possible, sure they learn as the season goes on, but gobbling is a natural part of their breeding process and without it they cannot attract hens. They will still gobble, they may just not come to a certain spot, or respond well to a certain type or style of calls.

Killing birds is different from birds not being there, period.

If your theory held true then folks I grew up with back home that hunt original flocks in AL and Miss, would have had to adjust their tactics and they do things the same way they have since time began. Those flocks have been getting hunted much much longer then our birds have here, since we had no turkeys until the last 25 years.

Also, the natural attirition in turkeys does not allow them to be educated like other animals, many only live to be 1 or 2 years old at most.
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#1323604 - 05/11/09 12:15 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: spitndrum]
Happy Birthday Winchester
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4 birds is a liberal bag here in TN compared to other states. I normally kill my 4 but I hunt mainly in East TN and our populations have never been better. Turkey #'s have increased dramaticaly here over the last 10 years. I agree more changes need to be made depending on hatch info from year to year however.
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#1323614 - 05/11/09 12:28 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Winchester]
CopperHead77
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Registered: 08/20/07
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Setting personal limits less than 4 is ok and it helps, but if your hunting public land or small tracts here and there it really doesn't matter much if your neighbors aren't doing the same..I know ,I know, age old arguement.
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#1323620 - 05/11/09 12:37 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
Hillbilly Hunter
Killbilly
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 Originally Posted By: REN
the regs are what they are, if 4 is to many for your place THEN DONT KILL 4 off it. pretty simple to me if you dont agree with the regs.

I hunt 2 main pieces of property. The population on the bigger track has been down the past 2 years for whatever reason so guess what...I didnt kill a single bird off that one the past 2 years. the other piece of property they are like rats so I shot 3 off it the past 2 years and got the 4th on someone elses property.

point being I have killed 1 bird off a 500acre piece of property yet the population still seems to stay low....obviously the limit has nothing to do with that.

I dont agree with a 1 limit but would be fine if they lowered it to 3. I dont hunt them in fall so that doesnt matter to me. As I have said before my personal opinion is way to much blame is being put on the limit rather then natural causes.




What has been killed off the surrounding farms, that is the unknown. You may have hunters next door hammering them that you don't know about.
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#1323622 - 05/11/09 12:38 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Donk]
8 POINTS OR BETTER
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I think its a combination of the limits and bad hatches. The question should be, should we have the high limits when we are having these bad hatches.

Perry CO. total spring harvest has fallen around 60% since 2006. 357 to 144

Wayne CO. total spring harvest has fallen around 66% since 2006.
990 to 444

Hardin CO. total spring harvest has fallen around 41% since 2006.
772 to 456

The question I ask is do we need to keep the high limits since the harvest has fell so much and we have had the bad hatches?
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#1323645 - 05/11/09 01:15 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: 8 POINTS OR BETTER]
Donk
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Just like always the so called experts cut your comments down.What I have stated is from my limited hunting experience.So I will keep my comments to myself and close friends,which by the way have NO promblems killing their birds now and we are'nt talking jakes either.All animals will learn to a degree,just that you have to a little smarter they are!
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#1323651 - 05/11/09 01:19 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Hillbilly Hunter]
REN
Good ol' Boys "Team Grizzly"
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Registered: 10/24/07
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 Originally Posted By: Hillbilly Hunter
 Originally Posted By: REN
the regs are what they are, if 4 is to many for your place THEN DONT KILL 4 off it. pretty simple to me if you dont agree with the regs.

I hunt 2 main pieces of property. The population on the bigger track has been down the past 2 years for whatever reason so guess what...I didnt kill a single bird off that one the past 2 years. the other piece of property they are like rats so I shot 3 off it the past 2 years and got the 4th on someone elses property.

point being I have killed 1 bird off a 500acre piece of property yet the population still seems to stay low....obviously the limit has nothing to do with that.

I dont agree with a 1 limit but would be fine if they lowered it to 3. I dont hunt them in fall so that doesnt matter to me. As I have said before my personal opinion is way to much blame is being put on the limit rather then natural causes.




What has been killed off the surrounding farms, that is the unknown. You may have hunters next door hammering them that you don't know about.



actually i DO know. One side is all river with 50ft cliff. The other 2 sides are HUGE cow farms that the owner does not allow hunting on, no birds can roost over there so not much of a point of it.

sure the birds will come and go and they will fly the river but OVERALL other factors rather then the limit come in to play on this piece of property
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#1323652 - 05/11/09 01:22 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: DaltonsDad]
REN
Good ol' Boys "Team Grizzly"
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Registered: 10/24/07
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 Originally Posted By: DaltonsDad
4 is 2 many and that doesnt even count the number of poached birds that dont get checked in. 2 is a good number besides thiers bonus birds to be had.


do you think the POACHING will stop with a 1 bird limit? i mean a man is going to poach regardless of the limit.

I just cant stress enough that to ME (me being the key word here) that sportsman have to take responsibility at some point for their actions. If your property cant take it then dont shoot them.

I do understand the Neighbor affect but i still think common causes are more at root here then set bag limits.
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#1323654 - 05/11/09 01:25 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
megalomaniac
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Wow, so far in this thread there are many more for reducing the limit than keeping it the same. I know it's early, but that's a BIG change from a similar thread last year.
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#1323659 - 05/11/09 01:28 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: megalomaniac]
REN
Good ol' Boys "Team Grizzly"
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Registered: 10/24/07
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just to be clear on my part, i dont really care what the limit is....if it was 1 then so be it, i will still be out in the woods giving them hell lol...My wife would LOVE for it to be 1 so i can be done hunting opening weekend hahahaha

I just think the LIMIT is getting more of the reasoning then it actually deserves.
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#1323695 - 05/11/09 01:59 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
Hillbilly Hunter
Killbilly
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I don't think the limit is the cause of the decline, but it is hurting the population now that we had 3 or 4 poor hatchings in a row. Rocket nets have hurt my population followed by three years of poor hatchings. I saw alot of jakes this year, so mayber we are on the rebound. The liberal limit will slow this down, that is my concern.
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#1323745 - 05/11/09 03:12 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Hillbilly Hunter]
Lawrence
8 Point


Registered: 10/03/07
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Ok my question is about bag limits and season length's in Tennessee. Why is it when it comes to DEER and TURKEYS that Tennessee has these liberal bag limits. Is it a south thing? There are midwest states like MO, that have more birds and alot more deer but have more conservative bag limits and shorter seasons. I was born and raised in Franklin Co Mo. which is the #1 county for both spring and fall turkey harvest in the state year after year. Mo has a three week season with a 2 bird limit and they kill more birds in that three week season than Tn does in 6 weeks. Can someone help to explain this
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#1323783 - 05/11/09 03:59 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Lawrence]
8 POINTS OR BETTER
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Registered: 08/15/07
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Loc: Hardin, Co.

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 Originally Posted By: Lawrence
Ok my question is about bag limits and season length's in Tennessee. Why is it when it comes to DEER and TURKEYS that Tennessee has these liberal bag limits. Is it a south thing? There are midwest states like MO, that have more birds and alot more deer but have more conservative bag limits and shorter seasons. I was born and raised in Franklin Co Mo. which is the #1 county for both spring and fall turkey harvest in the state year after year. Mo has a three week season with a 2 bird limit and they kill more birds in that three week season than Tn does in 6 weeks. Can someone help to explain this



Remember when MO went to a 3 bird limit in the early 90's. It did not work for them, and their flock was way ahead of ours. Now their back to a two bird limit.
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#1323812 - 05/11/09 04:23 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: 8 POINTS OR BETTER]
Food Plot 101
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4 bird, 3 bird, 2 bird, it doesn't matter to me. I hunt enough different properties where taking a bird(neighbor factor excluded) isn't going to put a dent in the flock. I've got birds on one of my leases that has NEVER in my lifetime had birds. I sure have seen a ton more birds this year than in years past. That doesn't make them easier to kill. IMO, with a lot of hens ole tom doesn't have to gobble much when the hens are numerous. I've found this out first hand this year especially. One of my slam dunk areas for birds, and I mean slam dunk areas, was horrible this year. Am I whining? No. Are the birds declining in that area? They don't seem to be, judging from my deer season sightings. I think they just found another area to hang, simple. What I'm getting at is in some areas the birds are thick, some areas thin. I think terrain and available food sources are the reasons. JMO
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#1323862 - 05/11/09 05:03 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
MRUTVOL
6 Point


Registered: 12/16/02
Posts: 879
Loc: Goodlettsville,Tennessee,USA

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 Originally Posted By: REN

I just think the LIMIT is getting more of the reasoning then it actually deserves.



