Long read...Fred Trost...using/not using scents

Coach

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"One of my favorite series Fred ran on Michigan Outdoors was the investigation on the doe-in-heat and scent manufacturers. I wrote and posted this years ago on Usenet in various forms to counter the claims of the doe-in-heat and cover scents.

In the early 1990�s Fred Trost was interested in finding out what was in those bottles of doe-in-heat scent being sold. He investigated the largest manufacturer of scents, Buck Stop Lure Company, located in Michigan, and found out they were making blatantly false advertising claims about their products. In his magazine, Fred Trost's Outdoor Digest, he ran a series of articles detailing the investigation of the scent industry.

Fred visited the Buck Stop plant in Stanton, Michigan for a tour with cameras and film equipment in tow. Apparently Buck Stop had no idea about this investigation, and proceeded to give a full blown tour of the plant. They probably thought this would be good for free advertising on the most popular hunting and fishing PBS show in Michigan. The Buck Stop spokesman said they started their own farm in 1970 began breeding enough animals to collect doe-in-heat urine for their operation. Buck Stop claimed they collect urine from a doe one day in October, and one day in November. But since a doe produces 2 quarts of urine per day (on the average) while in heat, this means only one gallon of urine per doe in a year. Buck Stop was bottling 42 gallons of their doe-in-heat scent an hour. The spokesman said that the location of the farm is kept secret for security reasons. But by using simple math, this would require a ridiculously large deer herd.

In Michigan, any person or company must have a permit from the Department of Natural Resources to have wild animals in captivity. After the DNR's records were found for Buck's Stop farm, this what was printed about in the Fred�s Outdoor Digest about the farm, "According to DNR records: 30 whitetail deer, 2 elk, 1 black bear, 15 foxes, and 6 coyotes. And that's it. That's the farm that supposedly supplies the leading manufacturer of scent products in the country. In fact, it would take 336 does in captivity to supply the Buck Stop factory for just one 8-hour shift. And to run their bottling process for six months, it would take 43,000 different does."

A dozen of different doe-in-heat products (Robbins, Tinks, Buck Stop, Superior, ect) from different companies were sent to McCrone Associates Laboratory to see what was really in them. A sample of real deer urine was tested to be 95% water and 5% urea solids, so all the products should of had the same composition. Needless to say, they didn't. Many had less than the normal amount of urea, and had other chemicals such as glycol and glycerin in them. For example, The Outdoor Digest reported these results about Buck Stop's 200 Proof doe-in-heat lure, "2 to 2-1/2% solids, most of which are unrelated to deer urine..appear to be glycol related and interfere with detection of urea." The label on the "200 Proof" says its collected during the hottest five hours of a whitetail doe's 26 hour estrus period. But in reality it is 99-3/4% water and glycol. Some of the products tested had up to 4-1/2% solids, but it is highly questionable if they actually came from deer. 50 LB bags of dried urea are readily available from fertilizer companies, and when mixed with the proper amount of water, will mimic urine.

Fred also explained about the stories of how that buck followed the trail of doe-in-heat someone put down. The cause of this behavior can be explained simply because it is a different smell in the woods, and the deer is merely being curious.

Fred really hammered the industry and said a lot of disparaging (but true) statements about Buck Stop and the other scent manufactures. Buck Stop then sued Fred/Michigan Outdoors for slander/libel and won the case with a 2 million (?) judgment. I believe the Buck Stop filed for a Trade Secret stipulation which prevented Fred from revealing the results of the court recorded statements of the manufacturer. A lot of the evidence Fred had was ruled inadmissible in court because Buck Stop�s attorneys got it all ruled as a trade secret. Fred really got a raw deal out of the court case. It shows that any large company with deep pockets can afford the best ambulance chasers there is and win a case. It doesn't matter if they are guilty or not, the better attorney can win the case. This court case was what prompted Fred to get his law degree due the poor representation he had.

Fred regrouped after the loss of the court case and started a new show, The Practical Outdoorsman. I noticed that everything that he put in the new building was on loan, such as mounts, displays, ect., so they could not be taken just in case of another court case.

Later on, Fred investigated the myth that human urine, man-made perfumes, predator urine, or scents not normally present in nature will scare off deer. On his show, he took his own urine (a few hours a steak dinner) in an area frequented by wild deer to see if it would scare them off. The deer came right up to the urine and were not scared by it. In addition to the human urine, a bottle of Aqua Velva aftershave, and a quart of ammonia were dumped on the ground. A buck came up and sniffed both the ammonia and aftershave, and was not alarmed. One small buck even started licking the grass where the urine was dumped. This explanation was given, "But why doesn't this human urine scare them? Because urine, from any animal is primarily urea filtered from the blood and doesn't contain any clues as to what the animal has been eating."

Before I saw this show, I used to climb out of my tree stand and walk downwind about a hundred yards just to pee. This was done out of fear that my urine would scare off the deer. Now if the urge to pee comes, I just go from the tree stand or blind. I have had deer walk over my urine and even sniff it without being alarmed."

RIP Fred, I learned a lot from you.
 

tn droptine

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And like stated in another thread, not only do these big companies have a ton of money to afford the best lawyers, they also have a ton of money to pay people to post positive reviews of their products on websites to get other people to buy them
 

Coach

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"I remember that Fred Trost tested three liquids 1)his urine, 2) a bottle of ammonia and 3) a bottle of commercial buck lure, (something like Tinks). The bucks came to the pee most often, the bottle of ammonia was second place for visits and the buck lure came in last."
 

bowriter

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Fred was quite a guy. We took up a collection to help him out during the MI Deer and Turkey Spectacular. The trial really wiped him out.
 

Coach

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bowriter said:
Fred was quite a guy. We took up a collection to help him out during the MI Deer and Turkey Spectacular. The trial really wiped him out.

I only met him once when my son and I was on his show. Honestly, I couldn't tell if I liked him or not but I didn't dislike him. He had a good way about him with my son who was about 10 or 11 at the time. But, he definitely had a really rough row to hoe the last few years of his life.
 

bowriter

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I was on his show twice. He was a different kinda guy on the show than off. Truth is, I didn't really care for him but I didn't really dislike him either. We got along fine on the show.
 

Coach

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Well, for a guy who seemed rather intelligent to me he neglected to have a will...so, his wife and his son (her step son) have been fighting it out in court and apparently, this year she won. So, possibly another lesson from Fred...get yourself a will.
 

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