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Bh209 question

TN Muzzleloader Talk

Bh209 question

Postby Harold Money jr » Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:17 am

Our Accuras (my kids and mine) shoot most accurately and consistently after a fouling shot. I keep them semi dirty or fouled through deer season, then after season like Sunday night they get a good scrubbing. I shoot 777 fffg and am running low, so I have considered trying some bh209 in my accuras. It apparently comes with a significant cash investment due to new breech plugs needing to be purchased and new primers. So before I invest in the powder, plugs, and primers I’m researching as much as possible. I’m happy with 777 it does wonderfully for what I want and could easily buy another bottle and keep going but, so many have stated as to the superiority of bh209 I thought I really needed to consider it.
I have a friend who doesn’t know much about muzzleloaders tell me that it takes 12-13 shots for the shots to settle in to good groups (he does this several times a season with premium bullets too!! Lol), which is consistent with what I have read from others on different forums. I’ve worried with the stuff being so clean this might be the case. I’m not in to shooting close to 2000gr of expensive powder and a 2 dozen or more primers each season with our guns. I understand it’s much cleaner, more powerful, harder to ignite, much less corrosive and about the same price per shot as 777 I’m curious as to what real world experience y’all have with it?
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Re: Bh209 question

Postby Dully » Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:22 am

Read spurhunters post right below yours
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Re: Bh209 question

Postby 451LRML » Thu Nov 15, 2018 8:10 am

100fps faster with BH209 vs 777 according to their respective websites. Cleanup will take the same time as there is residue with both. Only thing I’ve found easier - no crud ring and you can load/shoot multiple shots without wiping.
BH209 will require you to spend some $ and it’s a little more temperamental.
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Re: Bh209 question

Postby iowavf » Thu Nov 15, 2018 8:40 am

Getting rid of the crud ring for me and to be able to shoot at least eighteen times without any swabbing and is shoots the same as the first shot no matter if the barrel was clean or not. With 777 I had my Encore sighted in with a dirty barrel because it does shoot different with a clean barrel versus a dirty barrel and I didn't want to get a wet/dry patch cleaning while in the field hunting especially when it around zero or colder during late season. I don't think blackhorn is as acceptable to moisture as 777, but that's just my opinion. I clean mine in the garage and not having to go into the house and get some hot soapy water for cleanup is nice. PS, I don't think Blackhorn has anything to do with the issue your friend is having. If his 1st three shot group is not tight, try adding 5gr or reducing 5gr of powder and see what the group does. It's a ML and they have their sweet spot of powder and bullet combo they like. Might try a different sabot, or it could just be the rest or even he might be flinching.
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Re: Bh209 question

Postby CHRIS WILSON » Thu Nov 15, 2018 9:07 am

I went from Triple 7 to BH209 last season and have done a good bit of shooting at the range just playing with different bullets and such. I wouldn't necessarily say BH209 is cleaner but the fouling that it produces is much, much finer and no where near as gritty as Triple 7. I shoot a CVA Optima V2 and I notice it is easier to get the second and third bullets down the barrel. With Triple 7, that third shot at the range was always a chore to load but in reality, I've never had to load a third shot when out in the field hunting. Ignition has never been an issue in my rifle. I swapped out the breech plug and use CCI magnum primers. It's always gone bang even in really cold temps. Accuracy has been good starting off with a clean bore. Shooting 100 gr. by volume of BH209 and using a 250 gr. Barnes TEZ, my optima will typically put the first two shots into an inch. The third shot will usually open the group up to around 1.5" or so. I can easily live with that. As for BH209 being more powerful than Triple 7....I've read mixed results about that online from individuals who've actually chronographed the two powders side by side. https://www.huntingnet.com/forum/black-powder/362827-interesting-blackhorn-triple-seven-velocity-comparison.html. Seem to be a few variables that factor into how BH209 performs. Also have read mixed reviews about the corrosive properties of BH209. I'm not convinced that it's really any more or less corrosive than Triple 7. I tend to be a stickler for cleaning my firearms so I've never really let one sit long enough after shooting to test the issue. Honestly, If it wasn't for the crud ring issue, I'd probably still be shooting Triple 7.
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Re: Bh209 question

Postby Harold Money jr » Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:09 am

Thank you gentlemen for the detailed responses. I can tell y’all know muzzleloaders and addressed issues that I was wondering about. It occurred to me that I have been shooting muzzleloaders for 29 years and have pretty set ways I do things with them. I have cap guns that only use black powder and my 209 inlines pretty much use 777. I have one #11 shooting inline that uses the last of my pyrodex. None of them shoot first clean shot and 2nd dirty shot closer than 4” at 100yds although 2,3,4 shots will be tightly packed together. That’s the way it has consistently been since I started popping caps and on to 209 shooting inlines. So may be out with the old and in with the new.
It sounds like the prefouling ritual is gone with bh209. Since it shoots cleaner the first and third shots are gonna hit the same. We can load a perfectly clean muzzleloader and expect it to hit accurately. That will be a plus! It apparently shoots a bit hotter, in my opinion that is a very negligible improvement. We can load less by weight or volume and shoot the same velocity. It doesn’t clean up with water and bit of soap, We must use a hoppes 9 type product for cleanup. It’s apparently much much harder to ignite than previous powders. Boy there are definitely pros and cons!! I guess the negative for 777 is the crud ring, I really like how a water, alcohol or windex patch will clean it out. Pyrodex is simply corrosive and attracts moisture but cleans up easily. Black powder fires easiest by far, is dirtier but cleans up easy as well. It’s getting harder to just drop by the nearest store to buy bp. Choices choices!!! It’s a great time to be shooting a muzzleloader.
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Re: Bh209 question

Postby iowavf » Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:57 am

When cleaning after using blackhorn, I found if you run a couple dry patches 1st it will remove just about all the black residue from the barrel before using the Hoppes #9 cleaning solution and makes it a little less messier.
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Re: Bh209 question

Postby CHRIS WILSON » Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:38 am

iowavf wrote:When cleaning after using blackhorn, I found if you run a couple dry patches 1st it will remove just about all the black residue from the barrel before using the Hoppes #9 cleaning solution and makes it a little less messier.


I do the same thing. I run a few dry patches through the barrel before running a couple of wet patches soaked with Hoppes through it.
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Re: Bh209 question

Postby Yotekiller011 » Mon Nov 19, 2018 7:03 am

I've useds BH209 for years and had great success in aThompson Encore. Switched last year to a CVA Accura V2 and have had alot of trouble with finding the right combo in the CVA. Last year i tried several different loads and thought the gun held the most consistent groups was110grn. with a 245 powerbelt. Why powerbelt? , because i had like three packs and didnt want to waist. My Thompson Encore shot max loads great and accurate , i never had a deer run very far if not drop where it was shot. This year i used the same combo, shot a small doe 85lbs. on friday (last day of muzzleload) at 45 yrds I had a rest aim, but the bullet hit about 4 inchs back and i didnt get a pass through it hit a rib and obviously broke it and did kill the deer after it walk about 60 yrds and stood then laid down, then about 5 minutes later died. TOO LONG! Please know this IMO was not a good combination of a load. Ive heard 275, 300 barnes shoots best with bh209. I like bh209 its clean and shot great out of my TC encore but this CVA accura V2 is a different animal, gotta go back to the drawing board and find the right magnum load bh209 with the right bullet. Ill not shoot another animal with this gun until i get the gun shooting accurant and hard hitting and ballistically correct to get the job done. Did not mean to hijack your post but looking for help too with this CVA accura V2 and thought this might help in what combo not to shoot. :lol: Alot of knowledgeable members on here that might be able to help.
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