I am inclined to agree with you but I also can see where in certain areas of the state where it can be a factor in the decline. I personally think it is more a combination of various factors that can cause some flocks to flourish and others to struggle from one area to another, than just one specific aspect. With weather conditions,predators,natural die offs and hunting pressures it is kind of like the "perfect storm" concept that when all these elements come into place at once then you are going to have some extremes to the negative side which is why I would be in favor of the seasons being set after all aspects can be reviewed to a degree and adjustments being made.
As for my own personal turkey hunting environment I did see more jakes than I have seen in years and more mature bids as well on one farm I hunt but on another farm just 5 miles down the road I noticed a huge difference in numbers of birds the last 3 to 4 years. Now why the difference ? It was a man made cause and it has nothing to do with the limits IMO. The farm that had such low numbers of birds,which is almost 400 acres, lays in the elk river basin and is 75% agriculture land. Unfortunately instead of it being used for crops it along with adjoining farms of even more acreage are used for growing hay in the spring. Unfortunately most of the hens are drawn to these fields to nest and guess what is fixing to happen? The farmer told me that as soon as the weather settles enough to dry up a little they will begin cutting hay in a couple weeks. This process was began on a more widespread basis on this farm about 4 years ago and I feel is the direct cause of the fall in numbers there more than any other aspect. I have jumped numerous sitting hens the last couple weeks while crossing these fields and according to the farmer he sees multiple nest destroyed while cutting and bailing hay. The other farm is a more hilly and secluded area with pastured hillsides that are not used for hay cutting so that particular cause and effect is not present on that farm.Of course this would not apply to all property but in this case I feel it is the main cause. Of course the farmer could care less about the turkeys cause his interest is in his cattle.

I have no problem with the limit being 2 or 4 ,either works for me. I killed 3 and could have had 4 but was hoping to kill a certain unique bird that I just did not get a chance at. I do find it somewhat hypocritical of some who do complain loudy about the limit being to high but either kill their 4 birds or try and hunt up until the last day to get their 4 birds anyway. Its kind of like that "Do as I say but not as I do" thinking.

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#1323874 - 05/11/09 05:16 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
renegade50
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exactly
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#1323881 - 05/11/09 05:26 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Donk]
captain hook
10 Point


Registered: 11/20/07
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Loc: Knoxville

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 Originally Posted By: Donk
Just like always the so called experts cut your comments down.What I have stated is from my limited hunting experience.So I will keep my comments to myself and close friends,which by the way have NO promblems killing their birds now and we are'nt talking jakes either.All animals will learn to a degree,just that you have to a little smarter they are!


Trust me when I say I have no issue killing turkeys and many of the folks who responded against the high limits or with concerns seem to do a pretty good job of killing birds as well.

Your broad sweeping analysis of turkey behavior is just not accurate, however if you have success then continue doing what puts birds in the grave.
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#1323883 - 05/11/09 05:28 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: renegade50]
VolDoug
TnDeer Old Timer
10 Point


Registered: 11/05/99
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From TnTurkey, the Tn Turkey Coordinator started posting today, and I asked him about any talk of possibly reducing the limit:

"And VolDoug - we are a mixed bag of opinions right now on turkey bag limits - some want to go to 2 birds a day, 4 a season and others are interested in pulling back a touch. I think we will see the need to zone the state in coming seasons to better direct our harvest at areas that can sustain the liberal seasons and provide some measure of conservatism on counties that maybe have not yet reached their peak potential. But this is just my opinion and I have no data yet on how or when a zoning effort would be put in place.

We are working hard to learn as much as we can about our flock right now. This summer we will initiate statewide aerial transects to get a measure of the turkey flock - never done before. Additionally, we are improving our brood data collection process to hopefully gain better information about production. My hope is to link production, summer standing flock, and harvest so we can better understand how we as hunters may (or may not) impact the turkey population in various regions across the state. It is a very ambitious undertaking and final results will not be ready until 2-3 years from now. My point is: we are watching the harvest fluctuate like everyone else and there are concerns but we want to make informed decisons. On a statewide level I am still comfortable but I know there are pockets in TN that may be suffering. If something needs to be done to protect a county, then we will not wait 2-3 years until the final data is complete. We are very intereted in the turkey harvest trends and we will not hesitate to pull back if the population cannot sustain the harvest. But, at this moment in time, the Agency is comfortable where we are with our harvest regulations. "

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#1323884 - 05/11/09 05:30 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Lawrence]
captain hook
10 Point


Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 4340
Loc: Knoxville

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 Originally Posted By: Lawrence
Ok my question is about bag limits and season length's in Tennessee. Why is it when it comes to DEER and TURKEYS that Tennessee has these liberal bag limits. Is it a south thing? There are midwest states like MO, that have more birds and alot more deer but have more conservative bag limits and shorter seasons. I was born and raised in Franklin Co Mo. which is the #1 county for both spring and fall turkey harvest in the state year after year. Mo has a three week season with a 2 bird limit and they kill more birds in that three week season than Tn does in 6 weeks. Can someone help to explain this


MO has more deer/turkeys because they do not have liberal limits.

We have almost the highest turkey limit in the SE.

And from our harvest totals we are stretching things.

A few days ago, there was some stuff posted about how KY has fewer hunters etc etc in the deer forum, and that is why their deer hunting was much better. So explain how fewer hunters etc etc are killing almost as many birds as we do in TN, and the fact their season is half as long as ours is?
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#1323893 - 05/11/09 05:51 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: VolDoug]
MRUTVOL
6 Point


Registered: 12/16/02
Posts: 879
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 Originally Posted By: VolDoug
From TnTurkey, the Tn Turkey Coordinator started posting today, and I asked him about any talk of possibly reducing the limit:

"And VolDoug - we are a mixed bag of opinions right now on turkey bag limits - some want to go to 2 birds a day, 4 a season and others are interested in pulling back a touch. I think we will see the need to zone the state in coming seasons to better direct our harvest at areas that can sustain the liberal seasons and provide some measure of conservatism on counties that maybe have not yet reached their peak potential. But this is just my opinion and I have no data yet on how or when a zoning effort would be put in place.

We are working hard to learn as much as we can about our flock right now. This summer we will initiate statewide aerial transects to get a measure of the turkey flock - never done before. Additionally, we are improving our brood data collection process to hopefully gain better information about production. My hope is to link production, summer standing flock, and harvest so we can better understand how we as hunters may (or may not) impact the turkey population in various regions across the state. It is a very ambitious undertaking and final results will not be ready until 2-3 years from now. My point is: we are watching the harvest fluctuate like everyone else and there are concerns but we want to make informed decisons. On a statewide level I am still comfortable but I know there are pockets in TN that may be suffering. If something needs to be done to protect a county, then we will not wait 2-3 years until the final data is complete. We are very intereted in the turkey harvest trends and we will not hesitate to pull back if the population cannot sustain the harvest. But, at this moment in time, the Agency is comfortable where we are with our harvest regulations. "



Well this does seem to be a step in the right direction and time will only tell.At least they seem to realize there are some dynamics happening in some areas that may need to be addressed.

