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#1200611 - 02/25/09 01:18 PM Re: Caney Fork [Re: bob]
bowriter
Non-Typical


Registered: 08/31/02
Posts: 42055
Loc: Lebanon,TN USA

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Bob! Son!!! Your Mother was just lovely back then. But why did you have to let that motel go to he11. Buddy Mason would have bought it.
_________________________

Constipation has ruined many a good day. Not as many as stupidity, though.

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#1200623 - 02/25/09 01:23 PM Re: Caney Fork [Re: gil1]
B.D.
8 Point


Registered: 03/24/08
Posts: 1484
Loc: Hendersonville TN

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 Originally Posted By: gil1

See, to me, there's nothing like catching a fish. Killing them hurts the fishing. Obviously, I'm very selfish about fishing.


I am going to disagree that killing a few fish automatically hurts the fishing. There is, after all, a limited carrying capacity to the river. TWRA puts what, an average of about 115,000 rainbows and 30,000 browns a year in the river? Now, obviously a lot of those disappear without ever seeing a fisherman. Some of those get eaten by herons, ospreys, minks, stripers, walleye, and other trout; many die of natural causes; and a few wander off into the Cumberland where it gets too warm (I caught a rainbow in Cordell Hull tailrace last spring). But whatever way you slice it, that's a lot of trout going into the river. If we had NO harvest, we'd have to cut back the stocking rate, or eventually we'd have a lot of overcrowded, skinny trout.

Now, there have to be limits. There is enough pressure on the river that without any regulation at all, it would get all but wiped out. But clearly there is a sustainable level of harvest where you don't hurt the overall numbers, because the fish going in = the fish going out.

At that point the only debate is over which fish are harvested. Everybody pretty much agrees that the trout in the Caney grow around 4" a year. Thus, a 15" rainbow has been there around a year and a half on average, depending on how big he was when he went in.

I don't have a problem harvesting that fish. Everything I've seen tells me we have plenty of fish holding over a year or two, so there is a large cohort of fish to replace that rainbow if he's harvested.

A 24" brown, on the other hand, is different. I would rather limit harvest of those fish. Browns go in as fingerlings at about 6", so it takes nearly 5 years to grow a fish to that size, and there are fewer browns going in to begin with. When one that size goes out, there are a lot fewer fish in the next tier down to replace it.

bd

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#1200641 - 02/25/09 01:42 PM Re: Caney Fork [Re: B.D.]
bob
4 Point


Registered: 04/18/08
Posts: 116
Loc: tn

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Pop,, that you. Where the HE-double tooth picks have you been!
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#1200664 - 02/25/09 02:04 PM Re: Caney Fork [Re: B.D.]
gil1
12 Point


Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 6339
Loc: Nashville, TN

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It's all a gray area with no real answers, just preferences and opinions. I wasn't saying your keeping a couple dozen 14-inchers a year makes a big dent. I say it makes a ding. Just like the ospreys and otters and everything else. I also say that it's a culmination of little dings that makes a dent. Like I said, I've dinged a little in my time, too. Although I've never kept a Caney trout, and I've caught many thousands by now.

Now, you stated that there have to be limits and the only debate is over which fish are to be harvested. Except your forgetting about those that believe in catch and release. So you save money and don't stock as many fish. The fishing's world class, and I don't give a crap about eating them, so that's absolutely perfect.

Yeah, I know. Impractical. Too many people want to kill their fish for that to ever work unless it's a private stream. Still, I completely disagree that there are enough 15-inch trout in the river. I'm sort of kidding, but there could never be enough.

I can't imagine sacrificing the catching of a 15-inch trout just to eat it. Never in a zillion years would I harvest a 15-incher on the Caney. That's just too big of a sacrifice just to feed hunger. If I were hungry, I would feel differently, but I am lucky that I can afford to eat at McD's if I am hungry. Again, I'm selfishly into fishing.

That's my own code. I don't have any misgivings toward you or anyone else for filling your bellies. I'd just rather catch than eat.
_________________________
It is not the killing ...; it is the contest of skill and cunning. The true hunter counts his achievement in proportion to the effort involved and the fairness of the sport.

Dr. Saxton Pope

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#1200741 - 02/25/09 03:14 PM Re: Caney Fork [Re: bob]
bowriter
Non-Typical


Registered: 08/31/02
Posts: 42055
Loc: Lebanon,TN USA

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 Originally Posted By: bob
Pop,, that you. Where the HE-double tooth picks have you been!


I've been devising an advertising campaign for Dick Sampson to sell shine out of his store. Odell kept us froze out for years.
_________________________

Constipation has ruined many a good day. Not as many as stupidity, though.

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#1200917 - 02/25/09 05:14 PM Re: Caney Fork [Re: B.D.]
madMax
4 Point


Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 130
Loc: Middle TN

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 Originally Posted By: gil1
I can't imagine sacrificing the catching of a 15-inch trout just to eat it. Never in a zillion years would I harvest a 15-incher on the Caney.


So there you have two ends of the opinionated spectrum. You have someone like Gil on one end, and people like Tubs on the other. Some fisherman are strictly C & R - others are catch and eat eat eat. The other 90% of us fall somewhere in between. There-in lies the real question...

 Originally Posted By: Brian Dunigan
At that point the only debate is over which fish are harvested.


Great question! The answer? I say we just let Bowriter decide. Since he started this mess 25 years ago its about time he cleans it all up! I say you and Buffalo Bob get together with the new TWRA commissioner and settle this dispute once and for all....

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#1200967 - 02/25/09 05:57 PM Re: Caney Fork [Re: B.D.]
shorefisherman
6 Point


Registered: 04/07/08
Posts: 624
Loc: West SSiiide Putnam Co.

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\:D \:D .................. \:D
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Down in a hollor....son

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#1201205 - 02/25/09 07:55 PM Re: Caney Fork [Re: B.D.]
go_okfishin
6 Point


Registered: 12/14/03
Posts: 700
Loc: Bellevue

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What if every trout caught was guaranteed to die, would you still fish? Kind of like duck hunting there ain't no either or. They are dead or they are not.
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always lookin

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#1201758 - 02/26/09 07:19 AM Re: Caney Fork [Re: go_okfishin]
bowriter
Non-Typical


Registered: 08/31/02
Posts: 42055
Loc: Lebanon,TN USA

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Not being a farmer, I have never harvested a fish. I have caught and eaten a lot of them. I don't eat trout. Don't like them so unless someone wants a mess. I throw them all back.

But my philosophy is quite simple. When it is legal, I will keep and eat any dam fish I want. Everybody else can do what they like. I shoot small bucks and I eat 12 inch fish. I make no appolgies to anyone about it.
_________________________

Constipation has ruined many a good day. Not as many as stupidity, though.

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#1202068 - 02/26/09 09:42 AM Re: Caney Fork [Re: bowriter]
gil1
12 Point


Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 6339
Loc: Nashville, TN

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 Originally Posted By: bowriter
Not being a farmer, I have never harvested a fish. I have caught and eaten a lot of them. I don't eat trout. Don't like them so unless someone wants a mess. I throw them all back.

But my philosophy is quite simple. When it is legal, I will keep and eat any dam fish I want. Everybody else can do what they like. I shoot small bucks and I eat 12 inch fish. I make no appolgies to anyone about it.


To be clear about my position, I don't hink anyone should apologize for puttin' the Dr. Kevorkian on anything legally. I kill the hell out of lots of stuff. I just pick my spots, I guess.
_________________________
It is not the killing ...; it is the contest of skill and cunning. The true hunter counts his achievement in proportion to the effort involved and the fairness of the sport.

Dr. Saxton Pope

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