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#1323926 - 05/11/09 06:13 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: MRUTVOL]
captain hook
10 Point


Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 4340
Loc: Knoxville

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 Originally Posted By: MRUTVOL
 Originally Posted By: VolDoug
From TnTurkey, the Tn Turkey Coordinator started posting today, and I asked him about any talk of possibly reducing the limit:

"And VolDoug - we are a mixed bag of opinions right now on turkey bag limits - some want to go to 2 birds a day, 4 a season and others are interested in pulling back a touch. I think we will see the need to zone the state in coming seasons to better direct our harvest at areas that can sustain the liberal seasons and provide some measure of conservatism on counties that maybe have not yet reached their peak potential. But this is just my opinion and I have no data yet on how or when a zoning effort would be put in place.

We are working hard to learn as much as we can about our flock right now. This summer we will initiate statewide aerial transects to get a measure of the turkey flock - never done before. Additionally, we are improving our brood data collection process to hopefully gain better information about production. My hope is to link production, summer standing flock, and harvest so we can better understand how we as hunters may (or may not) impact the turkey population in various regions across the state. It is a very ambitious undertaking and final results will not be ready until 2-3 years from now. My point is: we are watching the harvest fluctuate like everyone else and there are concerns but we want to make informed decisons. On a statewide level I am still comfortable but I know there are pockets in TN that may be suffering. If something needs to be done to protect a county, then we will not wait 2-3 years until the final data is complete. We are very intereted in the turkey harvest trends and we will not hesitate to pull back if the population cannot sustain the harvest. But, at this moment in time, the Agency is comfortable where we are with our harvest regulations. "



Well this does seem to be a step in the right direction and time will only tell.At least they seem to realize there are some dynamics happening in some areas that may need to be addressed.


I agree, and as long as they are aware that something is going on, and are willing to take time to learn more, and invest time,money, etc in figuring out what is best then I can be happy.

All I ask is they do their best in trying to do what is best for our turkey population statewide.

That was a very courteous and informative response, it lacks much of the sting that is delivered when deer stuff is questioned.
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#1323970 - 05/11/09 07:04 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: VolDoug]
megalomaniac
12 Point


Registered: 10/28/05
Posts: 5027
Loc: Mississippi

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 Originally Posted By: VolDoug
From TnTurkey, the Tn Turkey Coordinator started posting today, and I asked him about any talk of possibly reducing the limit:

"And VolDoug - we are a mixed bag of opinions right now on turkey bag limits - some want to go to 2 birds a day, 4 a season and others are interested in pulling back a touch. I think we will see the need to zone the state in coming seasons to better direct our harvest at areas that can sustain the liberal seasons and provide some measure of conservatism on counties that maybe have not yet reached their peak potential. But this is just my opinion and I have no data yet on how or when a zoning effort would be put in place.

We are working hard to learn as much as we can about our flock right now. This summer we will initiate statewide aerial transects to get a measure of the turkey flock - never done before. Additionally, we are improving our brood data collection process to hopefully gain better information about production. My hope is to link production, summer standing flock, and harvest so we can better understand how we as hunters may (or may not) impact the turkey population in various regions across the state. It is a very ambitious undertaking and final results will not be ready until 2-3 years from now. My point is: we are watching the harvest fluctuate like everyone else and there are concerns but we want to make informed decisons. On a statewide level I am still comfortable but I know there are pockets in TN that may be suffering. If something needs to be done to protect a county, then we will not wait 2-3 years until the final data is complete. We are very intereted in the turkey harvest trends and we will not hesitate to pull back if the population cannot sustain the harvest. But, at this moment in time, the Agency is comfortable where we are with our harvest regulations. "


I disagree completely...

Sure, a year or two of declines in a county should cause the biologists to 'raise eyebrows', and consider a limit reduction.

But what about the counties with 5-6 YEARS of steady declines??? Um, hello... Houston, we have a problem. And that problem should have been addressed years ago. I mean, how many years of steady declines in harvests does it take for a change to happen?

And another thing to consider... harvest totals are an INDIRECT indicator of total population. Because there were significantly fewer hunters back in the days of the 2 bird limit, the number of birds left after spring hunting season was excellent. Right now, in many parts of the state, every single longbeard is removed during the spring season. Which makes me nervous about the drastic increase in jake harvest. Is it due to a good hatch last year (brood surveys indicate last year was another poor hatch statewide), or because there are so few longbeards to pursue that pressure is now put on the jakes. In any case, 20% statewide jake harvest is not healthy, and the turkey biologists are probably more alarmed by the steady increase in jake harvest than the steady decline in gobbler harvest.

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#1324005 - 05/11/09 07:38 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: megalomaniac]
jbranham63
4 Point


Registered: 04/10/08
Posts: 221
Loc: Johnson City, Tennessee

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I think that a 2 or 3 bird limit would help some but people are still going to shoot jakes no matter the limit. I only killed one bird this year and Im sure many people only killed one or two. I also passed on several jakes this year.
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#1324010 - 05/11/09 07:41 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: megalomaniac]
deerlawyer
4 Point


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 478
Loc: tn

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in my county, plenty of birds. i guarantee the harvest way, way up. here's the key- down to only one check station, and it is up to twenty miles from some hunting areas. they're not getting checked in. don't know if such a pain in the a$$ in other counties???

in my opinion, four bird limit, telecheck, outlaw decoys.

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#1324035 - 05/11/09 08:02 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: deerlawyer]
smstone22
16 Point


Registered: 01/11/04
Posts: 16759
Loc: Allardt, TN

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The data tells the tale. Seed corn got slaughtered. Im not even looking forward to hunting around home next Spring.
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#1324101 - 05/11/09 08:42 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: turkeyhunter]
solodren
8 Point


Registered: 09/20/07
Posts: 1179
Loc: nashville tn 37214

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I counted 15 jakes on a farm in Nashville,, be good next year ,,, smith county I passed up a bunch should be better next year,,, if your hungry take a jake,, keep it in proportion,,, dont fret it should work out..
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#1324110 - 05/11/09 08:46 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Donk]
solodren
8 Point


Registered: 09/20/07
Posts: 1179
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wonder if they will break bag limits up,, in different counties as they do for derrr./
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#1324126 - 05/11/09 08:52 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
bsl
10 Point


Registered: 12/23/07
Posts: 3506
Loc: knox,tn.

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 Originally Posted By: captain hook
2009:
Total harvest: 29,990
Mature Birds: 23,841
Jakes: 5,844 or 20% of the total harvest.

2008Total Harvest: 28,954
Mature Birds: 25,130
Jakes: 3,445 or 12% of harvest.

Up this year by 1100 birds, and the increase is the direct result of a doubling of the jake harvest. Mature bird harvest dropped by 1,289 birds and jake harvest increased by 2,399 birds. So in essence harvest really did not increase, and future seasons could be impacted by the massive % of jakes killed statewide.

KY Harvest

2009
28,745 birds

2008
27,073 birds

Up this year in KY by 1,672 birds.

We only killed 1,200 more birds then KY with a much longer season, and a 4 bird limit. Hmmm, wonder why? IMO there are less birds here to kill for our hunters because of the excessively high limits. I still stand by that the 4 bird limit along with the large fall limits has taken a major toll on the population of gobblers statewide. There is nothing else to blame at this point, ever since the new fangled regs were implemented our harvest has dropped considerably, and if it weren't for a massive jake explosion last year the harvest would have been down again this year. Naturally with 20% of the harvest being juvenille birds, the years to come could be negatively impacted.





It's amazing how you spin things.I told you before season that the harvest would go up this year because of the good hatch last year.Now you say because there were a lot of jakes killed that it really didn't go up.Last time I checked jakes were turkey too.if we have another good hatch this year we will have plenty of jakes around next year just like this year.We are going to have a lot of 2 year old gobblers killed next year.We don't need lower limits we just need several more years of good hatches to bring the pop. back up.

It is hard for me to listen to you talk about how our population is lower because of the 4 bird limit.Then you brag about killing 4 turkey every year.Seems if you were really aganist the limit then you would only shot 2 turkey and try to lead by example.

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#1324145 - 05/11/09 09:03 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: deerlawyer]
captain hook
10 Point


Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 4340
Loc: Knoxville

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 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.
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#1324152 - 05/11/09 09:07 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: bsl]
captain hook
10 Point


Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 4340
Loc: Knoxville

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 Originally Posted By: bsl
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
2009:
Total harvest: 29,990
Mature Birds: 23,841
Jakes: 5,844 or 20% of the total harvest.

2008Total Harvest: 28,954
Mature Birds: 25,130
Jakes: 3,445 or 12% of harvest.

Up this year by 1100 birds, and the increase is the direct result of a doubling of the jake harvest. Mature bird harvest dropped by 1,289 birds and jake harvest increased by 2,399 birds. So in essence harvest really did not increase, and future seasons could be impacted by the massive % of jakes killed statewide.

KY Harvest

2009
28,745 birds

2008
27,073 birds

Up this year in KY by 1,672 birds.

We only killed 1,200 more birds then KY with a much longer season, and a 4 bird limit. Hmmm, wonder why? IMO there are less birds here to kill for our hunters because of the excessively high limits. I still stand by that the 4 bird limit along with the large fall limits has taken a major toll on the population of gobblers statewide. There is nothing else to blame at this point, ever since the new fangled regs were implemented our harvest has dropped considerably, and if it weren't for a massive jake explosion last year the harvest would have been down again this year. Naturally with 20% of the harvest being juvenille birds, the years to come could be negatively impacted.





It's amazing how you spin things.I told you before season that the harvest would go up this year because of the good hatch last year.Now you say because there were a lot of jakes killed that it really didn't go up.Last time I checked jakes were turkey too.if we have another good hatch this year we will have plenty of jakes around next year just like this year.We are going to have a lot of 2 year old gobblers killed next year.We don't need lower limits we just need several more years of good hatches to bring the pop. back up.

It is hard for me to listen to you talk about how our population is lower because of the 4 bird limit.Then you brag about killing 4 turkey every year.Seems if you were really aganist the limit then you would only shot 2 turkey and try to lead by example.


You should have just read where our turkey biologist stated we had a poor hatch last year. So you are wrong about a good hatch, that along with the unknown of how the massive rains this spring will effect hatches leaves a lot to wonder about the future.

What you do not understand about me taking 4 birds is that 3 came from West TN, and 1 from here. Last year I killed 4 birds in 4 counties Scott, Campbell, Claiborn, and Roane. None were closer then 60 miles to the other, so there is no impact from me on any given area or flock of birds.

The state should be sharp enough to know how many turkeys each hunter COULD take and not damage the flock. If 4 is too many then the limit should not be set that high.
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#1324198 - 05/11/09 09:47 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
bsl
10 Point


Registered: 12/23/07
Posts: 3506
Loc: knox,tn.

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Captain I do rember that you killed turkey in different places last year and 3 in one spot this year.that is not the point.Just seems odd that you keep pushing for lower limits yet keep blasting away.After you fill you tags you talk about taking other people out to fill thier tags.


also if I am wrong about the hatch last year why were there so many jakes killed and passed up this year?Why have you also talked about the good hatch from last year in so many posts?

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#1324280 - 05/11/09 11:09 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: bsl]
Dodgeball
Woodpile Boys
6 Point


Registered: 01/29/09
Posts: 878
Loc: Chapel Hill, TN

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Nothing wrong with a 4 burd limit. killem all and sort it out later.
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#1324283 - 05/11/09 11:12 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Dodgeball]
smstone22
16 Point


Registered: 01/11/04
Posts: 16759
Loc: Allardt, TN

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Ive said for a few years that units are the answer for turkey management in TN. Glad they are starting to realize that but still want to wait 2-3 years to implement what is obviously needed? I dont know why the wait.
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#1324284 - 05/11/09 11:12 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Dodgeball]
smstone22
16 Point


Registered: 01/11/04
Posts: 16759
Loc: Allardt, TN

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 Originally Posted By: Dodgeball
Nothing wrong with a 4 burd limit. killem all and sort it out later.
What a great wildlife management concept. Dear Lord.
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#1324290 - 05/11/09 11:16 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: smstone22]
Dodgeball
Woodpile Boys
6 Point


Registered: 01/29/09
Posts: 878
Loc: Chapel Hill, TN

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Need a 10 hen limit to
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#1324295 - 05/11/09 11:19 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
deerlawyer
4 Point


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 478
Loc: tn

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 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.


yep. nix any fall hunting too.

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#1324332 - 05/12/09 05:29 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: bsl]
captain hook
10 Point


Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 4340
Loc: Knoxville

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 Originally Posted By: bsl
Captain I do rember that you killed turkey in different places last year and 3 in one spot this year.that is not the point.Just seems odd that you keep pushing for lower limits yet keep blasting away.After you fill you tags you talk about taking other people out to fill thier tags.


also if I am wrong about the hatch last year why were there so many jakes killed and passed up this year?Why have you also talked about the good hatch from last year in so many posts?


If anything I should be completely against dropping back as my seasons will last a matter of days versus weeks.

It is not my job nor responsibility to self regulate because the state can't regulate to ensure good flock numbers. If 4 is too many then the limit shouldn't be set so high.
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#1324427 - 05/12/09 07:33 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
TurkeyBurd Moderator
Woodpile Boys
10 Point


Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 3021
Loc: Chapel Hill

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Good info, but opinions of the limits will always be different. Glad I don't have to make that call.
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#1324448 - 05/12/09 07:47 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: TurkeyBurd]
turkeyhunter
6 Point


Registered: 08/23/04
Posts: 893
Loc: collinwood tn

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I have said on this thread and others that our numbers are way down in wayne co. from years past. But I dont think the limit has a big impact on turkeys. If season is open, im going hunting. If I tag out , im going to carry someone else hunting, and fill their tags. I will play by the rules twra sets and thats good enough for me. If we run out of turkeys I will hunt another county or state, or go fishing.lol
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#1324486 - 05/12/09 08:15 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: smstone22]
CopperHead77
12 Point


Registered: 08/20/07
Posts: 6749
Loc: Hickman Co.

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 Originally Posted By: steven stone
 Originally Posted By: Dodgeball
Nothing wrong with a 4 burd limit. killem all and sort it out later.
What a great wildlife management concept. Dear Lord.


Unfortunately,that's the mindset of some ....slaughter, slaughter
slaughter and then the next yr say "they just don't gobble like they used to"
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#1324487 - 05/12/09 08:16 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
4onaside
12 Point


Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 5070
Loc: Jackson,Tn

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 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.
You guys are kidding, right? I don't happen to own a "full strut" decoy, and turkeys do decoy rather easily. Maybe not easily, but certainly improves your odds when the turkey that you are calling actually sees "the turkey" thats making the noise. But, duh, who is going to be the enforcers? I can see it now, a vehicle drives up to my locked gate, and several black clad people pile out and run down my road and into the middle of my set yelling "turkey police!, turkey police!" lol The days of decoys are here, and rescinding their use would not be practical, or even possible for that matter. And my season was great, because the population(at least this year)in my immediate area is great. So from my perspective, problems, what problems? But, if you think that "full strut" dekes are that good, I guarantee that one will be a part of my deal next season. That is, unless they are outlawed. lol
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#1324586 - 05/12/09 09:43 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: smstone22]
REN
Good ol' Boys "Team Grizzly"
12 Point


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 5039
Loc: Wilson County, TN

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 Originally Posted By: steven stone
Ive said for a few years that units are the answer for turkey management in TN. Glad they are starting to realize that but still want to wait 2-3 years to implement what is obviously needed? I dont know why the wait.



I actually agree with this and have wondered why it was not already in place with a state with such a broad topography from east to west.
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#1324600 - 05/12/09 09:55 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
stik
TnDeer Old Timer
18 Point


Registered: 03/12/99
Posts: 20331
Loc: lenoir city,tn

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i know this is the turkey forum and this post will not be liked here but i wish it was year 'round season- no limit. acorn-eating feathered rats. i wish turkeys could be eradicated from my hunting areas.
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#1324724 - 05/12/09 12:14 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: stik]
deerlawyer
4 Point


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 478
Loc: tn

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the biggest effect the four bird limit most likely is having is not that of killing too many birds, but of extending many hunter's seasons and keeping lots of pressure on the birds, and consequently shutting them up. i know the gobbling has fallen way off around here.

another thing i haven't read here is that there has been a real shortage of nice, calm, sunny days that make every swinging beard gobble his head off. those are the days you find out your gobbler population. not sure i have had the opportunity to hunt a day like that this year.

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#1324727 - 05/12/09 12:17 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: 4onaside]
REN
Good ol' Boys "Team Grizzly"
12 Point


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 5039
Loc: Wilson County, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.
You guys are kidding, right? I don't happen to own a "full strut" decoy, and turkeys do decoy rather easily. Maybe not easily, but certainly improves your odds when the turkey that you are calling actually sees "the turkey" thats making the noise. But, duh, who is going to be the enforcers? I can see it now, a vehicle drives up to my locked gate, and several black clad people pile out and run down my road and into the middle of my set yelling "turkey police!, turkey police!" lol The days of decoys are here, and rescinding their use would not be practical, or even possible for that matter. And my season was great, because the population(at least this year)in my immediate area is great. So from my perspective, problems, what problems? But, if you think that "full strut" dekes are that good, I guarantee that one will be a part of my deal next season. That is, unless they are outlawed. lol



you do know many states still dont allow decoys and it is enforced. I Hunted in Bama my whole life and they were illegal down there and I was checked a number of times while out in the field.
_________________________
VooDoo Mafia

John 3:16



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#1324733 - 05/12/09 12:20 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
REN
Good ol' Boys "Team Grizzly"
12 Point


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 5039
Loc: Wilson County, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: bsl
Captain I do rember that you killed turkey in different places last year and 3 in one spot this year.that is not the point.Just seems odd that you keep pushing for lower limits yet keep blasting away.After you fill you tags you talk about taking other people out to fill thier tags.


also if I am wrong about the hatch last year why were there so many jakes killed and passed up this year?Why have you also talked about the good hatch from last year in so many posts?




It is not my job nor responsibility to self regulate because the state can't regulate to ensure good flock numbers. If 4 is too many then the limit shouldn't be set so high.



and that is a big problem TO ME....just because it is legal doesnt make it the right thing to do in certain situations AND I am not a fan of someone using the regulations to their benefit then complaining about what the regs are. I have said this a thousand times AT SOME POINT SPORTSMAN NEED TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY and stop blaming everything they see of other factors when part of the factor is their own actions. Same as deer, you shoot everything you see dont bitch about not seeing alot of nice deer, you kill to many birds off a piece of property then dont bitch about the limits....goes on and on.

(not a direct bash on you hook just making a point)
_________________________
VooDoo Mafia

John 3:16



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#1324738 - 05/12/09 12:24 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
VolDoug
TnDeer Old Timer
10 Point


Registered: 11/05/99
Posts: 3458
Loc: Plateau

Offline
 Originally Posted By: REN

you do know many states still dont allow decoys and it is enforced. I Hunted in Bama my whole life and they were


"Were" is an important word in that sentence. What other states outlaw decoys?

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#1324777 - 05/12/09 12:47 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: VolDoug]
REN
Good ol' Boys "Team Grizzly"
12 Point


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 5039
Loc: Wilson County, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: VolDoug
 Originally Posted By: REN

you do know many states still dont allow decoys and it is enforced. I Hunted in Bama my whole life and they were


"Were" is an important word in that sentence. What other states outlaw decoys?



from a quick search looks like IN and a few midwest states but I didnt look very hard.

does it really matter which ones? i mean it is illegal to hunt with an electronic turkey call here but hard to enforce yet people dont really try to get away with it. There is alot about hunting that is hard to enforce and again it is on the hunter to follow the law.
_________________________
VooDoo Mafia

John 3:16



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#1324822 - 05/12/09 01:19 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
VolDoug
TnDeer Old Timer
10 Point


Registered: 11/05/99
Posts: 3458
Loc: Plateau

Offline
 Originally Posted By: REN

does it really matter which ones?


Well, actually it does, because I knew that Alabama only started allowing them a few years ago. They had been the only state I had ever heard of that outlawed them.

BTW, Indiana does allow them from what I found.

All other regulations pertaining to spring turkey hunting apply (e.g. shot sizes, gauges, non-electironic decoys allowed, no electronic calls, no baiting and no dogs).

http://www.wildturkeyzone.com/hunting/States/indiana.htm

When people make blanket statements, I just like to have some verification. It helps me decide whether their posts are credible.

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#1324899 - 05/12/09 02:28 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: VolDoug]
REN
Good ol' Boys "Team Grizzly"
12 Point


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 5039
Loc: Wilson County, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: VolDoug
 Originally Posted By: REN

does it really matter which ones?


Well, actually it does, because I knew that Alabama only started allowing them a few years ago. They had been the only state I had ever heard of that outlawed them.

BTW, Indiana does allow them from what I found.

All other regulations pertaining to spring turkey hunting apply (e.g. shot sizes, gauges, non-electironic decoys allowed, no electronic calls, no baiting and no dogs).

http://www.wildturkeyzone.com/hunting/States/indiana.htm

When people make blanket statements, I just like to have some verification. It helps me decide whether their posts are credible.


you are correct in the IN, I misread the site I was looking at. I still dont see how it DOES as you put it. Many states HAVE done it so what would be different for a state to do it now. I am not saying you are wrong just not understanding your logic. I mean the spinning wing decoy was legal for duck hunting and now not in alot of places so what is the big difference here?
_________________________
VooDoo Mafia

John 3:16



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#1324943 - 05/12/09 03:19 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
4onaside
12 Point


Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 5070
Loc: Jackson,Tn

Offline
 Originally Posted By: REN
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.
You guys are kidding, right? I don't happen to own a "full strut" decoy, and turkeys do decoy rather easily. Maybe not easily, but certainly improves your odds when the turkey that you are calling actually sees "the turkey" thats making the noise. But, duh, who is going to be the enforcers? I can see it now, a vehicle drives up to my locked gate, and several black clad people pile out and run down my road and into the middle of my set yelling "turkey police!, turkey police!" lol The days of decoys are here, and rescinding their use would not be practical, or even possible for that matter. And my season was great, because the population(at least this year)in my immediate area is great. So from my perspective, problems, what problems? But, if you think that "full strut" dekes are that good, I guarantee that one will be a part of my deal next season. That is, unless they are outlawed. lol



you do know many states still dont allow decoys and it is enforced. I Hunted in Bama my whole life and they were illegal down there and I was checked a number of times while out in the field.
Granted, easy enough to enforce AS LONG AS THEY HAVE NEVER BEEN LEGAL, like Alabama was. But kinda like liquor by the drink. Once its in place it would be the deuce to rescind. Can you imagine the lobbying that would be going on by the decoy manufacturers!
_________________________
Lord, keep your arm around my shoulders and your hand over my mouth


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#1324963 - 05/12/09 03:38 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: turkeyhunter]
LA man
16 Point


Registered: 05/31/03
Posts: 19842
Loc: spencer, tn/houma, la.

Offline
just drop the limit to 3, i would be happy. and for the record i didnt get a single bird this year
_________________________
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#1325013 - 05/12/09 04:35 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
peytoncreekhunter
8 Point


Registered: 07/12/04
Posts: 1098
Loc: Hermitage

Offline
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: bsl
Captain I do rember that you killed turkey in different places last year and 3 in one spot this year.that is not the point.Just seems odd that you keep pushing for lower limits yet keep blasting away.After you fill you tags you talk about taking other people out to fill thier tags.


also if I am wrong about the hatch last year why were there so many jakes killed and passed up this year?Why have you also talked about the good hatch from last year in so many posts?


If anything I should be completely against dropping back as my seasons will last a matter of days versus weeks.

It is not my job nor responsibility to self regulate because the state can't regulate to ensure good flock numbers. If 4 is too many then the limit shouldn't be set so high.



I'm not sure I follow your thinkging CH. Do you mean since you shoot your 4 birds in a matter of days it is OK and if someone else takes all season to shoot 4 birds they are hurting the flock? Isn't 4 dead birds 4 dead birds not matter how long it takes to shoot them.

As far as you shooting 4 birds since that is the limit and you are not going to regulate yourself since the state isn't, does that mean you are going to start shooting spikes during deer season (and not let them mature and reproduce) since the state doesn't regulate the shooting of spikes?

Just trying to figure out what you mean.
_________________________
Vegitarian is an old Indian word that means "Bad Hunter".

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#1325046 - 05/12/09 05:19 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: peytoncreekhunter]
bsl
10 Point


Registered: 12/23/07
Posts: 3506
Loc: knox,tn.

Offline
Very good point peyton.i am sure we will here from him soon on your post.lol
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#1325056 - 05/12/09 05:33 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: 4onaside]
REN
Good ol' Boys "Team Grizzly"
12 Point


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 5039
Loc: Wilson County, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: REN
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.
You guys are kidding, right? I don't happen to own a "full strut" decoy, and turkeys do decoy rather easily. Maybe not easily, but certainly improves your odds when the turkey that you are calling actually sees "the turkey" thats making the noise. But, duh, who is going to be the enforcers? I can see it now, a vehicle drives up to my locked gate, and several black clad people pile out and run down my road and into the middle of my set yelling "turkey police!, turkey police!" lol The days of decoys are here, and rescinding their use would not be practical, or even possible for that matter. And my season was great, because the population(at least this year)in my immediate area is great. So from my perspective, problems, what problems? But, if you think that "full strut" dekes are that good, I guarantee that one will be a part of my deal next season. That is, unless they are outlawed. lol



you do know many states still dont allow decoys and it is enforced. I Hunted in Bama my whole life and they were illegal down there and I was checked a number of times while out in the field.
Granted, easy enough to enforce AS LONG AS THEY HAVE NEVER BEEN LEGAL, like Alabama was. But kinda like liquor by the drink. Once its in place it would be the deuce to rescind. Can you imagine the lobbying that would be going on by the decoy manufacturers!


I am not real sure how alchol and turkey decoys are even in the same ball park? I mean the scale of people between the 2 are not even close not to mention the addictive nature of drinking itself. I have done with and without and don't really care either way but the decoy lobbying I doubt would be an issue. If lobbying for such can be so strong toward regs why are duck hunting companys not changing the way TN currently limits the amout of people that COULD be out doing to just the select few lucky enough to get drawn or the grandfathered in folks
_________________________
VooDoo Mafia

John 3:16



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#1325068 - 05/12/09 05:56 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
bsl
10 Point


Registered: 12/23/07
Posts: 3506
Loc: knox,tn.

Offline
I don't really understand people wanting to ban b mobile type decoys.They are far from a sure thing.I have heard as much bad about them as good.I don't use decoys most of the time but I am not going to push for a ban on them.It seems like another way of people trying to push how they hunt on others.
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#1325175 - 05/12/09 07:50 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: REN]
4onaside
12 Point


Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 5070
Loc: Jackson,Tn

Offline
 Originally Posted By: REN
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: REN
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.
You guys are kidding, right? I don't happen to own a "full strut" decoy, and turkeys do decoy rather easily. Maybe not easily, but certainly improves your odds when the turkey that you are calling actually sees "the turkey" thats making the noise. But, duh, who is going to be the enforcers? I can see it now, a vehicle drives up to my locked gate, and several black clad people pile out and run down my road and into the middle of my set yelling "turkey police!, turkey police!" lol The days of decoys are here, and rescinding their use would not be practical, or even possible for that matter. And my season was great, because the population(at least this year)in my immediate area is great. So from my perspective, problems, what problems? But, if you think that "full strut" dekes are that good, I guarantee that one will be a part of my deal next season. That is, unless they are outlawed. lol



you do know many states still dont allow decoys and it is enforced. I Hunted in Bama my whole life and they were illegal down there and I was checked a number of times while out in the field.
Granted, easy enough to enforce AS LONG AS THEY HAVE NEVER BEEN LEGAL, like Alabama was. But kinda like liquor by the drink. Once its in place it would be the deuce to rescind. Can you imagine the lobbying that would be going on by the decoy manufacturers!


I am not real sure how alchol and turkey decoys are even in the same ball park? I mean the scale of people between the 2 are not even close not to mention the addictive nature of drinking itself. I have done with and without and don't really care either way but the decoy lobbying I doubt would be an issue. If lobbying for such can be so strong toward regs why are duck hunting companys not changing the way TN currently limits the amout of people that COULD be out doing to just the select few lucky enough to get drawn or the grandfathered in folks
 Originally Posted By: REN
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: REN
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.
You guys are kidding, right? I don't happen to own a "full strut" decoy, and turkeys do decoy rather easily. Maybe not easily, but certainly improves your odds when the turkey that you are calling actually sees "the turkey" thats making the noise. But, duh, who is going to be the enforcers? I can see it now, a vehicle drives up to my locked gate, and several black clad people pile out and run down my road and into the middle of my set yelling "turkey police!, turkey police!" lol The days of decoys are here, and rescinding their use would not be practical, or even possible for that matter. And my season was great, because the population(at least this year)in my immediate area is great. So from my perspective, problems, what problems? But, if you think that "full strut" dekes are that good, I guarantee that one will be a part of my deal next season. That is, unless they are outlawed. lol



you do know many states still dont allow decoys and it is enforced. I Hunted in Bama my whole life and they were illegal down there and I was checked a number of times while out in the field.
Granted, easy enough to enforce AS LONG AS THEY HAVE NEVER BEEN LEGAL, like Alabama was. But kinda like liquor by the drink. Once its in place it would be the deuce to rescind. Can you imagine the lobbying that would be going on by the decoy manufacturers!


I am not real sure how alchol and turkey decoys are even in the same ball park? I mean the scale of people between the 2 are not even close not to mention the addictive nature of drinking itself. I have done with and without and don't really care either way but the decoy lobbying I doubt would be an issue. If lobbying for such can be so strong toward regs why are duck hunting companys not changing the way TN currently limits the amout of people that COULD be out doing to just the select few lucky enough to get drawn or the grandfathered in folks
Sorry man, the point was that once something is in place, it is very difficult to change it. I lived in Memphis most of my life and liquor by the drink was voted on several times and it failed. Then after being on the ballot again, and again it passed. It has never been voted on since, a done deal. It will never be voted on again. That's the correlation between alcohol and turkey regs. Once anything is in place it is very difficult to undo. Fortunately, I doubt if the people who make the turkey regs would be swayed by two or three guys on a forum who think that it would be a good idea to ban dekes, as opposed to thousands who enjoy using them.
_________________________
Lord, keep your arm around my shoulders and your hand over my mouth


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#1325177 - 05/12/09 07:51 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: bsl]
Huntaholic
8 Point


Registered: 10/22/00
Posts: 2087
Loc: Baxter, TN. U.S.A.

Offline
Im with captain hook, if the limit is 4 then Im gonna do my damned best to kill 4. The difference is WHERE I kill them! I wish it would go back to 2 and 2! Last year here at the house I was seeing 16 lbs and 13 jakes prior to opening day. We killed 6 here last year. All summer long I was seeing anywhere from 20 to 100 hens and poults a day here in the yard. Fall came and they were GONE. They never came back either. Im convinced they DIED. This year there was 5 lbs and 6 jakes here. I let 1 lb and 1 jake be killed. There has NEVER been a hen killed here spring or fall. I wont allow it. I was around in the days before there were turkeys anywhere around here, and keeping those hens is the key to the future.
_________________________
" I reckon so"
TnDeer's resident logger
Turpin Custom Game Calls Pro-staff

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#1325202 - 05/12/09 08:08 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: turkeyhunter]
easy45
Non-Typical


Registered: 11/06/07
Posts: 28216
Loc: Chester County

Offline
4 is too many but we can only take one either sex during the fall, how is that a high limit
_________________________
Work to live, Live to hunt

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#1325298 - 05/12/09 08:54 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: easy45]
warrent423
6 Point


Registered: 09/11/07
Posts: 634
Loc: Tenn. McMinn, Athens

Offline
Plenty of gobblers left to hunt fer next year in south cherokee. Huntin pressure garantee's it. I ain't got to hear turkeys gobble to know they are their. As fer private farms and leases, those turkeys don't mean sh## to me.
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#1325311 - 05/12/09 08:59 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Huntaholic]
bsl
10 Point


Registered: 12/23/07
Posts: 3506
Loc: knox,tn.

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Huntaholic
Im with captain hook, if the limit is 4 then Im gonna do my damned best to kill 4. The difference is WHERE I kill them! I wish it would go back to 2 and 2! Last year here at the house I was seeing 16 lbs and 13 jakes prior to opening day. We killed 6 here last year. All summer long I was seeing anywhere from 20 to 100 hens and poults a day here in the yard. Fall came and they were GONE. They never came back either. Im convinced they DIED. This year there was 5 lbs and 6 jakes here. I let 1 lb and 1 jake be killed. There has NEVER been a hen killed here spring or fall. I wont allow it. I was around in the days before there were turkeys anywhere around here, and keeping those hens is the key to the future.



you had 100 hens and poults get killed during the fall season?Or are you talking about poachers?there is no way legal hunters killed all of those hens during the fall.did you ever think that maybe the turkey moved on to greener pasture.Unless you have a big poaching problem those turkey are still around somewhere.Maybe just not in your yard.

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#1325791 - 05/13/09 09:08 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: bsl]
REN
Good ol' Boys "Team Grizzly"
12 Point


Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 5039
Loc: Wilson County, TN

Offline
I hear you 4onaside, I am not really for or against banning decs just trying to see your side is all. Personally I could care less if they did or didnt because I have hunted in states where I couldnt use them and ones that you can so to me I could do either.
_________________________
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John 3:16



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#1326097 - 05/13/09 01:25 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: bsl]
Huntaholic
8 Point


Registered: 10/22/00
Posts: 2087
Loc: Baxter, TN. U.S.A.

Offline
 Originally Posted By: bsl
 Originally Posted By: Huntaholic
Im with captain hook, if the limit is 4 then Im gonna do my damned best to kill 4. The difference is WHERE I kill them! I wish it would go back to 2 and 2! Last year here at the house I was seeing 16 lbs and 13 jakes prior to opening day. We killed 6 here last year. All summer long I was seeing anywhere from 20 to 100 hens and poults a day here in the yard. Fall came and they were GONE. They never came back either. Im convinced they DIED. This year there was 5 lbs and 6 jakes here. I let 1 lb and 1 jake be killed. There has NEVER been a hen killed here spring or fall. I wont allow it. I was around in the days before there were turkeys anywhere around here, and keeping those hens is the key to the future.



you had 100 hens and poults get killed during the fall season?Or are you talking about poachers?there is no way legal hunters killed all of those hens during the fall.did you ever think that maybe the turkey moved on to greener pasture.Unless you have a big poaching problem those turkey are still around somewhere.Maybe just not in your yard.

If they were ANYWHERE around I would know about it. ;\) Wanna know what I think has happened to our turkey population, not just here, but in pockets all across the state? Im all but convinced some type of disease hit them and decimated the population in some areas. Just like EHD did to the deer herd in places, Im all but sure something along those lines is what happened to our turkey population.
_________________________
" I reckon so"
TnDeer's resident logger
Turpin Custom Game Calls Pro-staff

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#1326244 - 05/13/09 03:36 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: easy45]
Huntaholic
8 Point


Registered: 10/22/00
Posts: 2087
Loc: Baxter, TN. U.S.A.

Offline
 Originally Posted By: easy45
4 is too many but we can only take one either sex during the fall, how is that a high limit

Some of the counties allow ,ultiple birds per permit. in addition to that, all leftover permits go on sale after the draw and you can buy as many as you want to. I know some guys who have had as many as 9 permits each and they kill em by the truck full!
_________________________
" I reckon so"
TnDeer's resident logger
Turpin Custom Game Calls Pro-staff

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#1326287 - 05/13/09 04:11 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Huntaholic]
Wes Parrish
16 Point


Registered: 06/12/02
Posts: 18645
Loc: Knoxville-Dover-Union City, TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Huntaholic
Wanna know what I think has happened to our turkey population, not just here, but in pockets all across the state? Im all but convinced some type of disease hit them and decimated the population in some areas. Just like EHD did to the deer herd in places, Im all but sure something along those lines is what happened to our turkey population.

In some areas, that "disease" has been aflatoxin.
The worse news is that the prevalence of aflatoxin killing turkeys will likely get worse each year until more awareness is raised.

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#1326312 - 05/13/09 04:52 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Huntaholic]
megalomaniac
12 Point


Registered: 10/28/05
Posts: 5027
Loc: Mississippi

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Huntaholic
 Originally Posted By: easy45
4 is too many but we can only take one either sex during the fall, how is that a high limit

Some of the counties allow ,ultiple birds per permit. in addition to that, all leftover permits go on sale after the draw and you can buy as many as you want to. I know some guys who have had as many as 9 permits each and they kill em by the truck full!


I've heard a report secondhand from the county next door's gamewarden that one fellow took 40-something turkeys last fall with leftover permits off one localized area!!!

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#1326332 - 05/13/09 05:22 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: megalomaniac]
Bohuntr
TnDeer Old Timer
Spike


Registered: 01/06/00
Posts: 81
Loc: Lebanon, TN, USA

Offline
From the TWRA harvest data, is it possible for us to know how many hunters took 4 turkeys, how many took 3, and so on? That would be interesting to know.
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#1326543 - 05/13/09 08:15 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: stik]
SHARPSPUR
4 Point


Registered: 07/17/07
Posts: 148
Loc: East TN

Offline
 Originally Posted By: stik
i know this is the turkey forum and this post will not be liked here but i wish it was year 'round season- no limit. acorn-eating feathered rats. i wish turkeys could be eradicated from my hunting areas.


stik, Please let me know where your hunting lease is and I will do all I can to get them gone. \:\/

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#1326690 - 05/13/09 10:16 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: megalomaniac]
4onaside
12 Point


Registered: 02/07/06
Posts: 5070
Loc: Jackson,Tn

Offline
 Originally Posted By: megalomaniac
 Originally Posted By: Huntaholic
 Originally Posted By: easy45
4 is too many but we can only take one either sex during the fall, how is that a high limit

Some of the counties allow ,ultiple birds per permit. in addition to that, all leftover permits go on sale after the draw and you can buy as many as you want to. I know some guys who have had as many as 9 permits each and they kill em by the truck full!


I've heard a report secondhand from the county next door's gamewarden that one fellow took 40-something turkeys last fall with leftover permits off one localized area!!!
Assuming that is a fact, three things: #1, there is(at least was) a great population in that area, #2, the guy is a game hog, and #3, he is also a heckuva turkey hunter.
_________________________
Lord, keep your arm around my shoulders and your hand over my mouth


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#1330904 - 05/17/09 09:31 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: 4onaside]
captain hook
10 Point


Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 4340
Loc: Knoxville

Offline
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.
You guys are kidding, right? I don't happen to own a "full strut" decoy, and turkeys do decoy rather easily. Maybe not easily, but certainly improves your odds when the turkey that you are calling actually sees "the turkey" thats making the noise. But, duh, who is going to be the enforcers? I can see it now, a vehicle drives up to my locked gate, and several black clad people pile out and run down my road and into the middle of my set yelling "turkey police!, turkey police!" lol The days of decoys are here, and rescinding their use would not be practical, or even possible for that matter. And my season was great, because the population(at least this year)in my immediate area is great. So from my perspective, problems, what problems? But, if you think that "full strut" dekes are that good, I guarantee that one will be a part of my deal next season. That is, unless they are outlawed. lol


I am serious, killing a field turkey with a strutter decoy is the easiest form of hunting I have seen in my life. It honestly is a joke.

I used to hunt AL since I lived so close in Miss, and it was nothing to get stopped by GW's on the road in bama and have them inquire and even look for decoys. Or wait for you at the gate. It was a dark day when they legalized decoys in that state, and was the last season I leased/hunted AL for turkeys. For me and many others the cradle of turkey hunting was tainted when the rules were changed.
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#1330911 - 05/17/09 09:38 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: peytoncreekhunter]
captain hook
10 Point


Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 4340
Loc: Knoxville

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 Originally Posted By: peytoncreekhunter
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: bsl
Captain I do rember that you killed turkey in different places last year and 3 in one spot this year.that is not the point.Just seems odd that you keep pushing for lower limits yet keep blasting away.After you fill you tags you talk about taking other people out to fill thier tags.


also if I am wrong about the hatch last year why were there so many jakes killed and passed up this year?Why have you also talked about the good hatch from last year in so many posts?


If anything I should be completely against dropping back as my seasons will last a matter of days versus weeks.

It is not my job nor responsibility to self regulate because the state can't regulate to ensure good flock numbers. If 4 is too many then the limit shouldn't be set so high.



I'm not sure I follow your thinkging CH. Do you mean since you shoot your 4 birds in a matter of days it is OK and if someone else takes all season to shoot 4 birds they are hurting the flock? Isn't 4 dead birds 4 dead birds not matter how long it takes to shoot them.

As far as you shooting 4 birds since that is the limit and you are not going to regulate yourself since the state isn't, does that mean you are going to start shooting spikes during deer season (and not let them mature and reproduce) since the state doesn't regulate the shooting of spikes?

Just trying to figure out what you mean.


I mean that the 4 bird limit is causing far too many birds to be killed each spring, especially jakes which is effecting the hunting statewide as evidenced by the decline in harvests since it's inception. Combine it with our liberal fall seasons and the handwriting is clear on the wall.

Sure I kill 4 birds, and have since the limit was changed. If the state is so convinced it is a good thing then why should I alter my hunting?

If the limit was 100 it wouldn't effect me or the birds I hunt. Most of the birds I hunt never get hunted, and those that do couldn't kill one if their life depended on it, unless they used bait.

If I shot 3 spikes each season it would effect my hunting. If I shoot 1 longbeard in Scott Cty, 1 in Claiborne, and 2 in Campbell it will not have any adverse effect from year to year based on how spread out my harvests are.

I also think that most people do not shoot 4 birds, but the high limit devalues each tag and thus results in more jakes getting shot which in turn effects the numbers of mature gobblers in the flock as a whole.

The 4 bird limit would be fine, but cap the jake limit at 1, and things would even out. Also, drop the fall seasons, or make them hen only.

Turkey season setting should be dynamic and change based on flock condition, however due to the lack of foresight at the state level we set regs before we know anything about hatches or harvests, and it is a recipe for disaster.
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#1330953 - 05/17/09 10:27 PM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: captain hook]
bsl
10 Point


Registered: 12/23/07
Posts: 3506
Loc: knox,tn.

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 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.
You guys are kidding, right? I don't happen to own a "full strut" decoy, and turkeys do decoy rather easily. Maybe not easily, but certainly improves your odds when the turkey that you are calling actually sees "the turkey" thats making the noise. But, duh, who is going to be the enforcers? I can see it now, a vehicle drives up to my locked gate, and several black clad people pile out and run down my road and into the middle of my set yelling "turkey police!, turkey police!" lol The days of decoys are here, and rescinding their use would not be practical, or even possible for that matter. And my season was great, because the population(at least this year)in my immediate area is great. So from my perspective, problems, what problems? But, if you think that "full strut" dekes are that good, I guarantee that one will be a part of my deal next season. That is, unless they are outlawed. lol


I am serious, killing a field turkey with a strutter decoy is the easiest form of hunting I have seen in my life. It honestly is a joke.

I used to hunt AL since I lived so close in Miss, and it was nothing to get stopped by GW's on the road in bama and have them inquire and even look for decoys. Or wait for you at the gate. It was a dark day when they legalized decoys in that state, and was the last season I leased/hunted AL for turkeys. For me and many others the cradle of turkey hunting was tainted when the rules were changed.



Decoys are not a sure thing.I have read where people have had as many turkey spook from strut decoys as they have brought in.It is a joke to say they are a sure thing or make it unfair for the turkey.I don't use decoys much but most of my friends do and they don't have gobblers run in to thier gobbler decoys.What a joke thinking it is the end of turkey hunting.

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#1331017 - 05/18/09 05:39 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: Bohuntr]
captain hook
10 Point


Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 4340
Loc: Knoxville

Offline
 Originally Posted By: Bohuntr
From the TWRA harvest data, is it possible for us to know how many hunters took 4 turkeys, how many took 3, and so on? That would be interesting to know.


It is possible to say how many killed X turkeys, but it is irrelevant because we do not have any idea how many turkey hunters there are statewide.
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#1331019 - 05/18/09 05:42 AM Re: 2009 Harvest Totals [Re: bsl]
captain hook
10 Point


Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 4340
Loc: Knoxville

Offline
 Originally Posted By: bsl
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: 4onaside
 Originally Posted By: captain hook
 Originally Posted By: deerlawyer
outlaw decoys.



Yes, yes and yes. Especially the full strut decoys, IMO they are causing an excessive number of birds to die that normally would not and allowing hunters who normally would get culled to fill tags. Thus further damaging a population that in many places is on its heels.
You guys are kidding, right? I don't happen to own a "full strut" decoy, and turkeys do decoy rather easily. Maybe not easily, but certainly improves your odds when the turkey that you are calling actually sees "the turkey" thats making the noise. But, duh, who is going to be the enforcers? I can see it now, a vehicle drives up to my locked gate, and several black clad people pile out and run down my road and into the middle of my set yelling "turkey police!, turkey police!" lol The days of decoys are here, and rescinding their use would not be practical, or even possible for that matter. And my season was great, because the population(at least this year)in my immediate area is great. So from my perspective, problems, what problems? But, if you think that "full strut" dekes are that good, I guarantee that one will be a part of my deal next season. That is, unless they are outlawed. lol


I am serious, killing a field turkey with a strutter decoy is the easiest form of hunting I have seen in my life. It honestly is a joke.

I used to hunt AL since I lived so close in Miss, and it was nothing to get stopped by GW's on the road in bama and have them inquire and even look for decoys. Or wait for you at the gate. It was a dark day when they legalized decoys in that state, and was the last season I leased/hunted AL for turkeys. For me and many others the cradle of turkey hunting was tainted when the rules were changed.



Decoys are not a sure thing.I have read where people have had as many turkey spook from strut decoys as they have brought in.It is a joke to say they are a sure thing or make it unfair for the turkey.I don't use decoys much but most of my friends do and they don't have gobblers run in to thier gobbler decoys.What a joke thinking it is the end of turkey hunting.


I have heard of the rare bird which shys away, but it is certainly the exception. I am not saying it is ruining turkey hunting, but it certainly has changed it to deer hunting with decoys for many folks. Many folks are killing more birds now because of the full strut decoys, not because of skill but because of a product then ever before. It is a joke, bottom line, if you need a piece of plastic to bring your birds to you then why bother? My question would be, do these folks know how or what it is to hear a bird, move to a good set-up, and call that bird down the gun barrel? I would say some do, but many would be clueless.
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